Top 10 heavyweights from diffirent era's

[sonnyboyx2]

I'd actually say Buster Mathis and Tony Galento have more a claim to that title, but thats just me.

David Tua at 5`10ins and 245lb was heavier than both Galento (233lb) and Mathis (243lb) when they fought for the world title.... Mathis was a huge guy who was over 6ft 3ins tall... David Tua is claimed to have one of the best chins in boxing but he never fought any top punchers, his management kept him away from punchers knowing that Tua got starched in less than a round by Felix Savon, whenever in his career he fought a guy who had even limited punch-power Tua got wobbled when him on the chin... Tua is vastly over-rated

[JAB5239]

David Tua at 5`10ins and 245lb was heavier than both Galento (233lb) and Mathis (243lb) when they fought for the world title.... Mathis was a huge guy who was over 6ft 3ins tall... David Tua is claimed to have one of the best chins in boxing but he never fought any top punchers, his management kept him away from punchers knowing that Tua got starched in less than a round by Felix Savon, whenever in his career he fought a guy who had even limited punch-power Tua got wobbled when him on the chin... Tua is vastly over-rated

Though Tua was certainly a good 20lbs heavier than his best weight in the latter part of his career, he was still solid and well muscled. Mathis with fine skills was flabby as hell and Galento trained on beer and cigars. That was my only point.

[mickey malone]

Mickey.. being knocked out does not place you below a guy who has not been KOd... Ezzard Charles, Sonny Liston, Floyd Patterson, Evander Holyfield, Mike Tyson etc etc was all KOd but David Tua is nowhere near as good as those... the difference with Tua & Witherspoon, Page, Tubbs, Thomas, Coetzee, Dokes, Weaver and Berbick is that those fighters won a world title at the top level where as Tua failed at the top level losing every round to Chris Byrd and virtually every round to Lennox Lewis... David Tua will always be remembered as "The Fattest man to ever fight for the Title"

As for John Ruiz vs David Haye... i will get back to you nearer the fight (should it happen) and we can have a little wager of some kind.

Oh yes it does, otherwise you wouldn't be so profoundly critical towards Lewis's KO defeats at the hands of McCall and Rahman.. Besides, the point I was making had more to do with Tua never once being in any kind of serious trouble in any fight despite competing several rounds with many noted punchers..
Rahman, Maskaev, Sullivan, Izon, Ibeabuchi, Moorer and Lewis all have terrific KO ratios..

When you say about the difference between Tua & the heavies from 80-85, being that they all won a title at top level.. What you have to remember is it was the same WBA title being tossed about from one scrappy decision to another amongst themselves..

Dokes takes it from Weaver, then Coetzee takes it from Dokes, then Page takes it from Coetzze, then Witherspoon takes it from Page, then Thomas takes it from Witherspoon, then Berbick takes it from Thomas, and so on.. I t really was a mess in those days, especially when you consider that with the exception of Witherspoon, not one of them could hold a flame to the 'Real' champ, Larry Holmes.. that's why Tua stands a 50/50 chance against all of them..

Here's a list of Class C tomato cans..

Everett Martin - beat Witherspoon
Mark Wills - beat Page
Marvis Frazier - beat Smith
Mike Hunter - beat Thomas
Lional Butler - beat Tubbs
ST Gordon - beat Berbick

Even a 38 year old Tua beats those guys IMO..
Sorry about putting Hunter in there cos i know you like him, but Tua's done a lot more than he ever did..

[mickey malone]

David Tua at 5`10ins and 245lb was heavier than both Galento (233lb) and Mathis (243lb) when they fought for the world title.... Mathis was a huge guy who was over 6ft 3ins tall... David Tua is claimed to have one of the best chins in boxing but he never fought any top punchers, his management kept him away from punchers knowing that Tua got starched in less than a round by Felix Savon, whenever in his career he fought a guy who had even limited punch-power Tua got wobbled when him on the chin... Tua is vastly over-rated

Starched?.. Don't you mean stopped on his feet by a typically over-zealous amateur referee.. Tua was about 198lbs then..

[sonnyboyx2]

Oh yes it does, otherwise you wouldn't be so profoundly critical towards Lewis's KO defeats at the hands of McCall and Rahman.. Besides, the point I was making had more to do with Tua never once being in any kind of serious trouble in any fight despite competing several rounds with many noted punchers..
Rahman, Maskaev, Sullivan, Izon, Ibeabuchi, Moorer and Lewis all have terrific KO ratios..

When you say about the difference between Tua & the heavies from 80-85, being that they all won a title at top level.. What you have to remember is it was the same WBA title being tossed about from one scrappy decision to another amongst themselves..

Dokes takes it from Weaver, then Coetzee takes it from Dokes, then Page takes it from Coetzze, then Witherspoon takes it from Page, then Thomas takes it from Witherspoon, then Berbick takes it from Thomas, and so on.. I t really was a mess in those days, especially when you consider that with the exception of Witherspoon, not one of them could hold a flame to the 'Real' champ, Larry Holmes.. that's why Tua stands a 50/50 chance against all of them..

Here's a list of Class C tomato cans..

Everett Martin - beat Witherspoon
Mark Wills - beat Page
Marvis Frazier - beat Smith
Mike Hunter - beat Thomas
Lional Butler - beat Tubbs
ST Gordon - beat Berbick

Even a 38 year old Tua beats those guys IMO..
Sorry about putting Hunter in there cos i know you like him, but Tua's done a lot more than he ever did..

1/. if Chris Byrd can easily outpoint Tua then Mike Hunter would have completely demoralized him..
2/. The punch Mark Wills KOd Page with would have definately poleaxed David Tua or any other fighter
3/. Witherspoon was `Robbed` against Everett Martin

your entitled to your opinion.. yet IMO all those fighters beat David Tua... Tua never in his career fought anyone who could punch like Bonecrusher Smith, Tim Witherspoon or Pink Thomas... Tony Tubbs would easily outpoint Tua, as would Page & Berbick... you claim they tossed the WBA belt among themselves in the 80s ... yet this was down to Larry Holmes wanting no-part of them... Holmes was offered big money fights with Thomas but turned them down and the 3 which Holmes did fight he struggled dramatically with... Witherspoon on a split-dec, Berbick PTS over a hard 15rds and Smith very fortunate cuts stoppage........
Rahman, Maskaev, Sullivan, Izon, Ibeabuchi, Moorer and Lewis all have terrific KO ratios..they are not exactly murders row are they....

My gripe with Lewis is not over his 2 KO defeats... my gripe is over his choice of opponent and the men he avoided and refused to fight....So i will bear-in-mind your comment of "Oh yes it does" matter if a fighter has been KOd compaired to a fighter who has not been KOd.... you claim Nigel Benn to be one of your favourites but he was not as good as Eubank because Benn was KOd whereas Eubank wasnt.

[mickey malone]

1/. if Chris Byrd can easily outpoint Tua then Mike Hunter would have completely demoralized him..
2/. The punch Mark Wills KOd Page with would have definately poleaxed David Tua or any other fighter
3/. Witherspoon was `Robbed` against Everett Martin

your entitled to your opinion.. yet IMO all those fighters beat David Tua... Tua never in his career fought anyone who could punch like Bonecrusher Smith, Tim Witherspoon or Pink Thomas... Tony Tubbs would easily outpoint Tua, as would Page & Berbick... you claim they tossed the WBA belt among themselves in the 80s ... yet this was down to Larry Holmes wanting no-part of them... Holmes was offered big money fights with Thomas but turned them down and the 3 which Holmes did fight he struggled dramatically with... Witherspoon on a split-dec, Berbick PTS over a hard 15rds and Smith very fortunate cuts stoppage........
Rahman, Maskaev, Sullivan, Izon, Ibeabuchi, Moorer and Lewis all have terrific KO ratios..they are not exactly murders row are they....

My gripe with Lewis is not over his 2 KO defeats... my gripe is over his choice of opponent and the men he avoided and refused to fight....So i will bear-in-mind your comment of "Oh yes it does" matter if a fighter has been KOd compaired to a fighter who has not been KOd.... you claim Nigel Benn to be one of your favourites but he was not as good as Eubank because Benn was KOd whereas Eubank wasnt.

Without doubt, Byrd's best performance was against Tua, but he'd beat Hunter who struggled with guys like James Pritchard and Levi Billups.. In fact, I think he may have even lost to Billups..

Mark Wills had a record of 14-18-1 and a glass jaw.. Cannon fodder for Tua..

I agree, he was robbed and TBH, although Tua would have KO'd Martin, a prime Witherspoon beats a prime Tua..

And yes, they're all capable of beating him, providing they can avoid his left hook, and logic suggests, with the facts i've produced so far, that not all of them would..

With regard to the 3 beaten by Larry Holmes, only the fight with Witherspoon could be described as a dramatic struggle.. He controlled Berbick for 15, and Smith was the first to admit he'd been thoroughly outclassed at the end of their fight..

I don't rate fighters on how many times they've been KO'd, but fighters with good chins do tend to go a bit further in the game.. That's why most people rate Eubank a tadge higher than Benn, and Tua would stand a good chance against any HW in the world..

[sonnyboyx2]

[QUOTE=mickey malone;7316603]Without doubt, Byrd's best performance was against Tua, but he'd beat Hunter who struggled with guys like James Pritchard and Levi Billups.. In fact, I think he may have even lost to Billups..

Mark Wills had a record of 14-18-1 and a glass jaw.. Cannon fodder for Tua..

I agree, he was robbed and TBH, although Tua would have KO'd Martin, a prime Witherspoon beats a prime Tua..

And yes, they're all capable of beating him, providing they can avoid his left hook, and logic suggests, with the facts i've produced so far, that not all of them would..

With regard to the 3 beaten by Larry Holmes, only the fight with Witherspoon could be described as a dramatic struggle.. He controlled Berbick for 15, and Smith was the first to admit he'd been thoroughly outclassed at the end of their fight..

I don't rate fighters on how many times they've been KO'd, but fighters with good chins do tend to go a bit further in the game.. That's why most people rate Eubank a tadge higher than Benn, and Tua would stand a good chance against any HW in the world..[/QUote

The same Levi Billups who Lennox Lewis failed to KO yet every other heavyweight he fought took him out in 2rds or less..

i said the punch Mark Wills KOd Page with would have KOd any fighter and that includes Tua.. you obviously aint seen Wills vs Page.

Holmes IMO was very fortunate to get the win against Smith

you said "Oh yes i do" which i took to mean you rate a fighter who has not been KOd above one that has... ie: Larry Holmes has been KOd
David Tua has not been KOd

Tua has zero boxing ability so i give him no chance against the likes of Wlad, Vitali, Holyfield, Toney etc

Tua was wobbled by Ibeabuchi at the bell to end the 10th round and floored by Rahman in their last fight that was ruled a slip..... like i said earlier David Tua has been kept away from punchers all his career, and if you take away his 19 second win over John Ruiz and first round blow-out of Michael Moorer who was past it.. then David Tua is nothing more than a journeyman fighter... He beat Ruiz 14yrs ago but never ever wanted a return with Ruiz.. it was a `suprise punch` he caught Ruiz with, no-one has been able to reproduce that to Ruiz in 14yrs...

you have your opinions and i have mine which is fair enough as we are miles away from the topic question of Top 10 fighters of each era..

[mickey malone]

you have your opinions and i have mine which is fair enough as we are miles away from the topic question of Top 10 fighters of each era..

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Last edited by sonnyboyx2; Today at 03:10 AM.

Lol... I'm the only poster to answer 100% of the topic question, and it's only now that you're saying, 'we're miles off topic'!

So where are your lists then?..
Then we would have had something to compare mine to, but once again, you saw the names 'Lewis' and 'Tua', and the red mist of blind critisism decended..
Sonny, Everyone knows you don't rate them,so stop faffin about & show us ya lists.. It's only a hundred fighters, and shouldn't be too hard..

And going off topic (defending my listings), Don't you think it's strange, that neither of the Klitschko's have ever faced Tua, preferring the likes of Beck, Sanders, Kevin Johnson or a washed up Rahman.. I wonder why?
I agree that Moorer was past it, but Ruiz has had 14 years, to put a 19 second fluke behind him, and hasn't bothered.. Again, I wonder why?
The reason why, is that 'zero boxing ability' Tua is one of the most feared heavyweight contenders of all time, because he's stayed on his feet for 54 fights and put 43 of em to sleep..
'Oh yes i do' was actually 'Oh yes it does'... Which i used, only for that particular argument..
I was highlighting the fact that you have often said, 'If Rahman and McCall can KO Lewis, then anyone in the top 30 can'.. Please don't deny this, cos you know it's true.. I'd rate Patterson a lot higher than Tua, with Lewis & Tyson above Bowe and McCall as well as Tua, so i'm not out of context here..

[them_apples]

Ok i'll start with 2 decades:

2000s
1-Wladimir Klitschko
2-Vitali Klitschko
3-Lennox Lewis(Lower because he didn't have many fights)
4-Chris Byrd
5-David Tua
6-Oleg Maskaev
7-Lamon Brewster
8-Hasim Rahman
9-Jameel McCline
10-John Ruiz


1990s
1-Lennox Lewis
2-Evander Holyfield(I still think it's very close between him and Lewis)
3-Mike Tyson
4-Rid**** Bowe
5-George Foreman
6-David Tua
7-Tommy Morrison
8-Ray Mercer
9-Michael Moorer
10-Ike Ibeabuchi

80s
1-Mike Tyson
2-Larry Holmes
3-Tony Tucker
4-Tim Witherspoon
5-Pinklon Thomas
6-Michael Spinks
7-Carl Williams
8-Frank Bruno
9-James Smith
10-Tony Tubbs

70s
1-Muhammad Ali
2-George Foreman
3-Joe Frazier
4-Ken Norton
5-Ron Lyle
6-Jerry Quarry
7-Jimmy Young
8-Mac Foster
9-Joe Bugner
10-George Chuvalo

I'd have Holyfield as no.1 for the 90's, i'd put Lewis at no.2 for the 00's, I mean, he beat Vitali, who is above him. I'd put Bowe above Tyson in the 90's, Tyson lost 2 times to Holyfield where as Bowe won twice.

I think Holyfield steals the 90's, he fought everybody, beat a decent version of Tyson twice, got a win over Bowe and beat Foreman.

the 70's is spot on, as well as the 80's.

[sonnyboyx2]

you have your opinions and i have mine which is fair enough as we are miles away from the topic question of Top 10 fighters of each era..

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Last edited by sonnyboyx2; Today at 03:10 AM.

Lol... I'm the only poster to answer 100% of the topic question, and it's only now that you're saying, 'we're miles off topic'!

So where are your lists then?..
Then we would have had something to compare mine to, but once again, you saw the names 'Lewis' and 'Tua', and the red mist of blind critisism decended..
Sonny, Everyone knows you don't rate them,so stop faffin about & show us ya lists.. It's only a hundred fighters, and shouldn't be too hard..

And going off topic (defending my listings), Don't you think it's strange, that neither of the Klitschko's have ever faced Tua, preferring the likes of Beck, Sanders, Kevin Johnson or a washed up Rahman.. I wonder why?
I agree that Moorer was past it, but Ruiz has had 14 years, to put a 19 second fluke behind him, and hasn't bothered.. Again, I wonder why?
The reason why, is that 'zero boxing ability' Tua is one of the most feared heavyweight contenders of all time, because he's stayed on his feet for 54 fights and put 43 of em to sleep..
'Oh yes i do' was actually 'Oh yes it does'... Which i used, only for that particular argument..
I was highlighting the fact that you have often said, 'If Rahman and McCall can KO Lewis, then anyone in the top 30 can'.. Please don't deny this, cos you know it's true.. I'd rate Patterson a lot higher than Tua, with Lewis & Tyson above Bowe and McCall as well as Tua, so i'm not out of context here..

i said we are miles off the topic because i am the only one posting on your thread... i said i would not have David Tua as one of the top 10 fighters of the 90s... so now you are claiming i am "Bashing Lennox Lewis" by saying i dont rate Tua.... its the same old line, David Tua is Lennox Lewis claim to fame, take away his win over Tua and what is left... nothing!... and visa-versa.
i dont even want to go into it and educate you on it because i will be ****ing my head against a wall when i claim Butler, Grant, Botha, Fortune, Akinwande, Jackson, Mavrovic was all Class C fighters who never deserved a World Title fight... as you have already told me that fighters like "Izon, Sullivan, Daniels, Maskaev, Nicholson & Oquendo" are all World Class B+ fighters.......
yet you claim Trevor Berbick had only one good victory in his career when he beat Pink Thomas, arnt you forgetting Berbicks wins over John Tate, Muhammad Ali, Mitch Green, David Bey, Iran Barkley, Greg Page & Gordy Racette, he was still good enough in his mid-40s to fight Hasim Rahman to a decision....

IMO the Klitschko`s have never fought Tua because Tua has never been in a position to challenge them, i have also claimed many times that Hasim Rahman is the worst undisputed champion in history which puts into perspective David Tua who fought him to a draw and a disputed stoppage win when miles behind on the scorecards..John Ruiz easily took care of Rahman winning every round... Tua never ever wanted a return with John Ruiz.

as for my lists... they are almost the same as yours with the exception of the fighters i *****ied on your lists, and i have gave my views on why i *****ied them.. but you are twisting it around to insinuate that i am bashing Lennox Lewis when i call into question David Tua, which is quite ridiculous, i have given you my reasons for questioning Tua but you have not given me your theory of how that equates to Lewis bashing?