Larry Holmes Is The Goat Heavyweight

[slicksouthpaw16]

I hear you and might agree if Ali beat prime Fraizer. The problem is he lost to Fraizer in the biggest fight between them. The other two times Ali beat him were when Fraizer was older and not quite the same

I don't see how Frazier was old or shopworn in the Ali rematch, particularly the 2nd one. He had just turned 30 and had beaten Ali in the first fight. Plus Ali was definitely past his prime in all 3 fights.

Some people use the first Ali fight as "proof" that Frazier was past his prime in Foreman 1 as well, which Isn't true IMO. If that was true, how could Ali be blamed for being the reason Frazier was past his prime in the first place? Lol If anything, its to his credit.

[MikeyMike100]

I don't see how Frazier was old or shopworn in the Ali rematch, particularly the 2nd one. He had just turned 30 and had beaten Ali in the first fight. Plus Ali was definitely past his prime in all 3 fights.

Some people use the first Ali fight as "proof" that Frazier was past his prime in Foreman 1 as well, which Isn't true IMO. If that was true, how could Ali be blamed for being the reason Frazier was past his prime in the first place? Lol If anything, its to his credit.

I had Ali winning the second fight 7-5. Wasn't as an impressive of a victory as fraizer the first time. Also know some that had it a draw and some who had Fraizer winning.

[slicksouthpaw16]

I had Ali winning the second fight 7-5. Wasn't as an impressive of a victory as fraizer the first time. Also know some that had it a draw and some who had Fraizer winning.

I remember Ali edging the 2nd one very tight, probably by about 1 or 2 rounds on my card. I rate Ali's wins over Foreman, Frazier, all the other top rated contenders at the time very high because of how past his prime Ali was.

I think movement, speed/fluidity wise, we can agree that any Ali post exile looked a lot different than the Williams, Liston and Folley Ali just before the 3 and a half year layoff. Frazier would always give Ali a hard time, but you'd have to think that a pre exile Ali would not linger on the ropes as much (as Ali did even in the first fight) and would be much less susceptible some of the power shots that Frazier landed. Like that triple left hook that Frazier landed in the 11th round of the first fight that doubled Ali over and rocked him? I literally see that never happening to a prime Ali. I'd take Ali pre exile to win a close but clear UD over Frazier to the point where there wouldn't be a need for a trilogy.

[Dynamite76]

It's kind of silly to say a fighter ducked an opponent he fought 3 times.

Not really, especially if this fighter has gone life and death with this other fighter for 3 fights. And you are 37-38 years old at the end of your rope.

[Ben Bolt]

Nothing but respect for that guy. Is he the best?? Don't know don't care. Just enjoyed watching him fight

[QueensburyRules]

I don't see how Frazier was old or shopworn in the Ali rematch, particularly the 2nd one. He had just turned 30 and had beaten Ali in the first fight. Plus Ali was definitely past his prime in all 3 fights.

Some people use the first Ali fight as "proof" that Frazier was past his prime in Foreman 1 as well, which Isn't true IMO. If that was true, how could Ali be blamed for being the reason Frazier was past his prime in the first place? Lol If anything, its to his credit.

- -You sayin' 28 yr old Ali was shot after his return to the ring in advance of the soon to be Supreme ruling?

Don't know about you, but in spite of some serious setbacks in my reckless youth, I was invincible in those years. Did Ali suddenly turn into a weenie? If so, I didn't see that at all.

[War Room]

When a father feeds his son to a lion lmao!

[Anthony342]

The lineal is bull. Shannon Briggs was lineal at one point

Doesn't mean it isn't valid. Shannon Briggs just got a gift decision, but it's valid most of the time. Larry Holmes was THE champ after he beat the shell of Ali, who held the Ring championship belt. Why he didn't go for the WBA belt, I don't know. Maybe it was held by a Don King fighter and couldn't get the deal done? One of our historians here will probably know and can elaborate on that. IBF title came much later, around 1985. Holmes had 12 defenses of the lineal title after beating Ali, so Holmes was the top heavyweight until Spinks and Tyson came along.

[MikeyMike100]

Doesn't mean it isn't valid. Shannon Briggs just got a gift decision, but it's valid most of the time. Larry Holmes was THE champ after he beat the shell of Ali, who held the Ring championship belt. Why he didn't go for the WBA belt, I don't know. Maybe it was held by a Don King fighter and couldn't get the deal done? One of our historians here will probably know and can elaborate on that. IBF title came much later, around 1985. Holmes had 12 defenses of the lineal title after beating Ali, so Holmes was the top heavyweight until Spinks and Tyson came along.

George Foreman held that lineal belt hostage after he beat Michael Moorer and vacated his belt because he didn't want to fight mandataries

[Marchegiano]

Anyone know what Briggs did with the physical lineal belt Foreman had commissioned?