Klitschko Brothers would murder midget Joe Louis

[Die Antwoord]

It's degrading calling Louis a midget.

The way i see it you can say all you want about the klits beating anybody in history. Heck I've argued that they'd fair very well against the greats, but don't expect all to agree and dont expect anybody to take a poster like the TS serious.

I personally list Louis as the greatest HW of all time. Do I think he could beat the Klitschko's? No. Why? because I believe, and I am backed up by legitimate science and research, that there has been evolutions in the athlete over the last 30 years. Whether its steroids or PEDS, or jsut the fact that there are more healthy people on earth along with more knowledge on how to recover from injuries (Vitali for example would be done and wouldnt have had a comeback) and proper nutrition and weight lifting which is used by many heavyweights etc... I wont get into ,but I believe athletes in all sports have evolved. I think Dwight Howard, may not be as good as Mican, but he would destroy him if they played. I think Jesse Owens is a legend, a hero, and one of the greatest athletes of all time, that doesnt change the fact that in a gym named after him, last week 6 COLLEGE runners torched his best world record time.

I dont think its fair to compare eras, yet people on this board do it all the time and disparage the modern day guys. That is the difference and those are the reactionary posts. I wouldnt call Louis a midget, but the fact is he is over 6 inches shorter than Vitali, he would look small compared to Vitali. Spitz would look small compared to Phelps, Owens would look tiny compared to Bolt...its happening in every sport. I believe in that theory, most sports scientists also believe in that theory.

I also believe that usually in boxing the significantly bigger and stronger guy wins. Not always, but usually, I think size matters. You couple size and strength with some skill using it to his advantage and 9/10 that fighter will win. How many guys ridicule mayweather for fighting guys 2 pounds lighter than him?

So yes while I do think Louis is greater than the Klitschko's, head to head...I dont see him beating either one of them. The game has changed. But yet, that belief even backed up by sports scientists, and history etc...is considered trolling.

The Kltischko's are both hw champions with multiple defenses. Vitali has never been down on the cards, or down in a fight and Wlad has been one of the most dominant HW's in history since 2005. Saying theyd beat anyone isnt trolling. They arent journeymen, they are heavyweight champions right now doing things that havent been done before and being completely dominant.

Its like i dont view it as trolling if someone were to say Louis would beat a Klitschko, I do view it as trolling if someone says someone half their size with half their resume would though. Or just blatant lies like Cleveland Williams was as big as Vitali.

[StarshipTrooper]

On second thought having someone moderate this place couldn't be a bad thing at all. Not just anyone should be allowed to post this rehashed garbage in here.

Agreed. Too many posters trying to stir things up with the most outragerous arguments lately.

For the record, I've made a new thread in Comments and Suggestions regarding the spate of trolling I've witnessed today and renewed the call for a mod for Boxing History. I've also blocked every name I've seen trolling in this section over the past two months from posting in it.

Poet

[Die Antwoord]

If you know him, you know how he gets. Trust me, there would hardly be a mention of Wladimir Klitschko if it wasn't for all these bait threads. And even if he did mention them, it hardly excuses making thread after thread about the same subject, putting down all-time greats for no other reason than to spite some posters that you dislike.

What thread have I made, and how is it degrading Louis to say a klitschko would beat them. They are heavyweight champions dominating. Vitali is 39 years old and hasnt lost a round in 7 years or something. Wlad takes on top 5 ranked guys fight after fight, and is never in trouble and punishes them. Its not degrading to say one dominant HW champion would beat another, especially if they have 6 inches and 50 pounds on the guy. The fact you think thats degrading is reasons why posts like these are made.

[Die Antwoord]

For the record, I've made a new thread in Comments and Suggestions regarding the spate of trolling I've witnessed today and renewed the call for a mod for Boxing History. I've also blocked every name I've seen trolling in this section over the past two months from posting in it.

Poet

This guys the biggest troll of them all. I simply said I thought Tyson hit harder than shavers...my first post and the dude came back with a ton of insults......thats called trolling.

[Die Antwoord]

Also trolling is when you say something just to anger someone or thats just for attention. I think this guy along with many others including myself really believe that Klitschko would beat Louis. Does Sonnyboy really believe that journeymen coke fiends from the 80's would beat a Klitschko? If not, thats trolling. That is the definition of trolling.

People are allowed to have opinions. I didnt read on the terms of service that opinions that werent popular with TheGreatA were forbidden.

The guy thinks a heavyweight champion with a huge size advantage would win in a fight...OMG!!!!!!!TROLL!!!!!!!!!!

The midget comment was unneccessary. I understand that. But its not some ridiculous statement and he clearly believes it and its backed up by science and history and every other sport where athletes have gotten bigger and mroe athletic and where sports have gotten more global.

Heck, globalization has improved the athlete perhaps more than anything. More foreigners now in the NBA and in baseball than ever. I guess all the good American athletes have moved to football? Thats the last sport completely dominated by Americans and its really just not played anywhere else.

Its an opinion you may not agree with. Thats not trolling.

[StarshipTrooper]

Also trolling is when you say something just to anger someone or thats just for attention. I think this guy along with many others including myself really believe that Klitschko would beat Louis. Does Sonnyboy really believe that journeymen coke fiends from the 80's would beat a Klitschko? If not, thats trolling. That is the definition of trolling.

People are allowed to have opinions. I didnt read on the terms of service that opinions that werent popular with TheGreatA were forbidden.

The guy thinks a heavyweight champion with a huge size advantage would win in a fight...OMG!!!!!!!TROLL!!!!!!!!!!

The midget comment was unneccessary. I understand that. But its not some ridiculous statement and he clearly believes it and its backed up by science and history and every other sport where athletes have gotten bigger and mroe athletic and where sports have gotten more global.

Heck, globalization has improved the athlete perhaps more than anything. More foreigners now in the NBA and in baseball than ever. I guess all the good American athletes have moved to football? Thats the last sport completely dominated by Americans and its really just not played anywhere else.

Its an opinion you may not agree with. Thats not trolling.

Idiots are indeed entitled to opinions. They are also entitled to be told to shut up and sit down by their intellectual betters.....which is damn near everyone.

Poet

[Die Antwoord]

Idiots are indeed entitled to opinions. They are also entitled to be told to shut up and sit down by their intellectual betters.....which is damn near everyone.

Poet

You are a troll. I especially love this guy, he spells words like eligible phonetically and then insults peoples intelligence in the same sentence. Real winner here people.

[sonnyboyx2]

I personally list Louis as the greatest HW of all time. Do I think he could beat the Klitschko's? No. Why? because I believe, and I am backed up by legitimate science and research, that there has been evolutions in the athlete over the last 30 years. Whether its steroids or PEDS, or jsut the fact that there are more healthy people on earth along with more knowledge on how to recover from injuries (Vitali for example would be done and wouldnt have had a comeback) and proper nutrition and weight lifting which is used by many heavyweights etc... I wont get into ,but I believe athletes in all sports have evolved. I think Dwight Howard, may not be as good as Mican, but he would destroy him if they played. I think Jesse Owens is a legend, a hero, and one of the greatest athletes of all time, that doesnt change the fact that in a gym named after him, last week 6 COLLEGE runners torched his best world record time.

I dont think its fair to compare eras, yet people on this board do it all the time and disparage the modern day guys. That is the difference and those are the reactionary posts. I wouldnt call Louis a midget, but the fact is he is over 6 inches shorter than Vitali, he would look small compared to Vitali. Spitz would look small compared to Phelps, Owens would look tiny compared to Bolt...its happening in every sport. I believe in that theory, most sports scientists also believe in that theory.

I also believe that usually in boxing the significantly bigger and stronger guy wins. Not always, but usually, I think size matters. You couple size and strength with some skill using it to his advantage and 9/10 that fighter will win. How many guys ridicule mayweather for fighting guys 2 pounds lighter than him?

So yes while I do think Louis is greater than the Klitschko's, head to head...I dont see him beating either one of them. The game has changed. But yet, that belief even backed up by sports scientists, and history etc...is considered trolling.

The Kltischko's are both hw champions with multiple defenses. Vitali has never been down on the cards, or down in a fight and Wlad has been one of the most dominant HW's in history since 2005. Saying theyd beat anyone isnt trolling. They arent journeymen, they are heavyweight champions right now doing things that havent been done before and being completely dominant.

Its like i dont view it as trolling if someone were to say Louis would beat a Klitschko, I do view it as trolling if someone says someone half their size with half their resume would though. Or just blatant lies like Cleveland Williams was as big as Vitali.

Boxing has NOT evolved like other sports have... are you claiming

Vitali & Wlad Klitschko would beat Muhammad Ali
Bernard Hopkins would beat Ezzard Charles
Sergio Martinez would beat Harry Grebb
Floyd Mayweather would beat Ray Robinson
Manny Pacquiao would beat Ike Williams
Paul Williams would beat Thomas Hearns
Tim Bradley would beat Aaron Pryor
Juan Manuel Lopez would beat Alexis Arguello
Fernando Montiel would beat Ruben Olivares

If its like what you claim then the answer would be Yes but every single boxing fan the world over knows that the answer to all the above match-ups is NO

You need to get real, it is obvious to all that you have zero knowledge of boxing history and that you are very new to the sport... Size & Weight in the sport of Heavyweight Boxing are a handicap its speed & ability that count...you cannot build muscle on your chin which is why we seen Corrie Sanders destroy Wlad Klitschko who is slow with limited skills... Vitali Klitschko has never fought any fighter other than Lennox Lewis who was above Class C level... who are Albert Sosnowski, Kevin Johnson & Chris Arreola who he has fought recently... they are bums and they fought like Class D fighters not like Billy Conn, Jersey Joe Walcott & Tommy Farr did against Joe Louis.... Today's Heavyweight Boxing is the worst era in the history of the sport.

[TheGreatA]

The thread is obviously not about Joe Louis. It's not really even about the Klitschko brothers. It's just an unnecessary attack towards the regulars of this section, and the section itself.

If you wanted to talk boxing, you'd talk boxing, not whether Klitschko would "murder" midget Louis or not. Even this "Wladimir is 50 pounds bigger + more evolved" argument is the kind of superficial talk that you don't expect to hear in a Boxing History section, you expect the arguments to delve deeper.

Get this, boxing is not your average sport. It's fighting. In tennis, you play for points, you don't pay with physical punishment for every mistake you make. In sprinting, you repeat the same exercise over and over, obviously you'll get better and better at it, especially when equipments have improved. Men may have gotten more athletic, but in boxing you do not need to be a super athlete to compete. Toughness counts for a lot, and men sure haven't gotten tougher.

Louis is a 6'2, 205 pound man with speed and power in his fists. He can knock out anybody if he hits them right. He beat men who were over 6'5, 250+ lbs. He reigned as undisputed champion for over a decade. I wouldn't count the man's chances out against anybody, even Wladimir Klitschko, who can be beaten, as proven by Corrie Sanders, a part-time fighter. So it comes down to whose style and abilities is more suited to dealing with the other. Is it Louis's patient stalking, explosive counters and great finishing? Or Wladimir's ability to control the distance with his jab, his ability to tie a man up on the inside and wear them out until lowering the boom? Whatever it is, you should get out of here with this "evolution" garbage. If anything it has devolved with boxers being taught half the tricks they used to know.

[TheGreatA]

To disprove this supposed "evolution", would you argue that the fighters of today are far superior to the fighters of the early 1980's?

Which means essentially this line up

1. Manny Pacquiao
2. Floyd Mayweather Jr.
3. Juan Manuel Marquez
4. Nonito Donaire
5. Shane Mosley
6. Paul Williams
7. Sergio Martinez
8. Pongsaklek Wonjongkam
9. Fernando Montiel
10. Wladimir Klitschko

against this

Ray Leonard, Thomas Hearns, Marvin Hagler, Roberto Duran, Aaron Pryor, Alexis Arguello, Larry Holmes, Michael Spinks, Salvador Sanchez, Wilfredo Gomez, Wilfred Benitez, etc.

Now today's top 2 could compete with anybody, although first they should compete against each other, and Wladimir has turned out to be a very good heavyweight champions despite early struggles, but the rest? Mosley and Wongjonkam have already seen their best days, around 10 years ago, while the likes of Donaire, Martinez and Montiel do not quite match up with the past greats of their respective weight divisions, atleast in accomplishment.

In short, it's very difficult to make a case for today's era rating above the early 80's. But you wouldn't pick a runner from 30 years ago to be successful in today's competition.