Marciano 49-0 vs. Mayweather 49-0.

[ShoulderRoll]

Yes, key word being "retire" - like you said, no other retired. I repeat what if Benvenuti had retired would he today be considered the GOAT? He would have had 63 wins, no defeats and was a world champion (united).

Those are what ifs.

The real, actual record belongs to Floyd. To date he is the only one who made it happen and that can't be taken away from him.

Not unless someone comes along and tops him.

Possibly. Mayweather probably also has the record of fewest top opponents beaten at their best and fewest great, career defining wins.

Naw, he doesnt.

[Anthony342]

For a guy that was that big a star, I think he does.

At least Roy Jones beat James Toney before he took easier fights.

[IronDanHamza]

For a guy that was that big a star, I think he does.

At least Roy Jones beat James Toney before he took easier fights.

Floyd has beaten more #1 ranked fighters in the division being fought in than pretty much anyone in history off the top of my head so to repeat what ShoulderRoll said "Nah he doesn't"

Not even close either.

[Anthony342]

Then why is he so heavily criticized by fans and historians for not beating the best at their best, for either avoiding them (Margarito) or fighting them years after he should've (Pacquiao, Mosley, Cotto) and why are so many others ranked above him on ATG lists? Because maybe those guys ranked above him weren't just greatly talented like he was, but were willing to take a lot more chances and therefore have much better resumes than he does?

[IronDanHamza]

Then why is he so heavily criticized by fans and historians for not beating the best at their best, for either avoiding them (Margarito) or fighting them years after he should've (Pacquiao, Mosley, Cotto) and why are so many others ranked above him on ATG lists? Because maybe those guys ranked above him weren't just greatly talented like he was, but were willing to take a lot more chances and therefore have much better resumes than he does?

Just an extremely vague set of blanket statements here.

Which historians heavily criticised him? Last I checked the last time a list of historians made a list of the last 80 years they had Floyd pretty high at around #12 or something.

Last time ESPN had a panel voting for who the best fighters of the last 20 years is they had Floyd at #1.

And many lists alike so who are these historians you are talking about?

You say "so many" like Floyd isn't regularly listed in the Top 15-20 of ATG lists by both historians and fans.

[Bravado]

Then why is he so heavily criticized by fans and historians for not beating the best at their best, for either avoiding them (Margarito) or fighting them years after he should've (Pacquiao, Mosley, Cotto) and why are so many others ranked above him on ATG lists? Because maybe those guys ranked above him weren't just greatly talented like he was, but were willing to take a lot more chances and therefore have much better resumes than he does?

Its because either you're making up your paragraph or you're quoting idiots.

Floyd wanted a Cotto fight.
He wanted the Mosley fight.
He wanted the Manny fight.
He wanted the Antonio fight.

He was blocked from Cotto
Blocked from Mosley who rather fix his tooth than fight at the time.
Blocked from Manny

Antonio if i am mistaken his people said he wasn't ready, and Arum himself blocked that fight.

[Anthony342]

Its because either you're making up your paragraph or you're quoting idiots.

Floyd wanted a Cotto fight.
He wanted the Mosley fight.
He wanted the Manny fight.
He wanted the Antonio fight.

He was blocked from Cotto
Blocked from Mosley who rather fix his tooth than fight at the time.
Blocked from Manny

Antonio if i am mistaken his people said he wasn't ready, and Arum himself blocked that fight.

So then he's the best ever? Where does he rank all time then?

[Anthony342]

Just an extremely vague set of blanket statements here.

Which historians heavily criticised him? Last I checked the last time a list of historians made a list of the last 80 years they had Floyd pretty high at around #12 or something.

Last time ESPN had a panel voting for who the best fighters of the last 20 years is they had Floyd at #1.

And many lists alike so who are these historians you are talking about?

You say "so many" like Floyd isn't regularly listed in the Top 15-20 of ATG lists by both historians and fans.

I'm going by the countless posts I've read here. Now how's about answering my question? Any best ever lists usually name a lot of other guys before Mayweather, like Robinson, Greb, Armstrong, Ali, Louis, as well as guys like Leonard and Duran, people here agree, yet when I repeat it, I get crucified. So which is it then, because I'm seeing two completely different arguments on this forum now. Nobody doubts his talent. Is he a top 5-10 ATG or is he someone really talented with a solid resume of good wins, but not great ones in the top 50 of all time? Yeah, you're right, it was a great choice to fight Andre Berto when he could've fought Keith Thurman.

[IronDanHamza]

I'm going by the countless posts I've read here. Now how's about answering my question? Any best ever lists usually name a lot of other guys before Mayweather, like Robinson, Greb, Armstrong, Ali, Louis, as well as guys like Leonard and Duran, people here agree, yet when I repeat it, I get crucified. So which is it then, because I'm seeing two completely different arguments on this forum now. Nobody doubts his talent. Is he a top 5-10 ATG or is he someone really talented with a solid resume of good wins, but not great ones in the top 50 of all time? Yeah, you're right, it was a great choice to fight Andre Berto when he could've fought Keith Thurman.

Ok well now you are talking about an online Boxing forum. You said historians. Which one is it?

I shouldn't have to explain why some trolls on the internet's opinions aren't valid. Any decent poster on this site would hold Mayweather as at worst Top 3 of the last 25 years if not #1 and likely amongst the Top 20 range all time.

As for historians, like I said, name them. You can't just throw it out there and hope it sticks. Like I said last I checked, last time a panel of historians made a list of the last 80 years or whatever it was Floyd was pretty high on the list. So, what's that then?

You say THE best fighters ever are ranked higher than him like that means something. What does that mean? Ray Robinson and Armstrong and Muhammad Ali etc are ranked higher than him? The people you listed are ranked above pretty much anyone. I have answered your question, Floyd is generally considered in the Top 20 range by most reasonable fans and historians so you tell me how that is "heavily critsized" and how that equates to "the record for the least top fighters beaten" which is just a laughable statement.

[billeau2]

I'm going by the countless posts I've read here. Now how's about answering my question? Any best ever lists usually name a lot of other guys before Mayweather, like Robinson, Greb, Armstrong, Ali, Louis, as well as guys like Leonard and Duran, people here agree, yet when I repeat it, I get crucified. So which is it then, because I'm seeing two completely different arguments on this forum now. Nobody doubts his talent. Is he a top 5-10 ATG or is he someone really talented with a solid resume of good wins, but not great ones in the top 50 of all time? Yeah, you're right, it was a great choice to fight Andre Berto when he could've fought Keith Thurman.

Anthony

Your being crucified because unfortunately in order to make a point, or to at times try to dull the pain of points made people obfiscate information.

You have Floyd loyalists like you used to have Roy Jones loyalists. Now I will bet you a dollar that what I am about to say next will start the floyd crowd, with Dan at the helm rushing in:

Floyd beating those declared number one, is great...But the fact remains, whether Floyd was responsible for it, or not...Floyd never beat a top ATG fighter at prime. This affects his legacy considerably...Ok here we go!!

I posted this because you asked a legitimate question and frankly you should not accept Bull____ like The number one gut at this time, etc. With that said putting Floyd top ten to twenty is not necessarily unreasonable.