if oscar is an atg..then isnt judah aswell??

[BillyBoxing]

Mr. Fantastic...you obviously just started watching the sport. I can't believe what I'm reading. Losing doesn't mean you are out of your prime. So what are you talking about?

Yes, Barrera lost the first fight to Junior Jones and then lost an extremely tight decision in the rematch where he closed the stronger fighter. The Morales fight (another prime ATG) could have gone either way and most felt he was robbed. Nevertheless, he bounced back to beat Morales and Hamed, along with Kevin Kelly, Enrique Sanchez and Johnny Tapia. He was an enormous favorite over Pacquiao. That's a far cry from the Whitaker who everyone expected Oscar to KO, especially since Whitaker had been dropped twice in his last fight and needed a miracle to pull off the win. The Whitaker who was already out the door and was on the verge of a substance ban suspension months later. Not to mention, a fight many felt Pea won. Very surprised at your reasoning here.

Real talk bra!

[Mr. Fantastic]

Mr. Fantastic...you obviously just started watching the sport. I can't believe what I'm reading. Losing doesn't mean you are out of your prime. So what are you talking about?

Yes, Barrera lost the first fight to Junior Jones and then lost an extremely tight decision in the rematch where he closed the stronger fighter. The Morales fight (another prime ATG) could have gone either way and most felt he was robbed. Nevertheless, he bounced back to beat Morales and Hamed, along with Kevin Kelly, Enrique Sanchez and Johnny Tapia. He was an enormous favorite over Pacquiao. That's a far cry from the Whitaker who everyone expected Oscar to KO, especially since Whitaker had been dropped twice in his last fight and needed a miracle to pull off the win. The Whitaker who was already out the door and was on the verge of a substance ban suspension months later. Not to mention, a fight many felt Pea won. Very surprised at your reasoning here.

I've been watching the sport probably longer than you. I may not be perfect and know it all but I do consider myself knowing better than the average fan.

He was a favorite over Pac, I know that but it doesn't change the fact that he wasn't at his prime. Its a good victory for Pac don't get me wrong but its overrated.

So everyone expected Oscar to KO one of the best defensive boxers that ever lived?? The P4P #1 fighter at the time??

Many?? Like who the Oscar haters? The Purist?? Please!!!

[Mr. Fantastic]

Depending.

Honnestly,there is no proof,Barrera,Morales and Hatton were shot.
If prime is being undefeated and 25 years old,then most of ATG based their records on shot fighters.

I mean,Barrera was on the roll when he fought Manny,and 29 years old.
Morales was 30,and a loss to a slick fighter like Raheem doesn't mean you are shot,maybe Raheem had his number.

I thought Fatton was himself stopping Malignaggi.

Cotto was damaged good,but Manny is a midget,Cotto has no excuse.It's a great win.
Nobody ever done that,handling easy a WW champ altough being basically a flyweight,featherweight's soldier.

Clottey wasn't shot,but "he refused to fight" is the new talk huh?

I think you guys are funny.

And what proof was there that Chavez & Whitaker were shot?? Two ATGs.

What proof was there that Vargas was shot after Tito??

[IMDAZED]

I've been watching the sport probably longer than you. I may not be perfect and know it all but I do consider myself knowing better than the average fan.

Good. Let's hope this post is better than the last one.

He was a favorite over Pac, I know that but it doesn't change the fact that he wasn't at his prime. Its a good victory for Pac don't get me wrong but its overrated.

Barrera was at his peak - on the best run of his career. How could he have been "out" of his prime?

So everyone expected Oscar to KO one of the best defensive boxers that ever lived?? The P4P #1 fighter at the time??

Seeing as how Diobylis Hurtado was able to drop "one of the best defensive boxers that ever lived" TWICE in the fight before Oscar, why wouldn't anyone expect Oscar to do more? Did you think before you typed that? And Whitaker being pound for pound was about as sensible as Hopkins still being on there as recently as earlier this year - even though he hadn't done jacksquat but claimed the #3 spot by default. Same with Pea - but we knew he was badly slowing in his two fights against Rivera. Your argument is weak.

[IMDAZED]

And what proof was there that Chavez & Whitaker were shot?? Two ATGs.

What's the proof that they were anywhere near their prime?

[Amazinger]

both fought the best...and lost

Zab Judah....... Don't tarnish the word ATG!!

[Mr. Fantastic]

What's the proof that they were anywhere near their prime?

Whitaker was P4P#1 boxer in the world?? lol

So if someone beats Pac now would they get credit for the win?? Since you know he's about to retire soon. Curious.

[IMDAZED]

Whitaker was P4P#1 boxer in the world?? lol

So if someone beats Pac now would they get credit for the win?? Since you know he's about to retire soon. Curious.

That's not proof. That's a title. Where is the proof in the fights?

Of course they would get credit for the win. Why wouldn't they? He's retiring of his own volition, not because he's been getting beat up in fights.

[Cuauhtémoc1520]

And what proof was there that Chavez & Whitaker were shot?? Two ATGs.

What proof was there that Vargas was shot after Tito??

Chicano, I have to say that Chavez and Pernell were past their primes when they fought DLH, there's no doubt about that.

I do disagree that DLH was expected to KO Pernell, I don't know where he came up with that one because that's a fight I remember very clearly and DLH was expected to win but most realized it would be tough because Pernell can make anyone look bad.

It still doesn't change the ******ity of this thread though, to compare DLH to Judah is idiotic. Judah's resume isn't even close and there were 2 major fights in DLH career that I thought he clearly won and wasn't given the decision;

Tito Trinidad
Mosley II

He won those but wasn't given them, at the same time he lost vs Sturm and the Quartey fight was razor close.

DLH is an ATG, anyone who disputes that is insulting the sport of boxing.

This thread is ******...

[Mr. Fantastic]

Good. Let's hope this post is better than the last one.

Barrera was at his peak - on the best run of his career. How could he have been "out" of his prime?

Seeing as how Diobylis Hurtado was able to drop "one of the best defensive boxers that ever lived" TWICE in the fight before Oscar, why wouldn't anyone expect Oscar to do more? Did you think before you typed that? And Whitaker being pound for pound was about as sensible as Hopkins still being on there as recently as earlier this year - even though he hadn't done jacksquat but claimed the #3 spot by default. Same with Pea - but we knew he was badly slowing in his two fights against Rivera. Your argument is weak.

I didn't know that Hurtado dropped Whitaker twice. Sorry.
My argument isn't weak. Comparing it to Hopkins being on the list recently lol. Big difference being #1 than most other spots.

But thanks for trying to discredit Oscar. You always try to.

Oscar fought him on his 24th/25th fight. So this isn't exactly the veteran Oscar that fought Pea. Oscar was just that good.