I wish Joe Blow had done more in his career...

[IMDAZED]

people talk about zagh as though his fights between eubank and lacy were all nobodies or tomato cans.

he faced alot of ex-champs and alot of good contenders the likes of charles brewer, richie woodhall, robin reid (ffs even reid admitted he lost), byron mitchell are not HOF worthy fighters but they are respectable and solid wins.

in terms of defenses id say that calzaghes defenses are alot better than hopkins.

hopkins hs faced the better comp at LHW though.

agree with altot of what duke mckenzie has said

calzaghe>hopkins

I'm not quite sure that list of names at 168 are better than Hopkins at 160. If we're talking faded champs then sure Richie Woodhall sounds nice. Hey, Hopkins fought one too (John David Jackson). And Charles Brewer got KTFO by Antwun Echols in three rounds before meeting Calzaghe and after Hopkins battered Echols.

[Haglerwins]

I'm not quite sure that list of names at 168 are better than Hopkins at 160. If we're talking faded champs then sure Richie Woodhall sounds nice. Hey, Hopkins fought one too (John David Jackson). And Charles Brewer got KTFO by Antwun Echols in three rounds before meeting Calzaghe and after Hopkins battered Echols.

You're wasting your time. They are all caught up in that 46-0 record.

[Testdead]

Hopkins never complained that he was struggling to make weight. Maybe at the tail end but that is doubtful. Do you have any proof of this? Because prior to the Trinidad fight (14 defenses in), he specifically told the reporter in his lockerroom the exact opposite (HBO PPV Telecast).

And once again, what makes him a natural LHW? Or, more LHW than MW?

He said after the Tarver fight he wanted to move up and stayed at 160 to get the record.

[Oasis_Lad]

Thanks for your honesty.

Aside from their sharing similar title reigns - a slight edge to Hops perhaps - there are also other factors.

Hopkins has beat a number of fighters who were highly ranked pound for pound at the time he fought them.

Felix Trinidad was considered the best fighter in the world.

That win - though not quite as huge - isn't unlike Marvin Hagler's destruction of Thomas Hearns. Him breaking the middleweight record with that kind of performance over that caliber opponent trumps any on Calzaghe's resume. And before you claim "weight" please note that Tito weighed more than Hopkins (157) and was coming off a 5 round KO of a fighter who neither Bernard nor Jermain Taylor (years later) could come close to stopping.

Does Calzaghe have anything close to this? And that's just one win we're talking about here. I'm barely scratching the surface.

In retrospect we can looks at this win and is it as impressive as it was made out to be? I don't think so.

I mean, without looking at the intangibles and what happened after the fight - Joe beating Lacy is just as good a win ( Now before you jump on me - I don't personally agree with that )

Both were huge murderous punchers knocking their way through their division/s. Both were huge favourites.


I personally think Trinidad is severely overrated and when I see people put him in their top fighters of all-time list I cringe.

And no, I never pointed out that Calzaghe had better wins, but surely a man who knows boxing like yourself ( and you do know boxing ) has to admit that their really isn't a HUGE gap in their respective resumes?

[IMDAZED]

In retrospect we can looks at this win and is it as impressive as it was made out to be? I don't think so.

I mean, without looking at the intangibles and what happened after the fight - Joe beating Lacy is just as good a win ( Now before you jump on me - I don't personally agree with that )

Both were huge murderous punchers knocking their way through their division/s. Both were huge favourites.


I personally think Trinidad is severely overrated and when I see people put him in their top fighters of all-time list I cringe.

And no, I never pointed out that Calzaghe had better wins, but surely a man who knows boxing like yourself ( and you do know boxing ) has to admit that their really isn't a HUGE gap in their respective resumes?

To answer your question...yes. The win is as impressive as it appeared to be then. How could it be anything less? To compare Jeff Lacy to Felix Trinidad is, for lack of a better term, ludicrous. One is a Three-division champ who will one day march into the Hall of Fame. Lacy only gets in on a visitors pass. Furthermore, Trinidad was ranked either #1 or 1a pound for pound when Hopkins fought him. Lacy has never sniffed the dirty dozen. Bad...very bad comparison.

[andrewcuff]

Does he rank higher than Calzaghe all-time? Yes. But when I see people put Bernard in their top 40 and Calzaghe doesn't even make the top 100 I have to wonder why?

All-Time I would rate Hopkins top 50 and Calzaghe top 100. I annoys me when people slate Calzaghe. Ok, he's not Top 50 ATG, but his accomplishments are impressive. I would have liked him to have unification fights earlier, but it wasn't for the lack of trying.

I honestly think Calzaghe beat Hopkins, but history will look more kindly on B-Hop. Calzaghe has the style that beats Hopkins: you need to throw more punches than him. Both Roy Jones and Taylor did and they both won (although Taylor's wins were very close).

[IMDAZED]

He said after the Tarver fight he wanted to move up and stayed at 160 to get the record.

1. So he wanted to move up...means...he was struggling to make weight? That's pretty funny seeing how he weighed 156 for Oscar right before that.

2. Finally, can you explain how he's more of a natural LHW than MW even though nearly all of his fights were at MW, usually weighing in the late 150's?

[IMDAZED]

All-Time I would rate Hopkins top 50 and Calzaghe top 100. I annoys me when people slate Calzaghe. Ok, he's not Top 50 ATG, but his accomplishments are impressive. I would have liked him to have unification fights earlier, but it wasn't for the lack of trying.

I honestly think Calzaghe beat Hopkins, but history will look more kindly on B-Hop. Calzaghe has the style that beats Hopkins: you need to throw more punches than him. Both Roy Jones and Taylor did and they both won (although Taylor's wins were very close).

Cuff...throwing a lot of punches is the wrong style to beat a prime Hopkins and that is absolutely NOT how Jones beat him.

Wow, you stick around and you'll hear anything on these boards.

[andrewcuff]

1. So he wanted to move up...means...he was struggling to make weight? That's pretty funny seeing how he weighed 156 for Oscar right before that.

Arrgh you beat me to that!! I remember Hopkins bragging about his 27" waist as well lol!

[Haglerwins]

All-Time I would rate Hopkins top 50 and Calzaghe top 100. I annoys me when people slate Calzaghe. Ok, he's not Top 50 ATG, but his accomplishments are impressive. I would have liked him to have unification fights earlier, but it wasn't for the lack of trying.

I honestly think Calzaghe beat Hopkins, but history will look more kindly on B-Hop. Calzaghe has the style that beats Hopkins: you need to throw more punches than him. Both Roy Jones and Taylor did and they both won (although Taylor's wins were very close).

Too bad at least 1 of Taylor's wins and even Winky Wright's performance look better than what Cal got credited for in a SD.