Best defensive fighters NOT named Whitaker, Pep, Locche, Mayweather

[Sugar Adam Ali]

Nunn landed plenty, he was clearly well ahead in the fight before the stoppage you don't do that by landing nothing.

What's defense really about? Evading punches. Well Toney got hit a lot, at every stage if his career, they aren't the only fight he got hit a lot in.

Toney has good defense but I don't see how he's in these kind of discussions when he got hit the amount he did.

People use his lack of discipline as an excuse but Benitez, Locche had the same problems and got his way less than Toney did.

Toney in his prime years was hit consistently and easily by Dave Tiberi, excuses or not that's telling.

Good defense, nice flashy counter punches but I don't see how his defense is on the level of Floyd, Whitaker, Benitez etc

Nunn landed nothing of substance... He had the reach and just flickered the jab all night from the outside, and toney, like he did with roy jones, would let guys especially movers tag him so he could get them close and bomb back,, worked vs nunn, failed vs jones..
In the nunn fight, I think nunn landed a nice straight down the pipe half way thru the fight, and that's about it..

But anyways... I guess toney is an enigma because I really can't argue too much against your points, but simply put, toney becoming fat and past his prime but able to deal with the likes of jirov, Rahman, etc and not getting blasted out is one, if not the greatest defensive feat I have ever seen with my own eyes..
I just don't see any other defenders doing that... They may have success vs a guy a division higher, but toney was way way up in weight.. Started fighting 160 guys and now was fighting guys 245... That's just crazy, and throw in the fact that he was a fat tub of goo and hardly trained and it makes it even more amazing..

[Suckmedry]

A few valid points and that's why I don't have toney as the goat defender.. But a lot of the fights you mentioned, like the Tiberi fight, clearly isn't the best version of toney... Toney never had the consistency from fight to fight, and he had bad ring generalship... Toney's chin was so good, I think he would allow guys to come beat him alittle just so he could hit a big counter and get them out of there..
Nunn I thought never really landed flush but once or twice.. Mccallum did, but when your fighting the best your gonna get tagged a bit.. Reggie only caught him with one huge bomb that changed the fight if memory serves correct, I don't think he did much beforehand...

Floyd has gone up in weight, but he is fighting at a natural weight.. Guys fill out and rise in weight, especially the guys that turn pro at college age, mid 20s they fill out, and by early 30s they fill out some more....
Toneys range is 160-175.. That's his fighting weight, but toney became fat and still was able to defend against the bombs of Rahman, Peter, evander... Let floyd get back and rise 40 pounds past 147 and there is no way with all his ability would he be able to hold off kovolev or Marco huck

Toney was his own worst enemy, and had some shaky performances, but that shouldn't derail what he did when he was motivated and serious about a fight..

Anyways, my only point is I don't think you can call toney an overrated defender.. Def not the greatest, but def not overrated either

You know whats going on bro. very accurate assessment of Toney.

[IronDanHamza]

Nunn landed nothing of substance... He had the reach and just flickered the jab all night from the outside, and toney, like he did with roy jones, would let guys especially movers tag him so he could get them close and bomb back,, worked vs nunn, failed vs jones..
In the nunn fight, I think nunn landed a nice straight down the pipe half way thru the fight, and that's about it..

But anyways... I guess toney is an enigma because I really can't argue too much against your points, but simply put, toney becoming fat and past his prime but able to deal with the likes of jirov, Rahman, etc and not getting blasted out is one, if not the greatest defensive feat I have ever seen with my own eyes..
I just don't see any other defenders doing that... They may have success vs a guy a division higher, but toney was way way up in weight.. Started fighting 160 guys and now was fighting guys 245... That's just crazy, and throw in the fact that he was a fat tub of goo and hardly trained and it makes it even more amazing..

How can you be clearly well ahead in a fight if you land nothing? It's impossible.

Nunn landed punches and plenty of them.

I don't know, we can't say because those fighters don't get fat and go up to ****** weight classes due to being fat.

Like I said, his chin is better than his defense, he got hit plenty at HW aswell.

Got hit plenty at cruiserweight against Jirov.

He's been hit a lot every weight class he's fought in.

Which defeats the purpose of defense.

Yeah he does slip punches very well at times, avoids punches well at times, lands nice flashy counters at times, but he's not consistent with it. I think it's easy to just look at the good points and ignore the bad ones. And Toney has plenty of bad ones.

I'm a fan of Toney and he does have a good defense I'm not dis*****g that but like I said it's overrated, it's not as good as people make out.

[Suckmedry]

I didn't exactly mean toney had the best defence ever, my point is that his defence always leaves him in position to counter, and often on a very off balanced opponent. Which is lethal in this sport.

[IronDanHamza]

I didn't exactly mean toney had the best defence ever, my point is that his defence always leaves him in position to counter, and often on a very off balanced opponent. Which is lethal in this sport.

You're not incorrect in that.

He also gets hit, a lot.

Doesn't that defeat the purpose of defending?

[kiDynamite92]

Nunn landed plenty, he was clearly well ahead in the fight before the stoppage you don't do that by landing nothing.

What's defense really about? Evading punches. Well Toney got hit a lot, at every stage if his career, they aren't the only fight he got hit a lot in.

Toney has good defense but I don't see how he's in these kind of discussions when he got hit the amount he did.

People use his lack of discipline as an excuse but Benitez, Locche had the same problems and got his way less than Toney did.

Toney in his prime years was hit consistently and easily by Dave Tiberi, excuses or not that's telling.

Good defense, nice flashy counter punches but I don't see how his defense is on the level of Floyd, Whitaker, Benitez etc

I thought that was more because of Toneys inactivity.

[IronDanHamza]

I thought that was more because of Toneys inactivity.

It was but you need to do something to win a fight.

[kiDynamite92]

Also Toney didn't use his feet as much as Floyd did. His defence was more based on angles and waiting to land the counter. When you're in the pocket as often you're bound to get hit more then when you're moving around.

[kiDynamite92]

It was but you need to do something to win a fight.

Well he did when it counted

[IronDanHamza]

Well he did when it counted

Ha yeah I'm obviously not dis*****g he pulled it out he knocked him out.

My point is Nunn was well ahead, you have to land punches to do that.