Roy Jones's competition at 175

[thegreatone1]

On a side note, I love how people let Roy Jones and Joe Calzaghe slide on ****ty title defenses with the "weak division" excuse, yet crucify Hopkins for essentially the same thing.

(Not that anybody in this thread has done that, but I've seen it done before.)

People dont crucify Hopkins they just question people that say he did beat Tito he did beat Oscar.

thats like Calzaghe beating up 154lb fighters that move up to 168lbs yet started there career at 140lbs.

20 defences is great but i dont see no legend.

[TheGreatA]

The best guy in the list you posted is McCallum, but he was no longer McCcallum of the 80's & early 90's. The only guy where Roy would get credit from me would be the virgil hill fight. I believe that Hill's only loss prior to the Rib Shot from Roy was against Tommy Hearns.

Virgil Hill had lost to Dariusz Michalczewski before that fight.

The fight was for the undisputed, linear LHW title with Hill's WBA&IBF titles on the line against Michalczewski's WBO belt.
Michalczewski won a decision.

The WBA & IBF belts were stripped off him after the fight (the other organizations didn't want to recognize the WBO), allowing Roy Jones to pick them up.

Roy's LHW record is not very strong IMO and it's hard for me to understand why so many people believe he was the greatest LHW of all time.
I guess it's because of his talent and the aura of 'invincibility' he had back in his prime. To his credit he had many solid wins at LHW, nothing too great but he made up for it by making decent fighters look like crap.

I think he should get some credit for the first Tarver win as well. He showed heart in that fight...
Never knew why he didn't just retire after that, it was the same as Lewis vs Vitali Klitschko. He had lost it physically but he fought hard and won.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=ft05fq3kcXE

RJJ vs Montell Griffin I
This fight was back in Roy's prime and it was a good, competitive fight until the DQ. I do not believe that RJJ in his prime was unbeatable but he was probably as close to it as it gets.

[ßringer]

People dont crucify Hopkins they just question people that say he did beat Tito he did beat Oscar.

thats like Calzaghe beating up 154lb fighters that move up to 168lbs yet started there career at 140lbs.

20 defences is great but i dont see no legend.

It's more than that, Tito and Oscar aside, they were the only 2 Welterweights who he defended his Middleweight title against. Yet the way people act it was as if he defended his title against 19 Welterweights and one legit Middleweight.

They also take issue with the 3 defenses against Robert Allan, Allan was a mandatory an dkept popping up because the division was weak. It's not like he could've been like "**** it, I won't fight you", he had to...because there was no one else.

[mECHsLAVE]

Michalczewski is the big glaring name missing from Roy's resume.

Don't try and act as though the guys Roy beat at 175 were garbage, now. I hate when people do that. Roy beat the crap out of some very good fighters, and didn't just beat them. Embarassed them.

It's Dariusz Michalczewski that is the huge roach of his wedding cake at 175 and he can never erase that. Michalczewski was the linear champ at 175 when Roy entered that division and Roy fought at that weight for years, calling himself a "champ," winning paper titles stripped from Michalczewski and was begged by journalists, fans, HBO, everyone begged him to make the fight and he just wouldn't do it.

[wmute]

Roy's run at 175 is A LOT better then Mosley's 135 run by a freaking long shot.

Amen to that.

[thegreatone1]

It's more than that, Tito and Oscar aside, they were the only 2 Welterweights who he defended his Middleweight title against. Yet the way people act it was as if he defended his title against 19 Welterweights and one legit Middleweight.

They also take issue with the 3 defenses against Robert Allan, Allan was a mandatory an dkept popping up because the division was weak. It's not like he could've been like "**** it, I won't fight you", he had to...because there was no one else.

Im not knocking Hopkins he beat everyone put infront of him during his reign no doubt and hay calzaghe, Jones anyone would take those fights due to the money.

I like Hopkins hes smart savy and i think he is a great guy, misguided at times but a good guy. For me he lost to the best two 160lb fighters he faced in Jones and Taylor and i think he is out of his depth with Calzaghe.

Should Hopkins win i will give him all the credit in the world.

[warp1432]

I wouldn't even call them welterweights. Felix fit perfectly in at middle (even if his best weight was welter) and Oscar...well it's still a good win.

And Hopkins resume isn't weak at all.

[mECHsLAVE]

Virgil Hill had lost to Dariusz Michalczewski before that fight.

The fight was for the undisputed, linear LHW title with Hill's WBA&IBF titles on the line against Michalczewski's WBO belt.
Michalczewski won a decision.

Dariusz vacanted WBA&IBF belts after the fight (the other organizations didn't want to recognize the WBO), allowing Roy Jones to pick them up.

Roy's LHW record is not very strong IMO and it's hard for me to understand why so many people believe he was the greatest LHW of all time.
I guess it's because of his talent and the aura of 'invincibility' he had back in his prime.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=ft05fq3kcXE

RJJ vs Montell Griffin I
This fight was back in Roy's prime and it was a good, competitive fight until the DQ. I do not believe that RJJ in his prime was unbeatable but he was probably as close to it as it gets.

He was immediately stripped of the WBA and IBF titles.

[Lazy Liberal]

Virgil Hill had lost to Dariusz Michalczewski before that fight.

The fight was for the undisputed, linear LHW title with Hill's WBA&IBF titles on the line against Michalczewski's WBO belt.
Michalczewski won a decision.

Dariusz vacanted WBA&IBF belts after the fight (the other organizations didn't want to recognize the WBO), allowing Roy Jones to pick them up.

Roy's LHW record is not very strong IMO and it's hard for me to understand why so many people believe he was the greatest LHW of all time.
I guess it's because of his talent and the aura of 'invincibility' he had back in his prime. To his credit he had a lot of solid wins, nothing too great but he made up for it by making decent fighters look like crap.

I think he should get some credit for the first Tarver win as well. He showed heart in that fight...

http://youtube.com/watch?v=ft05fq3kcXE

RJJ vs Montell Griffin I
This fight was back in Roy's prime and it was a good, competitive fight until the DQ. I do not believe that RJJ in his prime was unbeatable but he was probably as close to it as it gets.

Thanks for the clarification regarding the Hill losses. I totaly forgot that Hill and dariusz fought in 97 in oberhausen Germany. As you stated Hill and dariusz fought for the title of the "MAN" in the division. That is why I said Roy vs dariusz regardless of critics thinking Roy would win would have been a fight that needed to be made.

I have never understood the Roy is the greatest LHW of all time argument either.

[thegreatone1]

I wouldn't even call them welterweights. Felix fit perfectly in at middle (even if his best weight was welter) and Oscar...well it's still a good win.

And Hopkins resume isn't weak at all.

No its not weak not at all but take out Trinidad and Oscar and its similar to Calzaghes imo.

And neither trinidad nor Oscar won more than one fight at 160lbs and Oscars was a gift although Strum has turned out to be a decent fighter.