Muhammad Ali was not a great fighter

[rickypryor]

In other words....

Well, Butterfly, in reponse to your questions and concerns......I did say ....."If we leave ALL hype behind and all egos and favorites behind and counter-scenarios of who would have won out of any Heavyweight Champion in the History of Boxing and look at JUST the records".

I am not for any Heavyweight Boxer nor do I have favorites cause I have my dislikes of every boxer regardless of weight-class. But, for the record, WINNING IS WINNING and Rocky marciano PROVED that he was the greatest of his era, not ducking ANYONE who challenged him including an aged Joe Louis. My take on Marciano fighting Louis: If you're tough enough to talk **** and step in the damn ring even at that age Louis was, you'd better bring your A+ Fighting Game cause that's your ass if you lose. The same goes for Walcott and Charles, I don't care if you're a Middleweight or Light-Heavyweight, if you think you're the ****, then PROVE it in the RING. Obviously, they couldn't against Marciano. And---it doesn't matter if Marciano was losing to Walcott, who eventually won is what counts......Oh yeah, Marciano by KO, not mostly decisions like Ali.

Another reason why I think Ali is not the greatest is him having physical advantages over other fighters:

1. Ali ALWAYS used his REACH to his benefit, he hardly ever had to duck or bob and weave to get in ANY of his opponents. (83" Reach)

2. He was a tall Heavyweight (6' 3") that towered over the 5'11 Joe Frazier who knocked Ali out.....***

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In the replying words of Roger Mayweather to Antonio Margarito as he talked Mayweather down and saying he could beat him in his Prime......."You ain't even in my time, Know Ya' DAMN HISTORY!"

[SuzieQ49]

sure rickypryor, marciano is the greatest. i guess that's why he was almost ko'd by a 42yr. old middleweight with one punch, huh? i guess thats why bums like lastarza could embarrass him but still get robbed? i guess that's why marciano is the most overrated piece of crap hw ever in the history of boxing? marciano is only the greatest to white facist ******s who need a white to be their savior. marciano was nothing but a bum who fought other bums. if he fought any top ten hw he would be crushed! guys like ali and holmes would have cut him up and embarrased him. johnson, louis, lewis, dempsey and frazier would methodically beat him down with ease. and foreman liston and tyson would just jump all over that little bum and kill him! marciano is just an over-hyped, unskilled cruiserweight who will only be known as "the greatest" to some because of his skin color.

wow i didnt realize you were like this until now. is butterfly always like this?

[butterfly1964]

wow i didnt realize you were like this until now. is butterfly always like this?

i just get so irate when people make marciano into god or something. it's just sickening.

[butterfly1964]

butterfly...why u always gotta bring race into it, it has nothing to do with race, what if ali was white u prolly wouldnt b hanging on his nuts so hard, although the 49-0 record is great it wasnt exactly a great title reign, which is why i dislike marciano. but bringing skin color into it is just dumb, mayb thats the reason u like ali so much cause u wish u were black..

why else would someone tout marciano as some unstoppable juggernaut, even though the man was obviously unskilled, small and fought mostly small bums.

and number one, i am black. but me being black has nothing to do with it. jack dempsey is white but he is one of my favorite fighters, and i never talk bad about him. i realize that the man was great and he was very skilled, skilled enough so you can say that he could have beaten great fighters from other era's, something you can't say about marciano.

[Heckler]

Well, Butterfly, in reponse to your questions and concerns......I did say ....."If we leave ALL hype behind and all egos and favorites behind and counter-scenarios of who would have won out of any Heavyweight Champion in the History of Boxing and look at JUST the records".

I am not for any Heavyweight Boxer nor do I have favorites cause I have my dislikes of every boxer regardless of weight-class. But, for the record, WINNING IS WINNING and Rocky marciano PROVED that he was the greatest of his era, not ducking ANYONE who challenged him including an aged Joe Louis. My take on Marciano fighting Louis: If you're tough enough to talk **** and step in the damn ring even at that age Louis was, you'd better bring your A+ Fighting Game cause that's your ass if you lose. The same goes for Walcott and Charles, I don't care if you're a Middleweight or Light-Heavyweight, if you think you're the ****, then PROVE it in the RING. Obviously, they couldn't against Marciano. And---it doesn't matter if Marciano was losing to Walcott, who eventually won is what counts......Oh yeah, Marciano by KO, not mostly decisions like Ali.

Another reason why I think Ali is not the greatest is him having physical advantages over other fighters:

1. Ali ALWAYS used his REACH to his benefit, he hardly ever had to duck or bob and weave to get in ANY of his opponents. (83" Reach)

2. He was a tall Heavyweight (6' 3") that towered over the 5'11 Joe Frazier who knocked Ali out.....***

-----------------------------------------------------------------

In the replying words of Roger Mayweather to Antonio Margarito as he talked Mayweather down and saying he could beat him in his Prime......."You ain't even in my time, Know Ya' DAMN HISTORY!"

Wait, so Ali isn't great because he had physical advantages right. Marciano was gifted with punching power, so hes not a great fighter. Lennox lewis height and size. George Foreman Strength and Size. Joe Louis a naturally gifted puncher, guess hes not that great either. Mike Tyson is short like Marciano and Frazier so that allows him to use a crouching style more effectively thus they all suck too.

if im not mistaken Frazier merely knocked Ali down and he got up straight away? No you're probably right, who am i to argue with a person that has such a strong grasp on logic and boxing history?

[Yogi]

is butterfly always like this?

Yeah, he's prone to saying some ****** stuff on here, no doubt...but he's like that ******ed little brother that we all wished we had, and we usually give him the benefit of the doubt because of his 'limitations'.

[butterfly1964]

Yeah, he's prone to saying some ****** stuff on here, no doubt...but he's like that ******ed little brother that we all wished we had, and we usually give him the benefit of the doubt because of his 'limitations'.

haha, yogi i have limitations, but i'm smart enough to know that many fighters could have beaten marciano and that the best fighters he beat were blown up to begin with. marciano is the most built up fighter of all time. a major reason for this is in fact his skin color. if marciano was black, then i'm sure many of you would not rank him as high as you do. most of you just saw joe louis a black man dominating for twelve years, and you just were waiting for someone like marciano to come along so you could just jump on his bandwagon.

[Yogi]

haha, yogi i have limitations, but i'm smart enough to know that many fighters could have beaten marciano and that the best fighters he beat were blown up to begin with. marciano is the most built up fighter of all time. a major reason for this is in fact his skin color. if marciano was black, then i'm sure many of you would not rank him as high as you do. most of you just saw joe louis a black man dominating for twelve years, and you just were waiting for someone like marciano to come along so you could just jump on his bandwagon.

I'm admittedly a bit of a Marciano fan, Butterfly, but please don't include me in that group that sees him as some kind of God-like figure...I'd have him in the all-time top ten at Heavyweight in terms of overall greatness (and as I've said in the past, I try not to factor in head-to-head mythical matchups into my rankings), but it would be towards the bottom half of such a list.

In my opinion, some people do overrate Marciano, but at the same time some people underrate him.

[butterfly1964]

I'm admittedly a bit of a Marciano fan, Butterfly, but please don't include me in that group that sees him as some kind of God-like figure...I'd have him in the all-time top ten at Heavyweight in terms of overall greatness (and as I've said in the past, I try not to factor in head-to-head mythical matchups into my rankings), but it would be towards the bottom half of such a list.

In my opinion, some people do overrate Marciano, but at the same time some people underrate him.

well as long as you know many fighters would beat him, you're cool with me.

[The_One77]

Marciano was great but certainly not the greatest, his record dosen't have the great opposition that is required for him to be the greatest heavyweight champion ever.
It's as simple as that