Joe Louis: A Retrospective

[ShoulderRoll]

He went 45-2 (41) overall and 15-2 (12) in HW World Title fights, and bat 9-10 ring magazine opponents.

For openers, it's possible to rip anyone competition. So rather than rip them ( I could even rip Ali's ) let's remain positive and compare his accomplishments to the field.

Vitali always fought heavyweights and only faced one opponent with a losing record when he fought him. He became a world title holder in less than three years and never used a color line.

Ratings can be viewed head to head, or via accomplishments.

Head to head, he likely beats anyone pre-Sonny Liston, and could beat anyone post Liston.


Accomplishments:

Best rounds won to rounds lost ratio, not only in the history of heavyweights but among all boxing champions. Towering above Ali or Holmes on the score cards, who in fact lost more rounds to lesser men than Vitali defeated. Vitali combined power, size, smarts, defense, counterpunching, and ring generalship to the maximum by engaging his opponents and forcing them to fight on his terms. Vitali never trailed on any scorecard after three rounds, and never lost more than three consensus rounds in any fight. This includes fight where he was injured ( Byrd and Chisora ).


Never floored by a punch. Ever. Vitali and Oliver Mcall are the only two in the history of the division never to be floored by a punch, and Vitali fought plenty of punchers who landed hard to test his chin/durability

One of the best knock artists of all time, with 87% KO ratio. It went down a little with age, and so would any champions.

One of the most active heavyweights on the punch stats, comparing to Marciano or Frazier's activity level.

**So far we are talking about a guy who was incredibly difficult to outbox, was never floored who had the power and stamina to stop anyone early or late.**

An all time come back. Which boxer came back four years out of the ring, and no warm up fights not only to take his title back but to win nine title defenses in a row at age 37-41. The answer is zero.


14-2 in world title matches, fought approximately 9-10 opponents ( give or take 1 ) who were ranked in Ring Magazine's top ten. Valuev and Haye, who were highly rated backed out of fights with Vitali


Ring Magazine champion #1 at Box Rec, fight news and EPSN

Both of his losses are on fights that were taken on less than two weeks notices.

One was an injury retirement when Vitali a sports doctor lost feeling in his arm and feared permanent injury from a shoulder tear. He was well in the lead, fighting with essentially one good arm from round three to nine vs a prime Chris Byrd.

The other loss was vs Lennox Lewis a very good older fighter and lineal champion. This was a cuts loss. There is video proof that Lewis landed a back hard to the area where the cut was, which could have caused the cut. He also rubbed the top of his head into Vitali's region of the cut after the backhand landed. We'll never know exactly when the cut was created. Vitali lead 4-2 on all three cards, which means Lewis who was very tired would have to win 4 of the next 6 rounds on at least two cards to get a draw. Lewis said he would rematch several times but never did. This is very telling as there was 17-18 million purse for Lewis. The truth is Lewis likely felt he was fortunate in the first fight and would have lost the re-match. I never saw a cut title match loss where the guy in the lead never had a re-match, have you?

I'll close here. Re-matches are important. Vitali was denied his chance to avenge his losses.

What if Schmeling never re-matches Louis and didn't get a chance to face Braddock early in his career?

What if Fraizer and Norton never re-matched Ali?!

What if Rahman and McCall never Re-matches Lewis?!

I'll tell you what would happen, neither Louis or Ali would be rated #1 and #2 today. And Lewis ranking would have tumbled. Personally, I rate Ali #1 overall, and both Louis and Lewis in my top 6.

Any sane boxing fans know Vitali would have beaten Byrd if there was a re-match.

It's a mostly trash resume. Easy to win a lot and get KO's when you aren't facing stellar competition.

The two best men he faced (Lennox Lewis and Chris Byrd) show up as losses on his record.

He also has steroid use in his history.

As far as heavyweight resumes go it's not top tier at all, in my opinion.

[QueensburyRules]

It's a mostly trash resume. Easy to win a lot and get KO's when you aren't facing stellar competition.

The two best men he faced (Lennox Lewis and Chris Byrd) show up as losses on his record.

He also has steroid use in his history.

As far as heavyweight resumes go it's not top tier at all, in my opinion.

- -So sayeth the untutored.

You don't understand that he underwent more drug testing in his boxing career than did Ali, Frazier, Liston and Patterson combined. The sole positive test was when he was with his Soviet Oympic trainers that those who study these things understand kids trained in that system did as told and had little choice what were put in their bodies. Any balking sees them kicked of the team and their parents downgraded to a new job and quarters.

Next his comp dwarfs that of Ali as another point of comparison most of whom would be stuck in the cruisers or LHs today. He came to America trying to secure fights vs Tyson, Evan and Lewis but they snubbed him. Lost the illicit battle by Lewis but won the war by making Lewie scurry off literally behind the skirts of his mama into ignoble retirement days before he was do to stripped by the WBC of his last title. The other two he had literally sold to the crookery of DKing.

You don't have to like him, but fax is fax and fax are he and Wlad gave lots of paydays to the now derelict American hvy division.

[billeau2]

- -So sayeth the untutored.

You don't understand that he underwent more drug testing in his boxing career than did Ali, Frazier, Liston and Patterson combined. The sole positive test was when he was with his Soviet Oympic trainers that those who study these things understand kids trained in that system did as told and had little choice what were put in their bodies. Any balking sees them kicked of the team and their parents downgraded to a new job and quarters.

Next his comp dwarfs that of Ali as another point of comparison most of whom would be stuck in the cruisers or LHs today. He came to America trying to secure fights vs Tyson, Evan and Lewis but they snubbed him. Lost the illicit battle by Lewis but won the war by making Lewie scurry off literally behind the skirts of his mama into ignoble retirement days before he was do to stripped by the WBC of his last title. The other two he had literally sold to the crookery of DKing.

You don't have to like him, but fax is fax and fax are he and Wlad gave lots of paydays to the now derelict American hvy division.

Your insane. Ali fought in an era when there was the best competition in the division probably ever. Illicit loss to Lewis?

You would not know a fact if it took a steaming pile of s hit down your throat. its charming watching you quote your own posts, and revealing as well... You and Rusty need a library card and someone to explain what a fact is.

[Anthony342]

Your insane. Ali fought in an era when there was the best competition in the division probably ever. Illicit loss to Lewis?

You would not know a fact if it took a steaming pile of s hit down your throat. its charming watching you quote your own posts, and revealing as well... You and Rusty need a library card and someone to explain what a fact is.

Someone s hitting down his throat is probably a fetish of his. You might have turned him on with that post. Might have to start calling him Queeny Steamer

[billeau2]

Someone s hitting down his throat is probably a fetish of his. You might have turned him on with that post. Might have to start calling him Queeny Steamer

I like steamers but not that kind!

[QueensburyRules]

Your insane. Ali fought in an era when there was the best competition in the division probably ever. Illicit loss to Lewis?

You would not know a fact if it took a steaming pile of s hit down your throat. its charming watching you quote your own posts, and revealing as well... You and Rusty need a library card and someone to explain what a fact is.

- -Ginsberg or Kerouac ever go off the rails like that?

Didn't U just get flattened by a car? Sorry about all that, but it happens. Get well soon and look both ways.

[billeau2]

- -Ginsberg or Kerouac ever go off the rails like that?

Didn't U just get flattened by a car? Sorry about all that, but it happens. Get well soon and look both ways.

I don't know about those guys... But you sir... are off the rails.

[QueensburyRules]

I don't know about those guys... But you sir... are off the rails.

- -They long gone. Count U blessings

[HOUDINI563]

The other thing about Dr Z aka Mendoza is that he is obsessed to knock, by cherry picking information, all past greats in an effort to pump up his favorites Vitali and Jeffries.

So in this case he ignores the fact that Vitali quit on his stool giving up his title in a bout he was winning “because my shoulder hurt too much”. The heart of a great champion!

He also ignores that Lewis was fighting the last bout in his career and undertrained vs Vitali and still walked away with a TKO win. Prime vs prime Vitalis head is separated from his shoulders.

[JAB5239]

- -So sayeth the untutored.

You don't understand that he underwent more drug testing in his boxing career than did Ali, Frazier, Liston and Patterson combined. The sole positive test was when he was with his Soviet Oympic trainers that those who study these things understand kids trained in that system did as told and had little choice what were put in their bodies. Any balking sees them kicked of the team and their parents downgraded to a new job and quarters.

Next his comp dwarfs that of Ali as another point of comparison most of whom would be stuck in the cruisers or LHs today. He came to America trying to secure fights vs Tyson, Evan and Lewis but they snubbed him. Lost the illicit battle by Lewis but won the war by making Lewie scurry off literally behind the skirts of his mama into ignoble retirement days before he was do to stripped by the WBC of his last title. The other two he had literally sold to the crookery of DKing.

You don't have to like him, but fax is fax and fax are he and Wlad gave lots of paydays to the now derelict American hvy division.

Another load of unproven BS and lies. Pathetic!