Joe Jennette vs. Jack Johnson 1913

[Ivich]

Thank you for copy and paste at Box Rec. Jeannette was winless 0-3 fighter with no amateur experience when this fight happened.

What was the reason Jeannette lost the other fights to Johnson?
Battling Johnson beat Jeannette twice and drew with him on another occasion Battling Jim couldn't beat a past prime Johnson even though Jack was fighting with a broken arm.Jeannette lost to Sandy Ferguson whom Johnson toyed with, why would Johnson be afraid of Jeannette?

[Dr. Z]

Show us where Jeannette ever "decisively whipped "Johnson?

Johnson turned down 2 offers of $10,000 to defend against Jeannette because his price for a defence was $30,000.
When it was met he signed for the fights . eg twice to defend against Jeannette in NY for the McMahon brothers,the NYAC vetoed the fights and threatened any promoter who attempted to put them on with their licence being pulled.
I've posted the details several times including the promoters public statements,and those of the NYAC.
But you carry on, fill your little dishonest boots,you sad creature lol

B()lls&it., There were numerous offers by known promoters of 50,000, and an even one for a $100,000. Johnson always came up with and excuse not to fight Langford and Jeannette. The quotes and examples are numerous. Not all of Johnson defense were 30,000.

How much did he make vs Frank Moran, Battling Jim Johnson Jack O'Brien, and only Ross, and Al Kaufman? List the purse amounts if you can. I'm sure you won't. Come on do it Tony. You are dishonest man. Johnson could have fought in the UK, France, or Australia. Keep hiding behind a USA offers and Johnson influence over them NYAC.

[Ivich]

B()lls&it., There were numerous offers by known promoters of 50,000, and an even one for a $100,000. Johnson always came up with and excuse not to fight Langford and Jeannette. The quotes and examples are numerous. Not all of Johnson defense were 30,000.

How much did he make vs Frank Moran, Battling Jim Johnson Jack O'Brien, and only Ross, and Al Kaufman? List the purse amounts if you can. I'm sure you won't. Come on do it Tony. You are dishonest man. Johnson could have fought in the UK, France, or Australia. Keep hiding behind a USA offers and Johnson influence over them NYAC.

Lets have those offers for $50,000 and $100,000 to fight Jeannette . Which promoters ? What purses ? Which sites? What dates ?
ps The Jeannette fight was only viable in NY because Jeannette was a big favourite there .
Johnson had no influence over the NYAC,they banned him from even sparring for a hospital charity there.
You have plenty of time to unearth all these offers you say were made. I will be away for 18 days, flying to Mauritius tonight.

When I get back no doubt you will have posted primary sourced, verified offers of $50,000 $100,000 that were made to Johnson to defend against Jeannette!
I can hardly wait to see them! LOL

ps I see you ignored my two questions,as I knew you would.
Just keep that hate going it defines you as a poster nasty ,sad, pathetic,deluded,illiterate , and thick as two planks!

[Willie Pep 229]

Just to put the anti-Johnson ban in perspective. . . .

Johnson-Flynn was suspose to take place in Reno but ended up in West Las Vegas, New Mexico.

The 46 existing States all had bared Johnson from fighting.

The 47th State to enter the Union, New Mexico became a State on Janurary 6th 1912. A month later they thumbed their nose at the rest of America and scantioned the fight.

After all, from New Mexico s POV, "Why the hell not." Naming the damn town West Las Vegas was a plan to garner revenue. (Today the city is named Las Vegas, NM)

But anyway, if NM hadn't come on board in 1912 Jack Johnson wasn't going to be fighting anybody in the USA.

So my opinion is, if you want to accuse JJ of ducking the Holy Three (McVey, Langford, Jeannette) you need to look at Paris 1913. Not the USA in 1912.

JJ wasn't going to get a license anywhere in the USA.

Also I want to add I agree with Ivich, the Jeannette fight was probably only viable ($) in New York (and maybe later Paris) but that wasn't going happen. New York made it clear they wanted no part of JJ.

[Dr. Z]

Just to put the anti-Johnson ban in perspective. . . .

Johnson-Flynn was suspose to take place in Reno but ended up in West Las Vegas, New Mexico.

The 46 existing States all had bared Johnson from fighting.

The 47th State to enter the Union, New Mexico became a State on Janurary 6th 1912. A month later they thumbed their nose at the rest of America and scantioned the fight.

After all, from New Mexico s POV, "Why the hell not." Naming the damn town West Las Vegas was a plan to garner revenue. (Today the city is named Las Vegas, NM)

But anyway, if NM hadn't come on board in 1912 Jack Johnson wasn't going to be fighting anybody in the USA.

So my opinion is, if you want to accuse JJ of ducking the Holy Three (McVey, Langford, Jeannette) you need to look at Paris 1913. Not the USA in 1912.

JJ wasn't going to get a license anywhere in the USA.

Also I want to add I agree with Ivich, the Jeannette fight was probably only viable ($) in New York (and maybe later Paris) but that wasn't going happen. New York made it clear they wanted no part of JJ.

So move the fight to the UK, France, or Australia. Johnson had no problems making fights there. End of story. Ivich cowardly won't answer the purses for the O'Brien, Jim Johnson, Moran, Ross, or Kaufman fight! Why? Might he be afraid the amount was less than 10,000 k ?

I agree there is nor reason why Jeannette could not fight Johnson is Paris. Yet Jack selected a journeyman and by the looks of the fight was lucky to draw over 10 rounds! Johnson did in fact pull out of a signed contract to fight Langford in London. Sure sure he made more money vs Ross, O'brein and Kaufman. I say prove it.

[kara]

When are some of you going to ever stop with the bullshlt.

Big Trav is back in the house!

[Dr. Z]

" When Jack became champion he forgot about his old friends and drew the color line against his own people " - Joe Jeannette





"What matters is Johnson never gave them title shots once they were in their prime.

So according to Travy, Jeannette, McVey and Langford were all liars when they said Johnson wouldn’t give them title shots. But Johnson, the guy who lied about taking a dive against Willard was the pillar of truth? Even Johnson himself said he wouldn’t fight them, there was no money in it and claimed no one wants to see it. Even admits to drawing the color line. You guys like to rewrite history with a obscure, anonymous news clippings. Same old rehash. Still don’t know why this is yet another thread on the subject. - "

- GhostofDemspey





Hugh McIntosh was quoted in a 26 July 1913 Winnipeg Tribune article expressing is thoughts on Johnson:

"I will always say this for Langford, he is far and away the best heavyweight in the world now. I have tried time and again to get Jack Johnson to meet Langford but Jack would never accept terms or sign for a meeting with the little black fellow. When I would get Johnson near the point of a match with Langford he would stall me off with some excuse. Finally I made things so hot for Johnson that he admitted to me that Langford was too tough a game to tackle, and he passed the little fellow up.

A match between Langford and Johnson would have drawn no end of money in Australia. A good man can make a lot of money in my country, and had Johnson boxed Langford in Australia he could easily have carried off $50K for his end."

Johnson was notorious for moving goal posts to price himself out of fights with the likes of Langford, McVey and Jeannette especially. Demanding a $50K purse and $20K side bets to make the fights. According to Johnson, Al Kaufman was the best and most deserving HW for a shot at his title, laughable.




I'm still waiting for the purse amount for the Ross, O'brein, Kaufman, and Battling Jim Johnson, and Frank Moran fights. What Jack Johnson actually made and fought for. Surely someone can produce that amount and show that Jack Johnson demands of $30,000.00 to for Jeannette, Mcvey, and Langford was BS! He just did not want to fight them and ducked these very deserving men for years. Instead these lesser men fought him for far less.

By the way according to primary sources may felt the O'bren was the better of the two in 1909, and Jim battling Johnson was like robbed into a draw and not one of the judges voted for Jack. But one did vote for Battling Jim. The other two could make up their minds and Jack Johnson kept his title. By the way this fight may be on film today. A collector who was in with ESPN films says so. They bought the Jim Jacobs fight collection. It would be a treasure as the first all African American title fight. Wouldn't you want to see it?

[travestyny]

" When Jack became champion he forgot about his old friends and drew the color line against his own people " - Joe Jeannette





"What matters is Johnson never gave them title shots once they were in their prime.

So according to Travy, Jeannette, McVey and Langford were all liars when they said Johnson wouldn’t give them title shots. But Johnson, the guy who lied about taking a dive against Willard was the pillar of truth? Even Johnson himself said he wouldn’t fight them, there was no money in it and claimed no one wants to see it. Even admits to drawing the color line. You guys like to rewrite history with a obscure, anonymous news clippings. Same old rehash. Still don’t know why this is yet another thread on the subject. - "

- GhostofDemspey





Hugh McIntosh was quoted in a 26 July 1913 Winnipeg Tribune article expressing is thoughts on Johnson:

"I will always say this for Langford, he is far and away the best heavyweight in the world now. I have tried time and again to get Jack Johnson to meet Langford but Jack would never accept terms or sign for a meeting with the little black fellow. When I would get Johnson near the point of a match with Langford he would stall me off with some excuse. Finally I made things so hot for Johnson that he admitted to me that Langford was too tough a game to tackle, and he passed the little fellow up.

A match between Langford and Johnson would have drawn no end of money in Australia. A good man can make a lot of money in my country, and had Johnson boxed Langford in Australia he could easily have carried off $50K for his end."

Johnson was notorious for moving goal posts to price himself out of fights with the likes of Langford, McVey and Jeannette especially. Demanding a $50K purse and $20K side bets to make the fights. According to Johnson, Al Kaufman was the best and most deserving HW for a shot at his title, laughable.




I'm still waiting for the purse amount for the Ross, O'brein, Kaufman, and Battling Jim Johnson, and Frank Moran fights. What Jack Johnson actually made and fought for. Surely someone can produce that amount and show that Jack Johnson demands of $30,000.00 to for Jeannette, Mcvey, and Langford was BS! He just did not want to fight them and ducked these very deserving men for years. Instead these lesser men fought him for far less.

By the way according to primary sources may felt the O'bren was the better of the two in 1909, and Jim battling Johnson was like robbed into a draw and not one of the judges voted for Jack. But one did vote for Battling Jim. The other two could make up their minds and Jack Johnson kept his title. By the way this fight may be on film today. A collector who was in with ESPN films says so. They bought the Jim Jacobs fight collection. It would be a treasure as the first all African American title fight. Wouldn't you want to see it?

Give it up. It has already been proven that Johnson accepted fights with all of the fighters you mentioned and had the fights pulled through no fault of his own. He agreed to fight Langford at least 3 times. Unless you can scrub the internet of the sources that prove this, you have no legs to stand on.

[Dr. Z]

Give it up. It has already been proven that Johnson accepted fights with all of the fighters you mentioned and had the fights pulled through no fault of his own. He agreed to fight Langford at least 3 times. Unless you can scrub the internet of the sources that prove this, you have no legs to stand on.

BS! Prove to me what his purse were vs. Ross, O'brein, Kaufman, and Battling Jim Johnson, and Frank Moran fights. I say they all were less than $10,000.00!

Stop acting like Johnson did not back out of a signed fight contact vs Langford. He most certainly did.

[travestyny]

BS! Prove to me what his purse were vs. Ross, O'brein, Kaufman, and Battling Jim Johnson, and Frank Moran fights. I say they all were less than $10,000.00!

Stop acting like Johnson did not back out of a signed fight contact vs Langford. He most certainly did.

I don't have to prove anything about his purse regarding other fighters. You are welcome to look that up on your own. We've already provided to you numerous times the offers that he had accepted that were pulled through no fault of his own. Unless you are claiming that didn't happen, I don't think you have an argument here. He did in fact accept fights with all of these fighters.

He backed out of a contract for Langford that was so piss poor that even the newspapers reported that it was piss poor. He then accepted a number of fights with Langford. One Langford backed out of, one Langford couldn't fulfill his end of the bargain, and one that was pulled by the promoter. Those are the facts. If that makes you mad, then show proof otherwise. If you can't, I don't know what to tell you.