Comments Thread For: Teddy Atlas: Golovkin Is Shot Fighter; Canelo-GGG Trilogy Too Late

[emceetns]

Would have helped his case even more?

You do realise that at the time Lara had a way better resume than GGG, was. Two belt champion, and had more credibility than any GGG opponent.

But you want him to prove himself a worthy candidate for GGG, the guy who was crying at the time about no one wanting to fight him?

You can't be serious. Are you actually serious?

Did you read what I wrote? I said that Lara would have been a good fight for Golovkin (i.e he was a worthy candidate)

I also said that he could have helped his case even more by moving up. Don't you think he could have boxed Golovkin in by becoming a mandatory or winning a belt at middleweight?

Could Golovkin have taken the fight? Yes

Could Lara have moved up and taken a fight at 160 after he didn't get the fight initially? Yes again.

Did Lara have to move up to prove himself? No, but it would increased demand beyond just hardcore fans

Read that however you want but that's my objective take.

[Doubledagger]

Did you read what I wrote? I said that Lara would have been a good fight for Golovkin (i.e he was a worthy candidate)

I also said that he could have helped his case even more by moving up. Don't you think he could have boxed Golovkin in by becoming a mandatory or winning a belt at middleweight?

Could Golovkin have taken the fight? Yes

Could Lara have moved up and taken a fight at 160 after he didn't get the fight initially? Yes again.

Did Lara have to move up to prove himself? No, but it would increased demand beyond just hardcore fans

Read that however you want but that's my objective take.

I get what you are saying. But understand this, there was no case to help for Lara.

Lara had a good resume and had many credible potential opponents at 154. He wasn't the one who needed a big name on his resume, and he wasn't the one crying about people not wanting to fight him or being too scared to fight him. He wasn't desperate for the fight.

GGG (at the time, not now though) was the one with no names on his resume and no one wanting to fight him.

So when he said everyone is scarred and doesn't want to fight him

Lara raised his hand and said: "I'm not scared, I can fight you any time."

Do you get it now.

Lara was basically calling GGG's bluff and GGG started putting obstacles. Lara didn't have to move up because he already called the bluff and GGG showed his belly.

Anyway, not saying Lara would have won (or lost), and not saying GGG isn't a skilled and very good fighter. He is very good, and his strong with a good chin. Just isn't the boogie man he pretended to be.

Remember all the mandatory excuses he made, and the moaning and *****ing about the wbc not mandating that Cotto and Canelo fight when he was the mandatory.

But when Charlo became mandatory, and when the wbc ordered that he fight Charlo, he started singing a different tune.

Anyway, he's still a good fighter, but we'll never know how good/or not he really is.

My take on his fight with Jacobs was that he is nothing special, but very good, but then, every fighter has those kind of fights, Mayweather had that kind of fight with Maidana in their first fight. So I let it go.

Then he fought Canelo. And my take is that both fights were close, but I also believe they were only close because of Canelo's complete lack of stamina. Canelo was clearly the way better boxer but Canelo cannot completely overwhelm his opponents because of a lack of stamina, he constantly has to pace himself otherwise he'll gas badly.

Still, you use what you have right?

So he's good enough to fight almost on par with Canelo, not bad.

The problem is that his record will only have Jacobs as a good win, and even that isn't that great, not bad mind you, but not great.

Bare in mind, his ducking of Andrade and Charlo doesn't excuse their own ducking. Charlo (160) has ducked Andrade and was called out by David Benevides and looked like he wanted to punch the guy who was interviewing him for asking. The question of whether he'll fight Benevides or not. He clearly didn't want none of that smoke.

Andrade has called him out repeatedly and he didn't want to hear none of it.

Andrade, oh my word, I don't even know where to start. Andrade ducked Lara three times, three times! He also ducked Charlo 154 (the smaller one) two times.

If I also recall, Derevyanchenko called out Charlo after his fight with GGG, no response.

Derevyanchenko also called out Andrade when Andrade had just moved up to 160 and they were both free and available. He called him out repeatedly and they even sent a contract and Andrade didn't reply.

Then he came back after Derevyanchenko gave up and got a new opponent, and his excuse was that he was visiting his grand parents.

Lara, well, I don't recall Lara ever dodging anyone. I can't say nothing bad about that guy.

Anyway the point is, when I point out GGG's ducking and Canelo's ducking, it ain't because I'm hating. I'm not afraid to call out my own guy for ducking. Andrade used to be my guy but I got sick of his ducking at 154.

I ain't hating on GGG, he just happens to be the current topic. I hate ducking no matter who does it.

[emceetns]

I get what you are saying. But understand this, there was no case to help for Lara.

Lara had a good resume and had many credible potential opponents at 154. He wasn't the one who needed a big name on his resume, and he wasn't the one crying about people not wanting to fight him or being too scared to fight him. He wasn't desperate for the fight.

GGG (at the time, not now though) was the one with no names on his resume and no one wanting to fight him.

So when he said everyone is scarred and doesn't want to fight him

Lara raised his hand and said: "I'm not scared, I can fight you any time."

Do you get it now.

Lara was basically calling GGG's bluff and GGG started putting obstacles. Lara didn't have to move up because he already called the bluff and GGG showed his belly.

Anyway, not saying Lara would have won (or lost), and not saying GGG isn't a skilled and very good fighter. He is very good, and his strong with a good chin. Just isn't the boogie man he pretended to be.

Remember all the mandatory excuses he made, and the moaning and *****ing about the wbc not mandating that Cotto and Canelo fight when he was the mandatory.

But when Charlo became mandatory, and when the wbc ordered that he fight Charlo, he started singing a different tune.

Anyway, he's still a good fighter, but we'll never know how good/or not he really is.

My take on his fight with Jacobs was that he is nothing special, but very good, but then, every fighter has those kind of fights, Mayweather had that kind of fight with Maidana in their first fight. So I let it go.

Then he fought Canelo. And my take is that both fights were close, but I also believe they were only close because of Canelo's complete lack of stamina. Canelo was clearly the way better boxer but Canelo cannot completely overwhelm his opponents because of a lack of stamina, he constantly has to pace himself otherwise he'll gas badly.

Still, you use what you have right?

So he's good enough to fight almost on par with Canelo, not bad.

The problem is that his record will only have Jacobs as a good win, and even that isn't that great, not bad mind you, but not great.

Bare in mind, his ducking of Andrade and Charlo doesn't excuse their own ducking. Charlo (160) has ducked Andrade and was called out by David Benevides and looked like he wanted to punch the guy who was interviewing him for asking. The question of whether he'll fight Benevides or not. He clearly didn't want none of that smoke.

Andrade has called him out repeatedly and he didn't want to hear none of it.

Andrade, oh my word, I don't even know where to start. Andrade ducked Lara three times, three times! He also ducked Charlo 154 (the smaller one) two times.

If I also recall, Derevyanchenko called out Charlo after his fight with GGG, no response.

Derevyanchenko also called out Andrade when Andrade had just moved up to 160 and they were both free and available. He called him out repeatedly and they even sent a contract and Andrade didn't reply.

Then he came back after Derevyanchenko gave up and got a new opponent, and his excuse was that he was visiting his grand parents.

Lara, well, I don't recall Lara ever dodging anyone. I can't say nothing bad about that guy.

Anyway the point is, when I point out GGG's ducking and Canelo's ducking, it ain't because I'm hating. I'm not afraid to call out my own guy for ducking. Andrade used to be my guy but I got sick of his ducking at 154.

I ain't hating on GGG, he just happens to be the current topic. I hate ducking no matter who does it.

Those are all fair points and I appreciate your perspective. You're objective and I respect that.

I'm not sure why Golovkin-Lara didn't happen but it would have helped both guys to be honest.

[ShoulderRoll]

I'm not sure why Golovkin-Lara didn't happen but it would have helped both guys to be honest.

We all know why it didn't happen.

Lara had to "prove himself" first. But Vanes Martirosyan could be coming off a loss to Lara yet still get a Golovkin matchup.



Golovkin's Coach: What Has Lara Done To Earn a Shot?

https://www.boxingscene.com/golovkins-coach-what-lara-done-earn-shot--93854

[Chollo Vista]

We all know why it didn't happen.

Lara had to "prove himself" first. But Vanes Martirosyan could be coming off a loss to Lara yet still get a Golovkin matchup.



Golovkin's Coach: What Has Lara Done To Earn a Shot?
https://www.boxingscene.com/golovkin...rn-shot--93854

Yes. I remember all this vividly.... People make it seem like everyone is just randomly hating on G. No, there's been PLENTY to hate on him for.

Stuff like what you just posted. Wash and repeat for 8 years.

[meat_abstract]

Lol, Canelo sure is getting a lot of $ out of other guys needing cash-out fights. Cotto, Kovalev, now GGG. Who's his next opponent? Bernard Hopkins? Roy Jones? Sugar Ray Leonard?

[emceetns]

We all know why it didn't happen.

Lara had to "prove himself" first. But Vanes Martirosyan could be coming off a loss to Lara yet still get a Golovkin matchup.



Golovkin's Coach: What Has Lara Done To Earn a Shot?
https://www.boxingscene.com/golovkin...rn-shot--93854

Well to be fair, Vanes was a tune-up and Golovkin only faced him because Canelo failed a drug test before their rematch. Vanes was a late replacement, and it didn't make sense to jeopardize the rematch in September by taking a dangerous fight (like Demetrius Andrade or Sergiy Derevyanchenko) on short notice in May. Even Canelo and Golden Boy wouldn't have wanted that.

[emceetns]

I get what you are saying. But understand this, there was no case to help for Lara.

Lara had a good resume and had many credible potential opponents at 154. He wasn't the one who needed a big name on his resume, and he wasn't the one crying about people not wanting to fight him or being too scared to fight him. He wasn't desperate for the fight.

GGG (at the time, not now though) was the one with no names on his resume and no one wanting to fight him.

So when he said everyone is scarred and doesn't want to fight him

Lara raised his hand and said: "I'm not scared, I can fight you any time."

Do you get it now.

Lara was basically calling GGG's bluff and GGG started putting obstacles. Lara didn't have to move up because he already called the bluff and GGG showed his belly.

Anyway, not saying Lara would have won (or lost), and not saying GGG isn't a skilled and very good fighter. He is very good, and his strong with a good chin. Just isn't the boogie man he pretended to be.

Remember all the mandatory excuses he made, and the moaning and *****ing about the wbc not mandating that Cotto and Canelo fight when he was the mandatory.

But when Charlo became mandatory, and when the wbc ordered that he fight Charlo, he started singing a different tune.

Anyway, he's still a good fighter, but we'll never know how good/or not he really is.

My take on his fight with Jacobs was that he is nothing special, but very good, but then, every fighter has those kind of fights, Mayweather had that kind of fight with Maidana in their first fight. So I let it go.

Then he fought Canelo. And my take is that both fights were close, but I also believe they were only close because of Canelo's complete lack of stamina. Canelo was clearly the way better boxer but Canelo cannot completely overwhelm his opponents because of a lack of stamina, he constantly has to pace himself otherwise he'll gas badly.

Still, you use what you have right?

So he's good enough to fight almost on par with Canelo, not bad.

The problem is that his record will only have Jacobs as a good win, and even that isn't that great, not bad mind you, but not great.

Bare in mind, his ducking of Andrade and Charlo doesn't excuse their own ducking. Charlo (160) has ducked Andrade and was called out by David Benevides and looked like he wanted to punch the guy who was interviewing him for asking. The question of whether he'll fight Benevides or not. He clearly didn't want none of that smoke.

Andrade has called him out repeatedly and he didn't want to hear none of it.

Andrade, oh my word, I don't even know where to start. Andrade ducked Lara three times, three times! He also ducked Charlo 154 (the smaller one) two times.

If I also recall, Derevyanchenko called out Charlo after his fight with GGG, no response.

Derevyanchenko also called out Andrade when Andrade had just moved up to 160 and they were both free and available. He called him out repeatedly and they even sent a contract and Andrade didn't reply.

Then he came back after Derevyanchenko gave up and got a new opponent, and his excuse was that he was visiting his grand parents.

Lara, well, I don't recall Lara ever dodging anyone. I can't say nothing bad about that guy.

Anyway the point is, when I point out GGG's ducking and Canelo's ducking, it ain't because I'm hating. I'm not afraid to call out my own guy for ducking. Andrade used to be my guy but I got sick of his ducking at 154.

I ain't hating on GGG, he just happens to be the current topic. I hate ducking no matter who does it.

I decided to do some quick research about why Golovkin-Lara didn't happen and one reason was network affiliations.

GGG was with HBO while Lara was with Showtime and obviously the fight wasn't big enough to work around that issue.

I wish that sort of thing wasn't an issue but it does provide some context.

Unfortunately it's not as simple as everyone hopping from network to network to fight whoever, whenever they want (as much as I wish that was possible).

[ShoulderRoll]

Well to be fair, Vanes was a tune-up and Golovkin only faced him because Canelo failed a drug test before their rematch. Vanes was a late replacement, and it didn't make sense to jeopardize the rematch in September by taking a dangerous fight (like Demetrius Andrade or Sergiy Derevyanchenko) on short notice in May. Even Canelo and Golden Boy wouldn't have wanted that.

It's too bad Golovkin never did a tune-up with Lara.

Incidentally, Canelo Alvarez did fight Erislandy Lara. He didn't make excuses.

[emceetns]

It's too bad Golovkin never did a tune-up with Lara.

Incidentally, Canelo Alvarez did fight Erislandy Lara. He didn't make excuses.

It sounds like you're comparing apples to oranges just because you don't like Golovkin. Yes, Canelo fought Lara in a PPV main event, not as a late replacement due to someone failing a drug test.

Lara isn't someone you face as a "tune-up" in May when you have a mega-fight lined up in September. Now if Golovkin didn't have the Canelo fight on the horizon then I would agree with you, but that wasn't the case.

As a matter of fact, Golden Boy promotions even objected to Golovkin facing Billy Joe Saunders in June, 2017 because they didn't want to jeopardize Canelo-GGG 1 (which of course took place in September)

Call it an excuse if you want but those are facts.