Comments Thread For: Fury's Father Tears Apart Wilder, Offers Job To Breland

[Monty Fisto]

Well... yeah Fury is trying to get out of it... And his legal representatives probably think they have a recourse for doing so. None of us here know what that recourse is, thats a fact.

We can make an educated guess based on Arum saying (not unreasonably) that there was a time limit attached that has expired. One year has passed. What contract would offer Wilder control over Fury's career for multiple years?

[Monty Fisto]

Then Fury would have nothing to worry about. Just work his magic and do the same thing again: except this time, pull in a 60/40 split of the proceeds, then move on to bigger and better things. Quick, easy and lucrative...

Instead of what he's actually doing. Paying lawyers to deal with mediation talks and arbitration proceedings, staying out of the ring for over a year, doing everything he can to NOT fight Wilder. And if Wilder wins arbitration, pay Wilder if Fury decides to fight someone else. Or even retire. Hold up his career to avoid Wilder at all costs.

These are not the actions of someone who appeared to beat up his opponent with ease. These are the actions of someone who has something to hide. Someone who, in a fair fight, might not perform as well as he did the last time.

Wilder believes he was cheated and he wants to take it out on Fury in the ring. Fury is being difficult so arbitration is his only recourse. Until the judge decides, Fury is unavailable for any other fight. It's as simple as that.

You spin the same narrative over and over. Canelo could beat me in a boxing match within 60 seconds. Like Fury and Wilder, there is no valid contractual agreement for him to fight me. Should he be forced to fight me because he has nothing to worry about? It's such a childish argument you keep making.

The question is not about how easily fighter A beats fighter B, but whether there is a valid contract in place. Stay on argument.

[davefromvancouv]

Wilder took the contract to arbitration because that was the strongest legal mechanism which his team viewed as viable. Fury is not tied up in the way you are making out. The default is not that you are restricted from making a living. If a court has issued a ruling him from making a living, maybe you could kindly share it with us.

Fury signed a contract with a rematch clause that has expired. End of story. Wilder does not get to monopolise Fury's career ad infinitum because he is a bad loser.

You spin the same narrative over and over. Canelo could beat me in a boxing match within 60 seconds. Like Fury and Wilder, there is no valid contractual agreement for him to fight me. Should he be forced to fight me because he has nothing to worry about? It's such a childish argument you keep making.

The question is not about how easily fighter A beats fighter B, but whether there is a valid contract in place. Stay on argument.

That's the problem with signing a contract. You tend to be bound to it. Especially if you publicly admit that there is no reason why you can't honor it (i.e. available to fight December 5th).

And you publicly state that you have a two-fight deal with somebody else.

And you publicly state that the only reason why you can't fight Wilder is because he hurt your feelings. After you supposedly beat him up. A newly transformed beast with hands of stone who can suddenly inflict serious damage on your opponents. And it's legal for you to do it again.

I'm sure the judge is saying, ARE YOU KIDDING ME??? Get back in there and fight the man! DID YOU REALLY BEAT HIM???

[Monty Fisto]

That's the problem with signing a contract. You tend to be bound to it. Especially if you publicly admit that there is no reason why you can't honor it (i.e. available to fight December 5th).

And you publicly state that you have a two-fight deal with somebody else.

And you publicly state that the only reason why you can't fight Wilder is because he hurt your feelings. After you supposedly beat him up. A newly transformed beast with hands of stone who can suddenly inflict serious damage on your opponents. And it's legal for you to do it again.

I'm sure the judge is saying, ARE YOU KIDDING ME??? Get back in there and fight the man! DID YOU REALLY BEAT HIM???

The fabulist answer. Anything based on things that actually happened?

[billeau2]

We can make an educated guess based on Arum saying (not unreasonably) that there was a time limit attached that has expired. One year has passed. What contract would offer Wilder control over Fury's career for multiple years?

That would be a recourse for sure. I actually think Wilder's mental state might also be an issue. Contract law is reallllly freakin interesting. For example, if I have an option to purchase something from you, and I show up to exerscize that option, and show you I have 50 cents in my bank account... tell you the spacemen that guide my thoughts above are good for it, what is my responsibiity to let you exerscize your interest? Certainly the option holder has a contract, but according to contract law, one has to be ready, willing and Able... Obviously the option holder is not ready or able... Wilder's recent behavior is suspect and may in itself invalidate certain features of the contract.

With that said? I think the most basic situation is our Ocham's Razor and Wilder may not have called the option is by the expiration date. Then the argument would be perhaps about how Wilder demonstrated he was wanting to exerscize the option... We shall see.

[davefromvancouv]

The fabulist answer. Anything based on things that actually happened?

Yes.
Fury signing the contract.
Fury's December 5th announcement,
Fury saying he'd never fight Wilder again because he insulted his culture.
Fury's ongoing saga that has been "agreed to terms" and "very close" for close to a year now...

Sadly, I cannot confirm what the judge said.

[Monty Fisto]

Yes.
Fury signing the contract.
Fury's December 5th announcement,
Fury saying he'd never fight Wilder again because he insulted his culture.
Fury's ongoing saga that has been "agreed to terms" and "very close" for close to a year now...

Sadly, I cannot confirm what the judge said.

Yes, Fury signed a contract to fight Wilder on February 22, 2020. And they fought. Agreed. The contract had an option for a rematch. Which is believed to have expired.
You've mentioned Fury's 5th December announcement before. Relevance? Remember, I'm looking for fact, not speculation.
Yes, Fury has said he'll never fight Wilder again. We agree on this, but I don't see how it supports your view that Fury will fight Wilder next rather than Joshua.
Finally, it is not a fact that Fury has said he is very close to anything for close to a year. A year ago he had just finished beating the crap out of Wilder live on air for anyone to see. The following weeks were spent waiting to see if Wilder exercised his option for a rematch. He did, and then months were spent waiting for Wilder to agree a date. He then said he was injured. More months were then spent waiting for him to agree another date. He didn't. And then in November/December, talk started about how his option had expired and a Joshua fight was now on the cards. Even you cannot possibly spin that to nearly a year of saying a fight was close with Joshua. And, of course, we do now know that Arum, Hearn and Warren for the first time have said the fight is very close. On the basis of which, duh, it seems it is very close.

[BodyBagz]

The Bumfather will regret hiring Bree if Tyson ever gets hurt.
He would have thrown in the towel in the 1st fight if he were in Furys corner.

[davefromvancouv]

Yes, Fury signed a contract to fight Wilder on February 22, 2020. And they fought. Agreed. The contract had an option for a rematch. Which is believed to have expired.
You've mentioned Fury's 5th December announcement before. Relevance? Remember, I'm looking for fact, not speculation.
Yes, Fury has said he'll never fight Wilder again. We agree on this, but I don't see how it supports your view that Fury will fight Wilder next rather than Joshua.
Finally, it is not a fact that Fury has said he is very close to anything for close to a year. A year ago he had just finished beating the crap out of Wilder live on air for anyone to see. The following weeks were spent waiting to see if Wilder exercised his option for a rematch. He did, and then months were spent waiting for Wilder to agree a date. He then said he was injured. More months were then spent waiting for him to agree another date. He didn't. And then in November/December, talk started about how his option had expired and a Joshua fight was now on the cards. Even you cannot possibly spin that to nearly a year of saying a fight was close with Joshua. And, of course, we do now know that Arum, Hearn and Warren for the first time have said the fight is very close. On the basis of which, duh, it seems it is very close.

You cling to the belief that the contract has expired. That's a mistake. The arbitration judge will make that decision, i.e. whether the existing contract is still enforceable given the delays.

The relevance of Fury's December 5th announcement is his availability and choice of opponent (i.e. he was available to fight and didn't want to fight Wilder, who was ready, willing and able to kick his ass). He can't then claim that he couldn't fight Wilder. Bad look for arbitration...

Then Fury says he'll never fight Wilder. Again, another bad look when you are before a judge deciding whether a contract is enforceable. Hurt feelings don't count, especially if you can take it out on an opponent you claimed was easy work. If you're scared, you shouldn't have signed the contract in the first place.

Now onto Wilder's availability... Fury is the A-side so ESPN was able to pick and choose the time and date of the rematch. Arum and ESPN delayed the July fight after Wilder's initial injury. From October to December to February. They can't then pretend that the contract is expired. They delayed it. Wilder was available for each of those dates. Not sure why you believe he was still injured...

Once Wilder realized they were planning to move on in November, he was forced to go the mediation and arbitration route. That's where we are today, as I have stated countless times. Nothing else can happen until arbitration is settled regardless of the hype and assurances...

Finally, Eddie Hearn has been pushing the two-fight deal with Joshua since March of last year (!), stating that they had agreed to terms several weeks later.

https://talksport.com/sport/boxing/6...on-2020-fight/

[Monty Fisto]

You cling to the belief that the contract has expired. That's a mistake. The arbitration judge will make that decision, i.e. whether the existing contract is still enforceable given the delays.

The relevance of Fury's December 5th announcement is his availability and choice of opponent (i.e. he was available to fight and didn't want to fight Wilder, who was ready, willing and able to kick his ass). He can't then claim that he couldn't fight Wilder. Bad look for arbitration...

Then Fury says he'll never fight Wilder. Again, another bad look when you are before a judge deciding whether a contract is enforceable. Hurt feelings don't count, especially if you can take it out on an opponent you claimed was easy work. If you're scared, you shouldn't have signed the contract in the first place.

Now onto Wilder's availability... Fury is the A-side so ESPN was able to pick and choose the time and date of the rematch. Arum and ESPN delayed the July fight after Wilder's initial injury. From October to December to February. They can't then pretend that the contract is expired. They delayed it. Wilder was available for each of those dates. Not sure why you believe he was still injured...

Once Wilder realized they were planning to move on in November, he was forced to go the mediation and arbitration route. That's where we are today, as I have stated countless times. Nothing else can happen until arbitration is settled regardless of the hype and assurances...

Finally, Eddie Hearn has been pushing the two-fight deal with Joshua since March of last year (!), stating that they had agreed to terms several weeks later.

https://talksport.com/sport/boxing/6...on-2020-fight/

Linking to an article where Hearn is talking about Joshua being happy to fight either Fury or Wilder is not proof of Fury saying terms are agreed. Yes, Hearn has been talking for a long time about how he'd like the chips to fall. Arum stating to the media in recent days that he thinks the fight is provisionally agreed is clearly a development -- a sign that talks have progressed from just Eddie saying how easy a deal is to make or what he wants to see.

As for the other points.
You say that the judge will decide if the contract is still enforceable. Agreed. Why does he need to decide on that? Because we have moved past an expiry date stipulated in the contract. If we hadn't there would be no dispute. In other words, it's expired, but is there some kind of caveat for Wilder to wiggle around. We'll see. I don't trust either Arum or Finkel, but judging by the things being said by both parties, and reading between the lines, it sounds like Arum is more confident that it's expired and unenforceable than Finkel is that it's still somehow enforceable despite its expiry.

Fury saying he'll never fight Wilder again. Scared, hurt feelings, bad looks, whatever. All irrelevant. The judge is going to look at the legality of what's in the contract. He doesn't care about Fury's position on his future career. Does Wilder still have the option several months after its expiry date is the question he'll be looking at.

Timing. We've covered this before. When Wilder exercised the option originally, the fight had to happen by July. There was a provision that allowed this to be extended by three months in the case of injury. Wilder took this up as he was injured. So he had to fight by October. This obviously didn't happen. Did we hear anything from Wilder in August or September or October when his camp should have been saying, hang on, we want our fight? As I recall there was complete radio silence. Then in November, after the option was gone, up he pops talking about how Fury cheated by scratching flesh from his ear with his nail.

You know all this. Hence the path to try and resolve the dispute. Mediation, then arbitration.

The judge will be looking at why the fight didn't happen. One of the reasons will be that the economics weren't there. i.e. with COVID there was no way for the networks to get as much money as Wilder and Fury wanted. In other words, the fighters together agreed not to fight within the stipulated time frame.