Were Patterson and Ingo the worst heavyweight champs ever ?

[john l]

Patterson could definitely upset a Sharkey who hadn’t trained properly. But a Prime Sharkey ? I don’t see it happening. Apart from the long arms, Sharkey was very physically similiar to Liston. Maybe a few pounds lighter but not hugely. He was a strong, powerful man. Physically dominated a Patterson archetype in Loughran (and unlike Patterson, Loughran had no trouble taking on big heavyweights like the 6’2” 210 pound Schaaf and nearly 6’3” ATG James Braddock). Had the strength to go toe to toe with Dempsey (albeit an old one). He hammered Wills from pillar to post. Beat 6’3” Godfrey. Beat nearly 6’4” Scott via brutal ForemanFrazier-esque KO. Beat nearly 6’6” 270 pound Carnera. Was beating taller than Liston Schmeling who arguably has the best win in boxing history until the DQ. And proceeded to beat him in a rematch (albeit which may have been a robbery).

An enormous puncher like Willard would be a nightmare for Patterson’s chin and he also had a very nice jab which Patterson has no hope of ever getting inside of.

When he steps into the ring against the gigantic Carnera, I see Patterson getting intimidated and freezing like he did against Liston who is almost puny in comparison to Carnera.

Sharkey punched nothing like Liston and also was not as good of a boxer. Willard was not an "enormous puncher" just because he was big matter a fact he was not a big puncher at all. Who did Carnera KO just Sharky who beat him so easy in 1st fight most believe the 2nd was fixed like most of his fights. It was not the size of Liston that intimated Patterson it was his POWER, he had and would fight bigger fighters like Ali. Schaaf was not a top fighter, best remembered for being killed by Baer, and Braddock was a decent fighter but no world beater. Both Godfrey and Wills were past it by the time Sharkey got around to them. Have to say I disagree with most of you post.

[john l]

- -Anyone could beat Hart save Jack Johnson and obviously Floyd better than Sharkey, but best to best Sharkey had size and talent enough to beat Floyd.

Primo has the best record of all his HOF peers that he beat and he KOed Sharkey cold. Certainly compromising eras with a 20 rd fight in 6oz gloves, Jess rt could ice floyd easy as could Primo and both killed men in the ring. Floyd was never elusive, and uphill combos leave him exposed.

Buster Mathis also supersized didn't have the pop those did, but he was a younger peer of Floyd under Cus also and in shape before his retirement and prediabetic comeback, same bad result for Floyd.

Same thing with 200lb Cruisers. Floyd would cleaned up those early 190 Cruisers and koed Qawi who was the best of the bunch til Field came along.

In short, size matters when coupled to decent talent.

Did you just say Jack Johnson could not beat Hart?? Im assuming that was a mistake.

[QueensburyRules]

Did you just say Jack Johnson could not beat Hart?? Im assuming that was a mistake.

- -Couldn't beat Hart when a win would land him the Champ, Jeffries.

Jeff so disgusted with the fight that he retired knowing he beat every worthwhile challenge.

[john l]

- -Couldn't beat Hart when a win would land him the Champ, Jeffries.

Jeff so disgusted with the fight that he retired knowing he beat every worthwhile challenge.

Your either racist and dumb or just VERY dumb! Not quite sure yet. Jeffries even said after fight "I could have never touched him on my best day" But you know more about Johnson's skills then Jeffries lmao.

[QueensburyRules]

Your either racist and dumb or just VERY dumb! Not quite sure yet. Jeffries even said after fight "I could have never touched him on my best day" But you know more about Johnson's skills then Jeffries lmao.

- -Playing ye olde race card when science has ruled there is no such thing as race are you?

About 40% of Jeff record against relevant non white fighters of the day when JJ was a no show until Jeff's last year.

Jj beat a depleted Jeff with 6 yrs rust having to shed 100 lbs of lard that even John L picked against.

What grade you in this year?

[Dempsey19]

Sharkey punched nothing like Liston and also was not as good of a boxer. Willard was not an "enormous puncher" just because he was big matter a fact he was not a big puncher at all. Who did Carnera KO just Sharky who beat him so easy in 1st fight most believe the 2nd was fixed like most of his fights. It was not the size of Liston that intimated Patterson it was his POWER, he had and would fight bigger fighters like Ali. Schaaf was not a top fighter, best remembered for being killed by Baer, and Braddock was a decent fighter but no world beater. Both Godfrey and Wills were past it by the time Sharkey got around to them. Have to say I disagree with most of you post.

Sharkey’s Brutal KO of the Superheavyweight Scott is a testament to his power and way more impressive than Liston preying on light heavy/cruiserweights. Braddock became undisputed heavyweight champion of the world and gave Prime Louis hell, knocking him down, he is the definition of a world beater.

Willard killed a man in the ring and was considered the hardest puncher ever in his time.

I don’t disagree that Carnera wasn’t the best but I see him being able to beat a Patterson who is frozen.

[QueensburyRules]

- -As far as who beats who, does anyone doubt Floyd knocks out Hart mid rds?

I'd also imagine he'd whoop JJ as well.

[john l]

- -Playing ye olde race card when science has ruled there is no such thing as race are you?

About 40% of Jeff record against relevant non white fighters of the day when JJ was a no show until Jeff's last year.

Jj beat a depleted Jeff with 6 yrs rust having to shed 100 lbs of lard that even John L picked against.

What grade you in this year?

Again you moron EVEN Jeffries said "he could never touch him on his best day". That's a quote st8 from him, but you know more about what its like to have fought Johnson then he does lmao. There is no thing called race huh?? I suppose to you that means there are no racists??? How fu@#ing dumb are you????????

[john l]

Sharkey’s Brutal KO of the Superheavyweight Scott is a testament to his power and way more impressive than Liston preying on light heavy/cruiserweights. Braddock became undisputed heavyweight champion of the world and gave Prime Louis hell, knocking him down, he is the definition of a world beater.

Willard killed a man in the ring and was considered the hardest puncher ever in his time.

I don’t disagree that Carnera wasn’t the best but I see him being able to beat a Patterson who is frozen.

Willard was NEVER considered the hardest puncher of his time where did you get that? I guy did die in the ring with him, but that don't mean your a puncher sometimes it just happens. Also if you REALLY knew about that fight MOST at time thought the injury's came from his fight with Baer which took place shortly before. There is not ONE boxing expert that would put Sharkey ahead of Liston when he come to power(or anything). It seems your just reading Boxrec and don't really know the stories behind these guys. Im sorry but your just waaaaaay off on this.One last thing Liston was not fighting Lt Heavys or Cruiser's have you even seen the guys he fought before he won title like the very big and huge punching Clevland Williams. The Williams Ali KOed was old and just had a 357 bullet put in his back.

[Ben Bolt]

One last thing Liston was not fighting Lt Heavys or Cruiser's have you even seen the guys he fought before he won title like the very big and huge punching Clevland Williams.

Liston–Williams was an encounter we today would have called a ‘dream match-up’.
If I had been there, that April night in Miami, I had say after the opening round: Look, Cleveland is too experienced for Sonny, he’ll win this.