How high do you rank Larry Holmes in your all time rankings

[Willie Pep 229]

No, that's you just flapping your lips back and forth to avoid posting that list.

So let's make the challenge a nice 15.

15 HW Champions who should be ranked higher than Larry Holmes?

Criteria . . . Just joking, we'll both be very old before there is consensus on that . . .

to avoid the 'weak era' syndrome I am going H2H.

In my very humble opinion.

NOT IN RANKING ORDER (just off the top of my head)

ALI
LOUIS
LEWIS
TYSON
HOLYFIELD
DEMPSEY
TUNNEY
MARCIANO
FURY
JOHNSON
KLITSCHCKO
CHARLES
WALCOTT
LISTON
SPINKS

Anyone totally not deserve to be on the list?

[markusmod]

- - Shhhhhhhh-

Boxrec...

LOL!

[QueensburyRules]

So let's make the challenge a nice 15.

15 HW Champions who should be ranked higher than Larry Holmes?

Criteria . . . Just joking, we'll both be very old before there is consensus on that . . .

to avoid the 'weak era' syndrome I am going H2H.

In my very humble opinion.

NOT IN RANKING ORDER (just off the top of my head)

ALI
LOUIS
LEWIS
TYSON
HOLYFIELD
DEMPSEY
TUNNEY
MARCIANO
FURY
JOHNSON
KLITSCHCKO
CHARLES
WALCOTT
LISTON
SPINKS

Anyone totally not deserve to be on the list?

- - Head to head is interesting criteria, but mitigating rules and equipment in order to make such a fight in the day is seldom mentioned. It also crosses into fantasy.

My initial criticism of Lar who was most unpopular in his day, even after his Cooney boost is the reason he was so unpopular.

Every time his ****** mug stepped into the ring, I was thinking the WBA champs might well whoop Lar's opponent easier than Lar, so why ain't he fighting them? They were busy fighting each other which gave them significant losses, but much better competition as a whole.

I'm not sure why Cooney/Weaver for Weaver's WBA title fell out of that scheduled queue, perhaps King machinations or Cooney/Weaver injury, but had Cooney won that WBA belt, most probably by KO, history shows Lar wouldn't fight him. It wasn't until Michael Spinks who was the unified LH champ in a very competitive era stepped in Lar's failed Rocky moment when that happened.

In summary, head to head Lar's avoiding the WBA guys who weren't avoiding each other, so really doing other era head to heads with Lar become redundant. If they were that good, Lar ain't gonna fight'em, it's just that simple.

[JAB5239]

So let's make the challenge a nice 15.

15 HW Champions who should be ranked higher than Larry Holmes?

Criteria . . . Just joking, we'll both be very old before there is consensus on that . . .

to avoid the 'weak era' syndrome I am going H2H.

In my very humble opinion.

NOT IN RANKING ORDER (just off the top of my head)

ALI
LOUIS
LEWIS
TYSON
HOLYFIELD
DEMPSEY
TUNNEY
MARCIANO
FURY
JOHNSON
KLITSCHCKO
CHARLES
WALCOTT
LISTON
SPINKS

Anyone totally not deserve to be on the list?

Head to head the only fighters I'd pick over him would be Ali, Louis and Lewis with Tyson a toss up prime for prime. The rest I would pick Holmes more times than not. But h2h is a lousy way to determine greatness.

And I'm still waiting for Queenie to post his list.

[Willie Pep 229]

Head to head the only fighters I'd pick over him would be Ali, Louis and Lewis with Tyson a toss up prime for prime. The rest I would pick Holmes more times than not. But h2h is a lousy way to determine greatness.

And I'm still waiting for Queenie to post his list.

Yea I can see that . . . H2H is so much conjecture. . . The problem with career evaluation always seems to run into the 'era' argument.

What do you believe is the best way to assess?

I always felt that if it is by accomplishment then regardless of any qualification it has to be Joe Louis at the top.

Much like Tom Brady as GOAT, you can find QBs with better skills at all aspects of the game, arm, stats, football IQ, wheels, ETC. But no one comes close to Brady's accomplishments.

[markusmod]

Yea I can see that . . . H2H is so much conjecture. . . The problem with career evaluation always seems to run into the 'era' argument.

What do you believe is the best way to assess?

I always felt that if it is by accomplishment then regardless of any qualification it has to be Joe Louis at the top.

Much like Tom Brady as GOAT, you can find QBs with better skills at all aspects of the game, arm, stats, football IQ, wheels, ETC. But no one comes close to Brady's accomplishments.

But is Brady the GOAT, or Rodgers?

[JAB5239]

Yea I can see that . . . H2H is so much conjecture. . . The problem with career evaluation always seems to run into the 'era' argument.

What do you believe is the best way to assess?

I always felt that if it is by accomplishment then regardless of any qualification it has to be Joe Louis at the top.

Much like Tom Brady as GOAT, you can find QBs with better skills at all aspects of the game, arm, stats, football IQ, wheels, ETC. But no one comes close to Brady's accomplishments.

For me, because this is opinion based because boxing has no set criteria. I'd say accomplishment, skills, resume, longevity, intangibles, head to head. Accomplishment sets the very best apart from everyone else. Skills can translate from era to era. Resume, shows the talent you've fought and how often. Longevity the ability to maintain those skills over time and keep focus. Intangibles, things like heart, chin, the will to dig deep to get a win when losing or hurt. Head to head, comparing all these things and determining with opinion who we think would beat who.

I think this is a fair way to assess a fighters greatness and place in history. As I said though it's all opinion and everyone has their own criteria.

[StarshipTrooper]

But is Brady the GOAT, or Rodgers?

When did Montana change his name to "Brady"?

[Willie Pep 229]

When did Montana change his name to "Brady"?

See!

But accomplishment is about winning championships and no one comes close not even Joe Cool with a mere (actually amazing) four.

Hell Bart Starr had five in seven years.

But I agree with both of you, if I had a weak team I would want Montana or Rodgers to help compensate, not Brady.

IDK championships, resume, KOs, longevity, jab, footwork, right hand, era . . . Ahhhh! It goes on and on . . . how can we make any P4P list of value?

[markusmod]

When did Montana change his name to "Brady"?

Montana Love?