Wladimir Klitschko

[GJC]

Gentleman Gerry might be thinking he could lace 'em up TODAY and clean house I'm frightend to think what Jerry Quarry might have done in this era (or "error" as it sometimes seems).

Poet

Yes I think the Quarry's and Shavers would have got themselves a belt now.

[StarshipTrooper]

I will say in his defence that there was a lot of anti Ali feeling in the mid 60's, us old farts thought he was all mouth, kept his hands too low etc etc. There are still a few things that I take issue with Ali on, I think his campaign against Frazier was too much and he didn't have the twinkle in his eye that he usually had when sending up his opponents in that case. Also didn't like the white devil stuff he parroted.
But I learnt to appreciate him in time and always get upset when I see his condition now.
He might not have been the best heavyweight of all time but I haven't seen one better.

My personal feelings toward Ali are not positive: I don't particularly care for the man personally after his behavior towards Frazier. That being said, he's the best Heavyweight I've ever seen: Better than my personal favorite Joe Louis. My negative opinion toward Ali as a person doesn't influence my assessment of him as a fighter.

Poet

[GJC]

My personal feelings toward Ali are not positive: I don't particularly care for the man personally after his behavior towards Frazier. That being said, he's the best Heavyweight I've ever seen: Better than my personal favorite Joe Louis. My negative opinion toward Ali as a person doesn't influence my assessment of him as a fighter.

Poet

Yes Louis style doesn't make me cringe as much as Ali's but I would have my money on Ali in a fight between the 2 of them.

[Hawkins]

My personal feelings toward Ali are not positive: I don't particularly care for the man personally after his behavior towards Frazier. That being said, he's the best Heavyweight I've ever seen: Better than my personal favorite Joe Louis. My negative opinion toward Ali as a person doesn't influence my assessment of him as a fighter.

Poet

Not directing this at you but that's exactly what got in the way of some of the older 'experts' views on Ali. Their opinions of his actions outside the ring clouded their overall judgement of what he achieved. Personally I don't agree with the way he handled himself in a lot of instances but in no way should it take away from what he accomplished.

[StarshipTrooper]

Yes Louis style doesn't make me cringe as much as Ali's but I would have my money on Ali in a fight between the 2 of them.

In a ten fight series I'd pick Ali to win maybe six out of ten. Just too damn fast. I'd favor Louis over anyone else though.

Poet

[LondonRingRules]

Okay lets go....start with Sonny Liston. Who exactly has Wlad defeated that can compare to Liston? Same with Foreman & Frazier. What highly touted contenders did Wlad defeat that can compare to fighters like Quarry and Bonavena? I can't wait to see you try to shoot holes in the 60's-70's era heavyweights because I'm pretty sure that is the path you are about to take.

There is no one on Wlad's list of wins that can compare to those 5, regardless of what you roll out. So please, educate us.

** Well, you may be stuck in Poet's 8th grade remedial class in the uneducable category.

Let's start with Chris Byrd. Easily outclasses while running ol'man Liston around the ring like a dog on a leash. Liston and Ali didn't like quick, savvvy, southpaws. Neither did Lewis fancy the same.

Hold it there, pard, you set the parameters before Foreman, so black him out.

The best on Ali's record is Frazier, beating a diminished Frazier with increasing health problems in an arguable decision after dropping the wide decision in the first classic meeting of undefeateds.

I'd pick McCline to go against a diminished Frazier. Jameel a late starting, late maturing giant fighter who rose to the top of the heap before Wlad, and bigger than the Buster Mathis Joe beat. McCline has held it together in the superheavy era into his late 30s whereas Buster declined fairly quickly due to health problems.

Marginally favor Frazier, but not a given he could beat his biggest opponent ever.

1-1 Wlad opponent vs Ali opponent.

Quarry? One of my favs, but only 195-200. Let's pick undefeated 245lb Sam Peter to out muscle him and blast him down.

Oscar? Same deal. I'd pick a tricky, larger undefeated lefty like Sultan to move him around the ring off balance and pick him off in a decision.

3-1 Wlad. Who else you gots?

[Hawkins]

** Well, you may be stuck in Poet's 8th grade remedial class in the uneducable category.

Let's start with Chris Byrd. Easily outclasses while running ol'man Liston around the ring like a dog on a leash. Liston and Ali didn't like quick, savvvy, southpaws. Neither did Lewis fancy the same.

Hold it there, pard, you set the parameters before Foreman, so black him out.

The best on Ali's record is Frazier, beating a diminished Frazier with increasing health problems in an arguable decision after dropping the wide decision in the first classic meeting of undefeateds.

I'd pick McCline to go against a diminished Frazier. Jameel a late starting, late maturing giant fighter who rose to the top of the heap before Wlad, and bigger than the Buster Mathis Joe beat. McCline has held it together in the superheavy era into his late 30s whereas Buster declined fairly quickly due to health problems.

Marginally favor Frazier, but not a given he could beat his biggest opponent ever.

1-1 Wlad opponent vs Ali opponent.

Quarry? One of my favs, but only 195-200. Let's pick undefeated 245lb Sam Peter to out muscle him and blast him down.

Oscar? Same deal. I'd pick a tricky, larger undefeated lefty like Sultan to move him around the ring off balance and pick him off in a decision.

3-1 Wlad. Who else you gots?

Jameel McCline against Frazier? You'd pick a no heart, even less talented, McCline to go against Smokin' Joe and only favor Frazier marginally so? McCline may be big but is nowhere near the class of Big George Foreman and the chances of him beating Frazier are nil. Frazier gets in and goes to work and Big Time folds like a cheap beach chair.

Quarry has more talent, more heart and is 20 times tougher than Samuel Peter will ever be. In a head to head I would pick Quarry to get in the trenches and eventually KO Peter. Sam Peter is one of the most overrated of our current crop of fighters and has absolutely no business being compared to someone of Quarry's ability. He may be bigger but he has shown no heart, nor the ability to beat anyone of any substance.

And your claim Byrd would run away from and outclass Liston? How exactly is Byrd going to keep Liston off of him? Byrd is faster than Liston but he is nothing compared to Ali's combination of size and skill. Liston would annihilate Byrd. Liston's power would be too much for Byrd to overcome. He has a decent chin but he would get starched by Sonny.

I see you conveniently ignore Foreman, to be expected I guess. At least you saved us from a long winded explanation on how Corrie Sanders would have ***** slapped Big George.

It's unfathomable to me to see you compare this era to the 70's.

[StarshipTrooper]

Jameel McCline against Frazier? You'd pick a no heart, even less talented, McCline to go against Smokin' Joe and only favor Frazier marginally so? McCline may be big but is nowhere near the class of Big George Foreman and the chances of him beating Frazier are nil. Frazier gets in and goes to work and Big Time folds like a cheap beach chair.

Quarry has more talent, more heart and is 20 times tougher than Samuel Peter will ever be. In a head to head I would pick Quarry to get in the trenches and eventually KO Peter. Sam Peter is one of the most overrated of our current crop of fighters and has absolutely no business being compared to someone of Quarry's ability. He may be bigger but he has shown no heart, nor the ability to beat anyone of any substance.

And your claim Byrd would run away from and outclass Liston? How exactly is Byrd going to keep Liston off of him? Byrd is faster than Liston but he is nothing compared to Ali's combination of size and skill. Liston would annihilate Byrd. Liston's power would be too much for Byrd to overcome. He has a decent chin but he would get starched by Sonny.

I see you conveniently ignore Foreman, to be expected I guess. At least you saved us from a long winded explanation on how Corrie Sanders would have ***** slapped Big George.

It's unfathomable to me to see you compare this era to the 70's.

Guess he never saw Ibeabuchi - Byrd I guess he's Chase's new soul mate: Lard trumps skill

Poet

[Hawkins]

Guess he never saw Ibeabuchi - Byrd I guess he's Chase's new soul mate: Lard trumps skill

Poet

I guess since Vitali quit on his stool in a bout against Byrd it equals Byrd>ATGs.

[GJC]

Ali didn't like quick, savvvy, southpaws.

I'm struggling to think of one he fought, only ones that come to mind are Midenberger and Richard Dunn. But yes they gave him a boxing lesson no doubt about it.