Did Monzon retire to avoid Hagler?

[JAB5239]

Which argument are you guys having, the KD, the duck, or the use of alts?

You guys look like your trying to get under eachother's skin anyway you can.

MY TWO CENTS (Even though no one asked for it.)

I always thought that if Dr. Z or Ivich ever died (literally) the other guy would feel an empty space in his life. It looks like Z feels that emptiness because of the Ban, and he wants Jab to fill the void. Jab is obliging.

May I suggest REST for both of your.

I know, I am out of line, it's really not my business, so, sorry for my pretentious behavior.

But from the outside looking in, this seems obvious.

Lol, I'm just pointing out his lies. Im saying the date of the fights, and he has no proof of alts. But I get what you're saying. A part of Z did die when Ivich was banned, and I should not fill that void nor oblige him. But the ridiculousness is almost to much at times!! I mean take this thread he felt the need to not only bump,but mention my name in. It's absurd. Maybe I should start a thread "Did Vits retire to avoid Fury". I can't bring myself to though because I don't have some crazy deep seeded agenda. I have enough tools to work with without creating more absurdity.

[JAB5239]

What lies? Name and dates por favor. I say you full of **** I listed for alts of Ivich's, some here, others on a different forum. You
are wrong. You have no proof and no account.

I was pointing out the name Incapable as an alt Ivich used here for you captain obvious. And I am right. Go it, Cowboy

No, I do not miss him one iota.

That is your department.

I'll end the Ivich conversation since you're unable to. The lie I am pointing out is the one you told about Monzon and Fernandez fighting in Dec of 1966, and reading about it in an Argentinian newspaper. It never happened. This has been pointed out several times but you refuse to acknowledge it nor supply the article you claim to have read it in.

[JAB5239]

Quoting a known liar, Jab? Oh that's right you have feelings for him.

Here is the truth.



"Jorge Fermandez was one of the last men to deck Carlos Monzon, that occurred on Sept 3 1966 for the Argentine and South American Middleweight Title won by Carlos by unanimous decision. The last opponent to deck Monzon was Rodrigo Valdes on July 30 1977 in Monte Carlo, Monaco, Monzon retained by unanimous decision, then retired"



A STAR BOWS OUT, A STAR BOWS IN - Sports Illustrated Vault | SI.com

Fernandez DID knock Monzon down in their first fight on September 3rd 1966.

The following is an extract from the 2nd Valdes fight in which Monzon badly injured his right hand in the later rounds and had to rely on his left to win the fight.

"In the second round, Valdes opened a cut on Monzon's nose, then knocked him down with an overhand right over a left lead. Monzon hadn't been off his feet since Jorge Fernandez floored him in 1966."


They fought twice, for Fernandez' Argentinian Middleweight title on September 3rd 1966 Monzon won a unanimous decision,and for the South American Middleweight title on the 10th of June 1967.Monzon again won a unanimous decision.



As I stated long ago, the knock down happened.

Tell us about the December 1966 fight you claed and show us proof of the Argentinian newspaper you read it in. That was the lie. You keep trying to skirt around this though.

[JAB5239]

That is not the point. The knockdown was. Are you really going to dig you cowboy heals into a new article that you have never seen and probably can't read? YEP

!Eres una persona muy estúpida!

Hagler vs. Monzon would have been good. Personally I think Hagler would have done a number on the murderer.

No, you made it a point. You just love yo call others liars. It's apparent you're the liar though. Unless of course you have proof. You obviously don't since you've had since last October to provide it. Is it so hard for you to say you're wrong, you had the date wrong and you never read that date? Because the fact is, you are wrong. The fight never happened in December of 1966 as you claimed to have read in an Argentinian newspaper. Oh, and Monzon never avoided Hagler. A ridiculous presumption to begin with.

[QueensburyRules]

The premise that Monzon retired to avoid Hagler makes about as much sense to me as saying Marciano retired to avoid Sonny Liston.

Perhaps it was not to be taken seriously,but just posted to stimulate debate?

- - Goes back to John L had basically retired to avoid Peter Jackson when in fact by the time Jackson became a known fighter vs Corbett, John L was functionally retired now raking in $$$ in Theater where he won't get thrown into Jail or had guns pulled on him.

The only reason he fought Corbett was that Corbett was a dandy also in Theater and in the same play with John L he impugned his integrity daily until John L said we'll settle this in the ring. It ends up that Corbett ducks Jackson who didn't have much longer before he became deathly ill and passed...R.I.P...

[Willie Pep 229]

Yes Sullivan was semi retired when Jackson began his quest for the title.
After he had won the title Corbett wanted nothing more to do with Jackson.
Sullivan and Corbett first met in Chicago when Sullivan was touring with the play "Honest hearts And Willing Hands",but Corbett never appeared in the same play as Sullivan.

The Great John L. use to win the day in the third act by sawing a log in half faster than the villian. **

Five nights a week with a matinee on Sunday.

Did it with his shirt off, the ladies loved it.

** (Would love to know what the hell the plot arch was about. Probably saving someone's farm, some how.)

P.S. in the film Gentleman Jim Sullivan (Ward Bond) is seen swinging an ax at the end of the play. Certainly more dramatic for Hollywood, but likely too dangerous for Sullivan to actually do night after night. Sawing a giant log was manly enough, and safer.

[QueensburyRules]

Yes Sullivan was semi retired when Jackson began his quest for the title.
After he had won the title Corbett wanted nothing more to do with Jackson.
Sullivan and Corbett first met in Chicago when Sullivan was touring with the play "Honest hearts And Willing Hands",but Corbett never appeared in the same play as Sullivan.

- - I'll check my sources later, but I believe they were at least touring together and likely in the same play.