I'm not too sure how well Marg responds to southpaws. If Zab landed one of those wicked left hook type uppercuts I don't think it's outside the realm of possibility that he good put cheater on his ass.
I love Zab and hate Marg, so if this fight ever happened and Zab won. I would shit down both legs.
Zab was whooping his ass so bad, he did a dance.....and fell over twice cuz it was so easy.
Ever see Kostya fight amateur? Zab beats him 1 out of 10 in 3 rounders. kostya was a 3 round BEAST.
Yeah Tszyu vs Forrest (RIP) in the amateurs was classic. Tszyu was faaaaaast! Judah was moving funny in that second round when Tszyu caught him. The embarrassing thing was I think he was trying to say something to Nady after he got up the first time... I wonder what it sounded like?! lol I think prime Tszyu beats prime Judah, even though I like Zab more. I don't think Tszyu beats him that easily the majority of the time, though. Think the more likely outcome is Tszyu by mid to late stoppage. Zab was far from prime then. His movement has gotten better since then. He moves more laterally instead of straight back.
When he quit against Antonio Margarito. That would have been a highlight reel finish for the Tijuana Tornado. Shame on you Miguel!
I thought Evangelista Cotto threw in the towel?
Was it necessary to make a thread about it???
I thought so. People who don't care can just ignore it, but people that I get along with will know. Sorry if the post offended you.
?
Is there one particular fight you've seen a silly amount of times? What keeps you coming back to watch it again?
I've watched Foreman/Holyfield and Tyson/Holyfield 1 many times.
Poll: Who Won The Fight Dirrell Or Froch?
Man, all these cats who say Dirrell was "running" don't know what boxing is. He was "running" like Mayweather. Countering well, at times being effective in exchanges, switching stances, staying on the outside for the most part. I can understand a 1 point victory for Froch, although I think Dirrell won. 115-112 is embarrassing for our sport.
He needs to fight SSM and the Pac-Cotto winner next yr. Period.
Agreed fully, man! Like Grindshine said he's just too good. He's even too good for cinnamon head. I know Richard Schaefer might disagree, but shit man.
LoL I can't believe somebody would actually say Mayweather and Cinnamon head in the same sentence. Give me a break! Like I said before, if he don't fight one of these guys next, I'm gonna fall off the Floyd wagon. One thing I can't take away from him, whatever he chooses to do, is his skill. That dude is a beast. He stuck his jab in Marquez' gut, he's even that much better when he jabs more often.
I am starting to think that SSM would be the best fight for him. I was kind of like everybody else and calling for the Pac fight, but once I saw him manhandle Marquez like that, the Pac fight isn't really as relevant to me anymore, unless Pac just makes Cotto look like a fool.
Pac is a 6 time world titlest in 6 different weightclass. Pac has won 4 World Linial Championships in 4 different weightclass. That is something that has never been done in over a 100yrs of boxing. Think about that? Pac has accomplish something that has never been done ever.
This does not matter. P4P is a mythical ranking. Is all an opinion.
Again this does not matter. Maciano has never been stopped. Is he better than Joe Louis? No. David Tua never been stopped is he better than Wladimir Klitlschko? No. Vitaly Klitschko never been knocked down is he better than Larry Holmes or Lennox Lewis? I think not.
I honestly think both fighters do. Pac needs to prove his spot. While Floyd is living off what he did at 130, which he didn't cleanout, and his 2 figths with Castillo.
The difference is one fighter is trying to prove it (Pac) While the other is content with fighting the lesser as long as it is the most money (Mayweather). Now there is nothing wrong with getting your money. I probably would do the same thing. By all means get. However, don't tell me how great you are cuz of what over 6yrs ago.
6 time world champion in 6 different weight classes? Ok. How many vacant titles has Pac won? How many titles has Pac won against the likes of David (not Juan) Diaz?
How many titles has Pac lost? I understand styles make fights but Marquez didn't win 1 round against Floyd. Floyd made Marquez look like Baldomir. Pac is trying to prove he's the best Welterweight? Is that why even his trainer calls his next opponent "damaged goods?" That's why Pac didn't fight Shane instead? Your arguments don't hold water.
does it make sense? Both fighters coming off losses, first fight was disputed, clottey gave him problems early...I think it could be a good one
Grandmaster Clottey will whoop his ass.
If you answered yes, then one has to wonder, how the hell is Pac gonna Knock Out Cotto - If Mosley couldnt hurt him.
Either way, I like both of these guys, I just hope whomever wins, takes Fraud Gayweather's head off. I have a new name for Floyd, its Fraud Money Mayweather. Fraud money for fighting small cats, then claiming to be the best. Cmon, Juan Maunuel Marquez is 36, and climbed 2 weight classed to fight punk 6ss floyd.
I think so. I think Zab hits harder than Pac at this weight. Pac won't KO Cotto. Pac won't even win the fight.
Is Froch starting to piss you off ? i used to dislike Froch originally, mainly because he had a big mouth and would not fight anyone worth a damn, yet he still thought he was entitled to a fight with Calzaghe, however i started to warm to him after his win over Pascal & then after the Taylor fight i thought a bit more highly of him, even though he got schooled for most of the fight.
Too much is too much though, when he used to tease Calzaghe it was pretty funny because all Calz fan boys used to get all bent out of shape about it, now i always thought Froch was fukking with Calz and that he did not really believe half the shit he was chatting but now im not so sure, he thinks he is Leonard/Hearns in terms of Boxing skills, yet he gets schooled by an inexperienced fighter and gets a decision he blatently did not deserve, then there was his post fight interview, now this BS about Calzaghe again!!
Too much is too much, Froch needs to realize it was funny when it was funny but now its old and tired and that he is a tough cavemen who needs a reality check, nothing more.
No, he's not starting to piss me off. He's been pissing me off for a long time! He can't defend himself, and he's got this arrogant attitude like he's really done something. The dude has fought in the US 1 time! He got beat the first round of the super six and he knows it! The world knows it. Has absolutely NOTHING to do with him being British either. I lived in England for 2 years and I love the Brits.
Based on what? What solid evidence do you present supporting your claim?
Nevermind, I forgot. There is no evidence. You say that because you like Pac more. I think this argument has came up on here before. 6 time world champion in 5 different weight classes. P4P longer, never been stopped or knocked down (Unless you think taking a knee when a punch didn't land because your hand hurts a KD), never been really rocked (unless you think Corley rocked him.. I don't).
Pac may be better. I doubt it, but it's possible. He needs a few more feathers in his hat before the World believes it though.
i did....he just could'nt....:boxing:...floyd is not ballsy enought to take actions like that.....floyd won vs hoya by sd...and koed ihatton in 10 where pac did it in 2...shit ,he would'nt even fight a ww....lol
Of course Pac KO'd Hatton quicker than Floyd. Pac is supposed to! That's his style! How do I get that through your head? Floyd is a boxer, Pac is a puncher. Why did Foreman get rid of Frazier quicker than Ali? Because Foreman is better than Ali? I think not.
So you agree with this right?
How many world of the world titles that Pac won were vacant? Is that what you are asking me? If so NONE. What was the reason for that question?
QUOTE=MoneyMay1;6406081]How many titles has Pac won against the likes of David (not Juan) Diaz?
Just one against David Diaz. And, say what you want about Diaz and his limited skills. But, he was more of world titlest than what Zab was.
Once and that was little bit over 10 yrs ago. This question right here made you own me. Is no way in hell Pac is better than Floyd cuz he lossed a world title 10yrs ago. What was I thinking?
Marquez is not a WW. Mike Jones would make JMM look lie Baldomir. Cintron would kill JMM. Soto Karrass would beat JMM at WW. JMM would be lucky to win 4 rds against Delvin Rodrigues at WW. Honestly bro name one top 20 WW that JMM could beat at WW?
Well some Floyd fans have Cotto #1 WW. I myself have Shane and Cotto #2. And, at worse Cotto is #3. So yes he atleast he is trying to prove it. How does my argument not hold water?
I never said Pac was better. I said both fighters need to prove it.
I know. I apologize if I came across as disrespectful. After taking a second look at the dialogue, I was a smartass and I'm sorry. You commended me for making a good point with the Ali/Foreman/Frazier analogy, and I appreciate that.
Listen, the thing that bothers me is before the Marquez fight, the question being asked was: Why is Floyd fighting Marquez his first fight back? He could have taken an easier route here and still made the same amount of money.
Truth be told, none of us knew what Marquez was going to look like at WW before he fought Floyd. It wasn't until after Floyd handled him easily that people figured out that JMM wasn't really a threat at that weight to begin with.
Yes, I am not disputing that Pacquiao has won 6 world championships, I can't. It's the truth. I'm not disputing that David Diaz was more of a legitimate champion than Zab either. I will argue that Diaz has nowhere near the ring presence as Zab, and was nowhere near the threat to Pac as Zab was to Floyd. Many observers (including myself) noted Zab to be the heavier puncher, relatively equal handspeed, and even faster afoot than Floyd. David Diaz had none of these advantages fighting Pac.
I'm just saying, as of right now, you can't say that Pac is a better WW than Floyd. He has not shown that. And although Floyd's WW resume is not exactly a "who's who" of the division, he does have more experience at this weight and has beaten the guy that knocked out Cory Spinks. Hell even Jermain Taylor couldn't KO Spinks. I'm not saying that Pac was not, or is not a hell of a fighter. What I'm saying is until he at least beats Cotto, he has not shown anything in this division that would make me say "He is a better WW than Floyd.) Even if he were to beat Cotto on points, you could say that right there Pac fought a better WW than Floyd has ever fought, and you'd be right. As of now, I think it's premature to state that. Until Pac beats Cotto or ANY legitimate strong WW, you have to give Floyd the benefit of the doubt.
:boxing:Now the pavlik fight off who thinks this should happen?
Only people like you who despise Floyd, and want him to fight natural MWs so he can get beat.
How is there no way TAylor can win? He is probably the better boxer, he just doesn't know how to finish. HE was beating Froch and was beating Pavlik the first time before he was stopped. I think Taylor has a realistic shot of scoring the upset
AA, in the words of Roger Mayweather,: ain't neva seen a mufuka like Taylor!
Isn't riddick bowe the one who had a hard time against cruiserweight holyfield. Isn't riddick boye the punching bag of polish fighter Andrew Golota. The same Andrew Golota who was a punching bag for Lennox Lewis.
Just wishful thinking on the part of Merchant.
:boxing:
Seems to me like Taylor should just be able to out point Abraham. Taylor has all the advantages. Should just be a boxing clinic. Probably won't go like that but it should.
truth be told Zab Judah lacks focus in fights and them beats himself. and is huge a front runner.
Manny till he fights some legit comp will look like the second coming of Ali... if he ever fights Floyd he'll be in a world of trouble.
Every is over looking Cotto and thinks he's a shot broken fighter but he is the only one fighting legit competition. the stakes get high he comes out on top.
PBF looks for money fights and is disregarded because he fights bums as well as good comp... he is the one everyone is chasing. everyone wants to give him his first loss. it won't happen Pac not experienced, shane can't fight boxers, marg **** that cheater and if they do fight his ass has civilian speed on those punches with 0 accuracy when facing someone with decent defense.
floyd will shine threw not because he is the superior fighter of the decade but because he came around at the right time... and is pretty good with no major flaws.
Very nice analysis bro. Good reply.
You talking about before the loss to Baldomir, Judah and Floyd was in high demand. But, after a loss to Baldomir who is a bum. Nobody wanted to see it. Just Floyd and Zab fans. Who pretty much are the same people.
ANYBODY WHO IS REMOTELY FAMILIAR WITH ZAB had questions about Zab being overrated and a frontrunner. After the Baldomir fight. Those questions were confirmed and everybody knew he could not beat Zab.
ANYBODY WHO IS REMOTELY FAMILIAR WITH ZAB can throw any excuses to why he lossed to a bum. Cuz IF YOU ARE REMOTELY FAMILIAR WITH ZAB you would know when Zab what at his best. Top form struggled agaisnt Mickey Ward. So don't come at me with no excuses.
ANYBODY WHO IS REMOTELY FAMILIAR WITH ZAB knows that Zab is very overrated and a frontrunner. He is competetive for 4-5rds and then is he geaten beaten up.
Nobody wanted to see that fight. That is why Floyd got so much shi!t for fighting Zab. Cuz nobody wanted to see it. Just Floyd and Zab fans. Who pretty much are the same people.
I don't think you want to get into "remotely familar with Zab" arguments. HAHA
I acknowledged that "some of the luster" was taken off this fight after the loss to Baldomir, but not much, and this is why.. First, Zab lost to Tszyu and was still considered world class. Some people even wanted a rematch which was made impossible due to Zab's stupid post-fight antics. Zab lost to Spinks and what happened in the rematch? Everybody questioned Zab's discipline, but to my knowledge NOBODY EVER questioned his ability to fight like hell. OVERRATED? Are you kidding me? Ever since Zab's pro debut, people were impressed with his hand/foot speed, solid power, defense, etc. and thought he had great potential.
Top form against Mickey Ward? I don't think so. It seemed to me like his strategy in that fight was just to outbox the old Mickey Ward without even throwing REAL hard punched with mustard on them. I think he was in top form against Cotto and Clottey. He was jabbing and throwing solid wicked uppercuts. In the Clottey fight, Clottey decided he better just block for the first few rounds and not throw anything back! Zab was going to the body with both hands and doing everything he could to KO granite chinned Clottey. Admittedly, Zab was the lesser fighter to Cotto, and Clottey. Nobody ever claimed Zab to be Ray Leonard. Just a dangerous and solid guy, that when prepared is a real force to be reckoned with.
Beaten up after 4th or 5th rounds? Is that what happened with Junior Witter?! Zab never had a history of that until his first loss to Spinks. Earlier in his career (to which you seem to like to elude bringing up Ward etc.) he didn't have a history of losing at anytime!
The fans really didn't want Floyd-Judah anymore after Judah lossed to a bum. The only fans who wanted that fight were Floyd and Judah fans. Nobody else.
I beg your pardon? There were MANY in the boxing business that said they thought Judah had "just what it takes" to beat Floyd. They thought him to be faster, stronger, etc. Some of the luster was taken off this fight after the loss to Baldomir, but anybody even remotely familiar with Zab knew that he wasn't 100%. These people knew that when Zab signed to fight May, he knew he would have to grow a set of balls or he would get the sh*t stomped out of him. Zab trained his ass off and looked awesome on fight night. He was sharp and in shape, very focused. He just was not as good.
I think you are wrong my friend. I could get familiar with Zab argument. Especially with you cuz apparently you don't know much.
Well right here you just made my point. Everybody thought he was going to be something special. They even said he is Whitaker with power. If that is not overrated I don't know what is. Kosty showed how overrated he was. A remtach for what. He got KO'd in 2rds. By, the best JWW in the last 15yrs. A shot version of Chavez did a better job than what a overrated frontrunned Zab Judah did.
Please get familiar with Zab. He never belonged at WW. His best weith and when he was in top form is at 140. Why do you think he is back at 140. Cuz he is not good enough to hang with WWs. He was at his best at 140 and struggled again Ward. And, watch that fight again he did throw real hard punches with mustard on them. Ward is just a tough MOFO. Maybe you should get familiar with Ward too.
They claimed he was Whitaker but with power. He was overrated bro. The only fight big fight that I saw Zab in and thought Zab has a great chance to win this. Was agaisnt Cory Spinks. The only one. After that every big fight I saw Zab in I gave no chance cuz he is an overrated frontrunner and he has proven me right every time.
That was cuz Witter for some reason was scared. If he knew then what we know now. It probably would of been different. Ward, Millet, Baldomir this were fighters who gave Zab fits in the latter rounds.
LoL@ you not giving Zab credit for fighting good WW's, and peforming well despite your mentioned "fits." Zab didn't belong at WW? He was the undisputed WW Champion of the world. Just like Max Kellerman (now one of Zab's biggest critics) said "You can't get to be that with smoke and mirrors alone."
Surely you don't think that somebody could box Clottey as well as Zab did for even 8 rounds or whatever that lasted and not think he can compete at WW. Surely you don't think that somebody who had Cotto in serious trouble on more than one occasion and was the victim of foul play at moments where he seemed to be vulnerable. Even Freddie Roach admitted these things. C'mon man. I need to learn about Zab? Give me a break, I've seen almost every one of his fights supporting him through all his ups and downs.
If Witter knew then what we know now? What kind of argument is this? I'm not interested in engaging in hypotheticals.
None of these guys or their trainers are scared. But Cotto is too big for lil Pac and should win by KO, for his rep's sake.
Mangler, it's strange how we agree on so many things, yet we still disagree on just as much. I think Pac is flirting with the weight too much, also. I think Cotto is obviously the bigger, stronger man and will show that on fight night.
i didnt care for PBF-Bruseles, PBF-Mitchell, PBF-Baldomir, PBF-DLH, PBF-JMM
Believe it or not, there was a Floyd fight I remember seeing, where Manny Steward said Floyd could not beat Sharmba!!!!!!
Baldomir was the Champion after beating Zab, and had every belt except the IBF belt, for which he refused to pay sanctioning fees. Even Brian Kenny told Floyd he would have to defeat Baldomir to be the true WW Champ at the time.
PBF-DLH? Are you kidding? Floyd was actually calling for DLH long before the fight actually took place. What if the fight took place when Mayweather first started talking about it? Would you have wanted to see it then? I bet you would. :)
PBF-JMM? Here we go again. I love hearing this. The guy that everybody viewed as number 2 p4p in the world. The guy that won more rounds against Pac than he lost. The guy that almost half the people on youtube that I listened to, actually thought Mayweather was going to lose against. Not just wannabes but sports writers, journalists.. etc. After 21 months!!! Your arguments don't hold water, bud.
They got balls bro something ur boyfriend dont have.. They give the fans the fight they want..
The fans wanted Mayweather/Coralles, the fans wanted Mayweather/Castillo, the fans WANTED Mayweather/Gatti, the fans WANTED Mayweather/Judah!
Post Failed!!