How would a young Mike Tyson fair against the real big heavyweights of today.

[Rusty Tromboni]

The bolded: Truthfully that is a myth. When Tyson started boxing he was like Wilder and most heavy weights. he could punch. Cus laughed at him and challenged him to grow... Tyson, who has always been very smart, despite not being formally educated, studied fighters, tape, and fell in love with Dempsey.

The point being: Tyson worked very hard to develop that crushing ability, had skills that he worked on. you can see Tyson pivoting, somethiing Dempsey inovated... The fast footwork, etc.

Wilder by comparison could punch, developed a jab over time. Thats about it. he still cringes when hit (like Klitsko). Does Wilder have so much power... so much natural ability that he could beat a guy who learned how to box at the highest level? cause Tyson had skills.... I don't think so.

It's cute how you like to make things up.

D'Amato exposed Tyson to the tapes. And the whole team was really solid. A lot of what you are seeing in the pivot seems inspired by Canzoneri.

Tyson didn't discover this all on his own. He was rightly guided.

Wilder never had that kind of training in his formative years.

[billeau2]

Tysons raw power is very overrated. He never had that one punch hard power, but used blinding speed to ctch you with shot u dont see coming. See his earliest fights, even before becoming champion.

Green K. Absolutely

[billeau2]

If you think Tyson was more skilled than Usyk you're only confirming what everyone has already been thinking about you.

Tyson weighed 220 pounds when he could pass his child's urine through a prosthetic di'ck. No way he'd be entering the scene like that. And while his offense was very good, it only lasted for a few rounds. He abandoned it as he fatigued.


Wilder landed TWICE on Fury. Tyson never fought any one that good. He definitely never dropped anyone that good. Lots of fighters caught Tyson coming in.


Do you REALLY THINK FRANK BRUNO HITS HARDER THAN WILDER?

Simple question.

Tyson had more weapons than Usk. Usk has no concept of angles... and again, ****** one sided Hyperbolic BS... or did you not see Usk getting hit moving straight back against a slow and ungainly Chisora?

More skilled than Usk? no. But Usk, much like Lomo have very limited concepts coming from the Ammies. I mean serious question: when you watch a fight, do you see? If you think Usk was actually much more skilled than Tyson it confirms everything we know about you... you are an idiot. Usk has skills yes, but they are limited...LOOK at the fight with Chisora, and before that with Bellue...Its all right there! lol. Any skilled heavyweight will catch Usk moving straight back... Ali could get away with it until Frazier caught him.

[billeau2]

Wilder looked better at 230+ than he 20 pounds lighter. 210 is as light as he can go. No way he makes 200 without severing a limb.

Tyson, conversely, came of age pre-VADA. Today he'd definitely be a career Cruiserweight.

There you go folks, another Rustism... Quote worthy.

You are an idiot. Tyson is the perfect size for a compact heavy weight...

[billeau2]

We could sit here all day and talk about the things Ali did wrong.

Liston was KO'd by Light Heavyweights.

Dempsey was shoved out of the ring by Luis Fu'king Firpo.

Lewis was KO'd by Rahman and McCall.

Have you ever seen the Byrd-Ibeabuchi fight?


It IS about size. No one said it was ONLY about size, and raw power is a tremendous equalizer. In your childish Asperger's ridden brain, you natrually see everything exclusively in black and white. But I am hear to tell you George, life ain't a page of "da New Yoik Times". (I am still awaiting stories about how you and the rest of The Warriors used to sell "da Papuhs" and shine shoes). There's nuance to the life outside your head.

Try digesting that... maybe the shrink will allow you more time out of the straightjacket.

Look... Just sit down and WATCH the tapes. take a piece of paper and write down different skills each fighter displays. When Wilder is pressured he loses all technique... unlike Ali who had the talent to do things wrong. But Ali did not cringe when hit, and did not stop moving when chased back, which wilder does... Ali also got beat moving back by Fraizer.

[Rusty Tromboni]

Tyson had more weapons than Usk.

What you are trying to say, may I be so bold as to attempt to translate your New Yoikese, is that Tyson was better out-fitted offensively.

No one is dis*****g that. Tyson had fabulous head movement and could really apply the pressure. He was a devastating puncher.

But Usyk is more than just offence. When Tyson was hurt, or slowed down he didn't really show any defense. Definitely in his post-Rooney career he became little more than a slugger, lobbing off random power punches. He didn't use much lateral movement, he didn't dance around the ring, he didn't roll with/slip punches along the ropes.

Usyk is clearly a more complete fighter.

T Usk has no concept of angles...

Just when we think you can't get any more r3tarded...

or did you not see Usk getting hit moving straight back against a slow and ungainly Chisora?

1) What exactly is your point?

2) Did Tyson not become a sitting duck as the rounds wore on? At least Usyk was still moving.

3) If you had ever seen Usyk's fights at Cw, you'd know he's much elusive than that at his ideal weight.

4) Chisora is a monster - bigger than anyone Tyson faced is his prime, and harder hitting.

5) Did you see Duran put on the back foot by Hearns? Quarry put on the backfoot by Frazier? Charles, Walcott and Moore bombed out by Marciano? Zarate bombed out by Gomez? Gomez trashed on the ropes by Sanchez? Tiger ripped open by Foster?

Would almost make you think, I dunno, size matters?

6) Regardless of what you saw in the highlights, if you'd seen the fight you would know Usyk damn near pitched a shut out.

More skilled than Usk? no.

OK, so you're just here to prove my point: you don't really have anything to discuss, you just want to be noticed.

Do you want money? Are you looking for an angel to invest in your mustard-ketchup bottle? We can talk, if that's what it's about.

But Usk, much like Lomo have very limited concepts coming from the Ammies.

It's comments like this that make me think it's not the crack that makes New Yorkers crazy, it's the attempt at a cure.

But Usk, much like Lomo have very limited concepts coming from the Ammies. I mean serious question: when you watch a fight, do you see? If you think Usk was actually much more skilled than Tyson it confirms everything we know about you... you are an idiot. Usk has skills yes, but they are limited...LOOK at the fight with Chisora, and before that with Bellue...Its all right there! lol. Any skilled heavyweight will catch Usk moving straight back... Ali could get away with it until Frazier caught him.

I am sure you believe you're making some meaningful contribution with that comment, but you'll have to forgive me, it's lost on me.

My point was that Usyk is more skilled than fighters from Tyson's era. I don't know how that can be disputed. I didn't say he was perfect.

Obviously, fighters from that era were abusing PEDs with little fear of bein caught or facing serious repercussion. I won't downplay the serious advantage that provides fighters. But basically, guys far inferior to Usyk made up cast of the 1980s Boxing scene. If Usyk is too small for today's Heavyweight division, how can you act like the much more one dimensional, predictable and less conditioned Tyson won't feel the consequences.

[Rusty Tromboni]

There you go folks, another Rustism... Quote worthy.

You are an idiot. Tyson is the perfect size for a compact heavy weight...

It's funny how a guy who doesn't sweat is telling us what a perfect size is.

How many pine boards do you think he could break with a karate chop?


I know your idea of exercise is "wash on, wash off" so let me explain this to you:

Tyson, indeed, is a robust individual. He naturally acquires muscle mass. But he came of age when steroid use was rampant.

traditionally, Boxing is scene as aerobic, so muscle development as witnessed in anaerobic sports was shunned. Look at Conn, Marciano, and even guys like Foreman and Ali. Guys with dense bones who weighed in at shockingly low weights, without really cutting weight.

You could compare Boxing to cross country, and Football to track. Wrestling falls in between.


D'Amato had his own way of doing things. He actually designed his style predicated on full use of fast twitch muscle fibers. So rather than trying to keep muscle mass as low as possible, fighters like Patterson and Tyson sought to bulk up, and entered the ring larger than conventionally accepted.

You can see the effects of all the muscle mass on Tyson when fights went deep and opponents applied their size in the clinches. Patterson had a lengthier career than Tyson, you can see how he used to fight in spurts.

[Rusty Tromboni]

Look... Just sit down and WATCH the tapes. take a piece of paper and write down different skills each fighter displays. When Wilder is pressured he loses all technique... unlike Ali who had the talent to do things wrong. But Ali did not cringe when hit, and did not stop moving when chased back, which wilder does... Ali also got beat moving back by Fraizer.

Ali needed smelling salts to survive Cooper - who was never good to begin with, but was already washed up when he met Ali.

Wilder took Ortiz's best shots and came back to win the fight in violent fashion.

Wilder found Fury twice. Ali fumbled through little Karl Mildenberger, and could never drop chinny Ken Norton.


Seriously, if Shavers could turn Ali into a bobble head, it would be homicide slating him to fight Wilder.

You weren't an athlete, so stop pretending to have any understanding of this. As humans advance in size, certain traits fall off. We're not alone - it's universal across the animal kingdom. Little ants are covered in armor and spit acid, they can climb on ceilings and carry loads 5K times their own weight. How come a Moose can't do any of that?

[Anthony342]

Look... Just sit down and WATCH the tapes. take a piece of paper and write down different skills each fighter displays. When Wilder is pressured he loses all technique... unlike Ali who had the talent to do things wrong. But Ali did not cringe when hit, and did not stop moving when chased back, which wilder does... Ali also got beat moving back by Fraizer.

The talent to do things wrong because of speed and reflexes? I've heard the same thing about Roy Jones in his prime. Is that true? It would explain the quick decline. Ali adjusted his style as he got older, but Roy didn't seem to.

[Anthony342]

Tysons raw power is very overrated. He never had that one punch hard power, but used blinding speed to ctch you with shot u dont see coming. See his earliest fights, even before becoming champion.

While maybe not as quick, Tommy Morrison said the same thing about Lennox Lewis on Ringside. That Lewis wasn't the hardest puncher he faced, but still hit hard and caught him with punches he didn't see coming. Would you agree when watching Lennox's fights?