The education thread show a vid and tell us what to look for

[joeandthebums]

Lewis accepted $3 million step-a-side money, when he could have had a guaranteed title shot and $14 million payday.

I remember a slightly higher figure being mentioned. Is the $14 million a reference to a potential fight with Tyson?

I'm of the opinion Lewis took the, I believe $4/5 million, because Tyson was not going to fight him. The money he accepted is better than no money.

At that point he had already been unsuccessful in his attempts to get the Tyson-Bruno fight stopped, due to his claim as mandatory challenger, despite that attempt failing he was successful in petitioning the WBC for his right as mandatory challenger to be Tyson's first opponent when he defended the title.

King gave this lip service as Lewis was not a fighter he promoted and was considered a greater risk than the opponents King had mapped out for Tyson.

Seldon, a King fighter, had already been marked as Tyson's next opponent - Lewis had little option other than to protest, which he did and led the WBC to announce before the fight that their title was not being contested - Lewis had rights to Tyson first defense and if Seldon defeated Tyson the WBC title would become vacant - then allowing Lewis to contest for it.

Lewis and his team, like the rest of the boxing community knew King had Tyson-Holyfield lined up next, so taking his money was sensible.

A point not often mentioned in this case is that Lewis did have an exclusive promotional deal with HBO, Tyson with Showtime - so as we know, the chance of a fight coming off was slim to zero.

Lewis turned down £10 million to fight Bowe in 1995.

There is a lot of information on this never-to-be fight and that's no doubt correct, it was a very good offer for the time period too.

I'm not really aware of any serious talks taking place in 1995.

Lewis turned down $30 million+ to face Vitali in a rematch....

Pass, don't know on this one - but if he never returned to the ring then it was no longer a career option.

[billeau2]

Your a fraud who's boxing knowledge could be written on a postage stamp. All you have came at me with is ridicule and slanderous remarks, you could not debate my question because you are a Hater` Now go away and never mess with me again, you ****** little turd. Your credibility is in tatters, You can never ever be taken serious because you are a Fraud.

you are senile...not even able to remember what you posted and didn't post. Again, do you **** on yourself like you do on the threads?

[The Old LefHook]

One or both of these two (Tyson and Lews, not our famous squabblers) put a big hurt on their own legacies when they missed each other in their primes. A great rivalry and a series of bouts might have resulted, but we and history are reduced to speculation on an issue which should have been solved when it could have been.

If anyone was scared, it was Lewis, because I am pretty sure Tyson was not. The older Tyson had a fear of Lewis though.

In their physical primes these young men had no authentic control over their lives or careers, certainly more true for Tyson than Lewis. Lennox liked to trot out an image of control over his affairs, but neither of these guys was capable at that time of looking over the lawyers' shoulders with helpful corrections and suggestions, or of beating promoters and managers and media corporations at their own game. Things got cooked up, and the boxers were not doing much of the cooking. This seems a reasonable interpretation until further real evidence is produced.

[sonnyboyx2]

I remember a slightly higher figure being mentioned. Is the $14 million a reference to a potential fight with Tyson?

I'm of the opinion Lewis took the, I believe $4/5 million, because Tyson was not going to fight him. The money he accepted is better than no money.

At that point he had already been unsuccessful in his attempts to get the Tyson-Bruno fight stopped, due to his claim as mandatory challenger, despite that attempt failing he was successful in petitioning the WBC for his right as mandatory challenger to be Tyson's first opponent when he defended the title.

King gave this lip service as Lewis was not a fighter he promoted and was considered a greater risk than the opponents King had mapped out for Tyson.

Seldon, a King fighter, had already been marked as Tyson's next opponent - Lewis had little option other than to protest, which he did and led the WBC to announce before the fight that their title was not being contested - Lewis had rights to Tyson first defense and if Seldon defeated Tyson the WBC title would become vacant - then allowing Lewis to contest for it.

Lewis and his team, like the rest of the boxing community knew King had Tyson-Holyfield lined up next, so taking his money was sensible.

A point not often mentioned in this case is that Lewis did have an exclusive promotional deal with HBO, Tyson with Showtime - so as we know, the chance of a fight coming off was slim to zero.



There is a lot of information on this never-to-be fight and that's no doubt correct, it was a very good offer for the time period too.

I'm not really aware of any serious talks taking place in 1995.



Pass, don't know on this one - but if he never returned to the ring then it was no longer a career option.

Make of this what you will:
The World Boxing Council wants Tyson to defend against Lennox Lewis of England, a former champion and now its No. 1 contender. Lewis turned down a $13.5 million guarantee to fight Tyson. Lewis then accepted $4 million from King to step aside and allow Tyson to fight Seldon, with the proviso that Tyson, assuming he beat Seldon, would fight Lewis next. Tyson is expected to receive $30 million for fighting Seldon.
http://www.nytimes.com/1996/07/04/sp...l?pagewanted=2

The $13.5 million offer was reported in the NY Times prior to Tyson's scheduled fight with Seldon July 1996 (the fight was postponed0.

BOXING MONTHLY June 1996 reports a $10 million offer before the Mercer-Lewis fight and says :

"Tyson and King, have paid Lewis $4 million as a step-aside fee so that tyson can go ahead with his challenge to WBA champ Bruce Seldon at the MGM Grand, Las Vegas on 13 July. Much of that money may be used to cover the legal fees that Lewis's handlers in Britain, Panix Promotions, and the USA, Main events, have spent fighting his case in U.S. courts.

Lewis prefers to look upon the huge step-aside fee as a sign that Tyson is scared of him. "If Tyson is so confident, why will he pay not to fight me ?" he asks.

The counter-question could be asked that if Lewis was so confident, why did he turn down $10 million, the highest purse of Lewis's career, for a fight with Tyson, an offer made prior to the Mercer fight ?

Lewis can think what he likes, but the truth is $4 million is relative chicken feed to the Tyson industry. Tyson will likely earn another $30 million payday for trashing Seldon and can well afford to spend a little in order to shut out Lewis for a while longer.

Tyson himself will not be scared of Lewis, least of all after having seen the trouble Mercer caused him. but he and his handlers will resent being pushed around by a "Duva-friendly" judge in New Jersey. Essentially, they have spent $4 million in order to regroup and buy time before deciding their next move."

[Anthony342]

Sounds more like King was avoiding Lewis to give Tyson bigger paydays before making the Lewis fight finally happen. Plus there was them being on two different networks to work out. And the Holyfield fight showed some potential, which would be jeopardized by a loss to Lewis. Sounds more like it was a combination of King and Tyson's camp waiting a little longer until after fighting Holyfield and working out the details between HBO and Showtime. I doubt very much Lewis was afraid of anyone. There's a clip after Bowe beats Holyfield for the undisputed title where Lewis later steps up and trash talks Bowe to try to psych him out and to hype a title fight, as Lewis became the mandatory WBC contender. There might have been some fear early in Lewis' career, but I doubt it, especially after he started training with Stewart.

[them_apples]

Sounds more like King was avoiding Lewis to give Tyson bigger paydays before making the Lewis fight finally happen. Plus there was them being on two different networks to work out. And the Holyfield fight showed some potential, which would be jeopardized by a loss to Lewis. Sounds more like it was a combination of King and Tyson's camp waiting a little longer until after fighting Holyfield and working out the details between HBO and Showtime. I doubt very much Lewis was afraid of anyone. There's a clip after Bowe beats Holyfield for the undisputed title where Lewis later steps up and trash talks Bowe to try to psych him out and to hype a title fight, as Lewis became the mandatory WBC contender. There might have been some fear early in Lewis' career, but I doubt it, especially after he started training with Stewart.

Starting to think that's what Mayweather did...smart I suppose, not fan friendly though.

[Anthony342]

Yeah kind of like Leonard waiting about 5 more years to finally fight Hagler.

[billeau2]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=81non05aKX4

Charlie Burley.

This guy does a few of these vids and hits all the high notes. Its often been said that because there is not a lot of footage of Burley one could not ascertain his greatness....I beg to differ. As a martial artist I can look at the way a person moves for a few minutes and probably figure out when they were tiolet trained! kidding but seriously watching how one executes technique for a minute can indicate how well trained hs/she is and how evolved the individual is as a martial artist.

Burley's economy of motion is superb. When getting clinched watch Charlie drop his weight and make the other guy throw him around....as he is being thrown, at the last minute he positions himself advantageosly. The net result is the other guy wasting energy and Charlie going along for the ride to arrive at his destination.

Burley's lateral movement is superb....In martial arts people training for ten years and under often immediately take an angle to an attack....thats cool. But the next step is to start off judging the distance so you can move naturally back, or fowards a few steps and then assume the angle. This has the effect of being deceptive. Charlie does this by feinting back from a punch to the point where it looks like he is running out of room...But this allows him to watch the attack develop, respond at the last minute to be more evasive, and to assume the best angle of counter attack.

The author hits a lot more high notes about Burley, He discusses false fighting lines, footwork and how Burley is so unflappable.

[The Old LefHook]

Fkip to about 8:40 on this video. One analyft I read claims that Robinfon feinted a right to the body before the KO lefhook. He had juft thrown two rights to the body. Admittedly, fome feints are very fubtle, efpecially eye feints. I do not fee a right feint to the body before the lefhook, which does not mean it is not there.

Does anyone elfe fee a feint before the lefhook?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rdROjwy34qU

[billeau2]

Fkip to about 8:40 on this video. One analyft I read claims that Robinfon feinted a right to the body before the KO lefhook. He had juft thrown two rights to the body. Admittedly, fome feints are very fubtle, efpecially eye feints. I do not fee a right feint to the body before the lefhook, which does not mean it is not there.

Does anyone elfe fee a feint before the lefhook?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rdROjwy34qU

Good question! It looks to me like ever so slightly Robinson gave body language to suggest the feint before throwing the hook. The problem is that the feint if thrown, is so subtle I doubt the opponent would have picked it up! I do think it is in there though.

Edit just watched again....its there! Not really so subtle after all.