Calzaghe is overrated

[-Swizzy-]

Call it what it is an excuse. You name Hopkins as an opponent and then after the win you critise him for facing him. You CANNOT use the Hopkins arguement, you may critise the man in other ways but using an arguement that you supported before he got in the ring with him is an excuse. It's like me saying Cotto needs to fight Mosely to be considered elite then after he wins i say he was very nearly beaten and Mosely only lost because he was old so therefore Cotto isn't elite. Is it not Possible Hopkins just has a bad style for Calzaghe?

It's like People critise him again for not fighting Pavlik when they critise others for jumping up in weight class and getting an immediate shot at the champ. While I support a Calzaghe-Pavlik fight over a Jones-Calzaghe fight I can see the reasons he's doing it. He's an OUT OF PRIME fighter with a few fights left, he wants to retire and fully support his lifestyle and family.

I made a bad judgement call on hopkins condition. it should've been obvious to me that hops is way too old to last in any fight stamina wise. but that is the only thing that I was wrong in assuming, I still think give hopkins stamina like he had 5-6 years ago and leave everything(reflexes, smarts, power) as is right now, and he beats calzaghe.

[Kris Silver]

I made a bad judgement call on hopkins condition. it should've been obvious to me that hops is way too old to last in any fight stamina wise. but that is the only thing that I was wrong in assuming, I still think give hopkins stamina like he had 5-6 years ago and leave everything(reflexes, smarts, power) as is right now, and he beats calzaghe.

It's a little convenient you suddenly decide to realise this basic thing of age and way past prime AFTER the fight, don't you think? It's difficult to credit that argument full stop as Hops was coming of good wins post 40 and LHW #1. The fact you supported it and said he should face such an elite makes it worse.

[Ryn0]

well, what that proves is that hopkins was too old. he didn't have the stamina to finish calzaghe off at the end of the 1st round. thats how fast he got tired. after like the 4th or 5th round, hopkins was done even at the start of the rounds. I do believe, had this fight happened 5 years earlier, the outcome would've been different. just look at trinidad-hopkins round 12, hopkins was still full of energy in that round. the different between hops then and now is like day and night.

He threw one punch KD's Calzaghe early and then couldn't summon up the stamina to follow up with a second punch?!
Calzaghe KD's the Iron chinned Eubank and Benn couldn't KD him because he was cold and unexpecting to start fast. Pavlik who is Iron chinned got KD'd by Taylor who can't put down Ouma or Spinks in the 2nd because he wasn't expecting Taylor to start like that and didn't recognise Taylors rhythm.

[-Swizzy-]

It's a little convenient you suddenly decide to realise this basic thing of age and way past prime AFTER the fight, don't you think? It's difficult to credit that argument full stop as Hops was coming of good wins post 40 and LHW #1. The fact you supported it and said he should face such an elite makes it worse.

you can spin it any way you like, but I am stating FACTS. instead of commenting on the mindset of my posts, how about replying to my posts with a LOGICAL theory like I have presented. Its not like I'm creating excuses out of thin air, those are some legit factual evidences that I have given. ppl say that a 29 year old morales was shot, well what about a 43 year old hopkins? I would say that he was WAAAY passed it and there for an easy prey for calzaghe just cuz of his age. but it still wasn't totally easy for calzaghe although it should've been cuz hopkins was dead tired during that fight. only if calzaghe could do something other than slap.

[Ryn0]

I made a bad judgement call on hopkins condition. it should've been obvious to me that hops is way too old to last in any fight stamina wise. but that is the only thing that I was wrong in assuming, I still think give hopkins stamina like he had 5-6 years ago and leave everything(reflexes, smarts, power) as is right now, and he beats calzaghe.

Regardless you CANNOT use that arguement if you supported it, Hopkins may just be a bad stylistic match up with Calzaghe. You can make another arguement and say Calzaghe's ability doesn't reflect on his resume which is true, he should've spent less time in wales and more time trying to fight people like Ottke (abeit in Germany) or RJJ/Toney/Collins when he had the chance.

Lots of people talk like Calzaghe is in his prime when realisitically lots of fighters are retiring around Calzaghe's age. The reality is he's overated by the British and underated by lots of Americans but objectively and I can look objectively he's a Solid fighter with good speed, decent chin and underated power in his prime which declined quickly as he got older but it was never One punch KO power, who would give ANY SMW/MW a run for there money but might not come out on top, he's not unbeatable you don't have to go as far back as a Prime RJJ to see who would beat him, Hagler would beat him, Hopkins and Calzaghe fought very differently in their primes than they do now so who knows, Monzon and Cedan proberbly would have beaten him as well.

[Kris Silver]

you can spin it any way you like, but I am stating FACTS. instead of commenting on the mindset of my posts, how about reply to my posts with a LOGICAL theory like I have presented. Its not like I'm creating excuses out of thin air, those are some legit factual evidences that I have given. ppl say that a 29 year old morles was shot, well what about a 43 year old hopkins? I would say that he was WAAAY passed it and there for an easy prey for calzaghe just cuz of his age. but it still wasn't totally easy for calzaghe although it should've been cuz hopkins was dead tired during that fight. only if calzaghe could do something other than slap.

You wanted Calzaghe to face Hops, then when he beat him you say he's past prime. This is true, but noway near the extent you conveniently make out all of a sudden post fight. I just listed you facts did you not read my post. Think that might be the problem, you not receiving and believing what you want.

Hops was coming off great wins post the age 40 so that blows your age excuse substantially, regardless most agree he was above the likes of Johnson, Tarver, Dawson as the LHW #1.

[IMDAZED]

Call it what it is an excuse. You name Hopkins as an opponent and then after the win you critise him for facing him. You CANNOT use the Hopkins arguement, you may critise the man in other ways but using an arguement that you supported before he got in the ring with him is an excuse. It's like me saying Cotto needs to fight Mosely to be considered elite then after he wins i say he was very nearly beaten and Mosely only lost because he was old so therefore Cotto isn't elite. Is it not Possible Hopkins just has a bad style for Calzaghe?

It's like People critise him again for not fighting Pavlik when they critise others for jumping up in weight class and getting an immediate shot at the champ. While I support a Calzaghe-Pavlik fight over a Jones-Calzaghe fight I can see the reasons he's doing it. He's an OUT OF PRIME fighter with a few fights left, he wants to retire and fully support his lifestyle and family.

It really doesn't matter whether or not Hopkins was someone people felt he should fight. The point is, Hopkins was 43 and...43!

Hindsight is 20/20 for a reason.

Some keener minds already saw signs Hopkins was badly fading when he fought Wright. I mean, Winky was fighting 10lbs. above an ideal weight for the first time in his career, was past his best as well and going up against Bernard ****ing Hopkins - not Shane Mosley or Felix Trinidad.

And Hops looked pretty terrible in that bout. They both did. Right then and there I knew that Hops didn't have enough left to beat Calzaghe. But he still showed glimpses of what could have been only a few years ago. Hopkins' output has decreased with age but it was pretty pathetic against Calzaghe. And Winky too. He didn't always throw only 15 punches a round.

And there you have it. Hindsight can be a ***** to deal with when its a poster flip-flopping but if it's true, that's all that matters. And in this case, Hopkins was simply an old man.

[IMDAZED]

He threw one punch KD's Calzaghe early and then couldn't summon up the stamina to follow up with a second punch?!
Calzaghe KD's the Iron chinned Eubank and Benn couldn't KD him because he was cold and unexpecting to start fast. Pavlik who is Iron chinned got KD'd by Taylor who can't put down Ouma or Spinks in the 2nd because he wasn't expecting Taylor to start like that and didn't recognise Taylors rhythm.

Kelly Pavlik is iron chinned? Since when?

[Ryn0]

It really doesn't matter whether or not Hopkins was someone people felt he should fight. The point is, Hopkins was 43 and...43!

Hindsight is 20/20 for a reason.

Some keener minds already saw signs Hopkins was badly fading when he fought Wright. I mean, Winky was fighting 10lbs. above an ideal weight for the first time in his career, was past his best as well and going up against Bernard ****ing Hopkins - not Shane Mosley or Felix Trinidad.

And Hops looked pretty terrible in that bout. They both did. Right then and there I knew that Hops didn't have enough left to beat Calzaghe. But he still showed glimpses of what could have been only a few years ago. Hopkins' output has decreased with age but it was pretty pathetic against Calzaghe. And Winky too. He didn't always throw only 15 punches a round.

And there you have it. Hindsight can be a ***** to deal with when its a poster flip-flopping but if it's true, that's all that matters. And in this case, Hopkins was simply an old man.

True but too say he should fight someone aka. Hopkins then dismiss the fight entirely even after seeing the winky fight means you have a double standard. Stylically Hopkins is a ***** to fight now anyway, he makes EVERYONE look bad.

The topic of discusion isn't his comp anyway I was just bringing that up from a former arguement, it's that Calzaghe is "overated" the word is overplayed so much nowdays. The brits (some not all) overate him and there are a hell of alot that downplay his achievements. He's not THE GOAT or in the top 20 P4P all time. I call it what it is even as a fan. He's a solid fighter with a resume that doesn't reflect his ability, he didn't go after the big fights in his prime whether that's Warren fault I don't know when he could have gotten a much better resume but he has solid skills, fast hands, underated Power in his prime he can't punch at all now though.

[Ryn0]

Kelly Pavlik is iron chinned? Since when?

Well lots of people were saying that so i decided to stick it in to make my arguement seem better

but his chin isn't bad considering he took bombs from Miranda.