How about a list of draws from fighters?

[Dr Z]

It's obvious you have no sources and only want to troll. You posted this yesterday begging for Bronsons attention. You've been outed in your own thread. Kudos to Bronson for not taking the bait because the rest of us are having a productive discussion. Very petty and immature Z.

How much do you want to bet I have a source. Stop sniffing Bronson’s crack. I told Bronson the cost. Perhaps you and I can work something out? Well…?

[Bronson66]

How much do you want to bet I have a source. Stop sniffing Bronson’s crack. I told Bronson the cost. Perhaps you and I can work something out? Well…?

I hope you do have one,a PRIMARY one and ,in the interests of reading it,I will give you my user names I have had 2 names on here Ivich, and Bronson, and 2 on ESB,Tonto and McVey.I have been on here about13/14 years and 20 years on ESB.
Why you would want to attach conditions to revealing your sources ,I cannot imagine,no matter I have given you my user names Dr Z /Mendoza.
Now let's have your PRIMARY source posted here today !

[Willie Pep 229]

Mulddon Says Greb Outpointed Tunney; Declares that Pittsburgh boxer should have recieved decision after title bout. CALLS THE VERDICT UNJUST. Head of Athletic Commision States that contest is closed incident, however. Greb seeks return match and expresses confidence in ability to regain Light-Heavyweight crown if given chance.

This is from the New York times.Times. Kind of shows that what we may think can be bias in the press works both ways.

That's the Times quoting Muldoon. Not the Times speaking.

Maldoon = Don King in trust.

[JAB5239]

How much do you want to bet I have a source. Stop sniffing Bronson’s crack. I told Bronson the cost. Perhaps you and I can work something out? Well…?

The cost? You want me to pay for nothing? We've been down this road before. Remember when you said Holmes was kicked out of Alis camp? You supposedly had a source then just to get turned out like a $2 Tijuana hooker. Like I said, you're not here to talk boxing, and you're making it apparent to everyone.

[JAB5239]

That's the Times quoting Muldoon. Not the Times speaking.

Maldoon = Don King in trust.

Could be wrong here, but I believe the times had it for Greb.

[billeau2]

Archie Moore had 10 draws. Guess he wasn't great.

Z logic..... "I don't care much for Johnson, he is bad.... Johnson had SOME DRAWS... Therefore fighters with draws are bad!"

[billeau2]

Neither Choynski or Johnson weighed in for that fight,but a comparison of their available weights at the time indicate there was little weight disparity between the two.

Are you kiddin? Just look in that pic how Johnson towers over Choyinski! Joe can hardly take two steps without encountering the heft of JJ the giant Stevedore! The jailers in the foreground are also obviously conversing about the disparity and probably had to do a renovation on the cell just to put JJ in with Choyisnski!

[billeau2]

That's true! ND fights were from a time where certain US states didn't allow an official verdict, when a fight went the full scheduled distance.

But these fights were "decided" by newspaper reports - and appear on boxers' records as w-nws, l-nws or d-nws... which I of course don't need to tell you, as you already know this.


My question is this: should the NWS decision fights count as real fights or not?

For what it is worth? "Draws" whatever one considers them, are one of so many reasons why other accounts of fights, film when available, and historical information, should all take primacy over any "decision."

[billeau2]

Agreed. Bundana is a top poster here for sure.

Bundana has an absolute command over boxing trivia... and I use the word trivia with the caveat it is misleading... I would rather say statistical information. I have only seen one other poster on the same level, forgot his name. I really respect such a skill, and the ability to make a multidimensional list: two skills I profess to not be very able at!

[Willie Pep 229]

Could be wrong here, but I believe the times had it for Greb.

Let me be a pain, but don't get annoyed. I won't push this past this post.

But we talking here talking about (Tunney-Greb II) a UD by judges and not a NWS declared win, by Boxrec.

So we have to view, and argue, this in the category of "bad decisions" not as a W /L we are free to redefine.

You don't say Walcott has another win on his record because of Walcott-Louus I. Instead we say Walcott got robbed.

If you are going to change the Tunney-Greb record, you are on a slippery-slope.

P.S. I now see that the newspapers were overwhelming in support of Greb; not just a local thing.

15 newspapers for Greb; four for Tunney, four for a draw.

A good argument to claim Greb got jobbed.