So did Mayweather officially duck Margarito now that it's over?

[amagnin]

i think he is the most natuarly gifted fighter ive ever seen box..i was on the edge of my seat rooting for him against Judah

but he hasnt established himself as elite at welter..nor did he at welter

im a boxing fan period. i belive his toughest fight at welter is Marg. ive been watching MARG for like 4-5 years now

Oh I misunderstood you. No you are right he didn't achieve elite status at 140 or 147. I think he becomes elite if he beats Baldomir or Margarito though. 140 was more of a scheduling problem. Plus would anybody have wanted to see him fight Maussa for a unification?

[Super_Lightweight]

The reasoning for Tony getting to fight Floyd before Baldy is simple.

1) Tony has been considered an upper tier fighter at 147 for much longer.

2) Tony has offered the money that Baldy's camp simply cannot.

3) Wins over Gatti and Judah are no better combined than Lewis and Cintron.

[amagnin]

That's not the issue. We are discussing what calling out Judah would do for Tony. The argument presented to me is that calling him out and beating him somehow gets Tony closer to a fight with Floyd. I never said a Lewis fight would do that...and neither would a Judah fight. Tony is a legitimate threat in the eyes of most boxing media (Dan Rafael, Brian Kenny, Bert Sugar) and many fans. That's all it takes. A few fans who think Floyd would easily tko Tony because he's a 'bum' do not make the world go round.

As for Tony fighting Williams/Quintana...that's fine. But Williams already has a fight and wants Tony after that. Who knows if Paul will even come down from his request of $6 million (an obviously ridiculous demand if it was not in jest)?

I'm not sure what Quintana plans to do next, but sure I would love to see Tony fight him.

But you understand my point that fighting another good fighter helps to legitimize what he did to Cintron. And not allow people to dismiss his best win as an overhyped prospect.

[charlie31]

Oh I misunderstood you. No you are right he didn't achieve elite status at 140 or 147. I think he becomes elite if he beats Baldomir or Margarito though. 140 was more of a scheduling problem. Plus would anybody have wanted to see him fight Maussa for a unification?

actaully Harris wanted to fight him before he lost to Massau

but yes, ofcourse..HE HAS FOUGHT WORSE COMPETITION than Massau

[amagnin]

The reasoning for Tony getting to fight Floyd before Baldy is simple.

1) Tony has been considered an upper tier fighter at 147 for much longer.

2) Tony has offered the money that Baldy's camp simply cannot.

3) Wins over Gatti and Judah are no better combined than Lewis and Cintron.

Yes but his main reason for fighting Baldomir is to become the RECOGNIZED CHAMP. Margarito can't offer that. That is why a while back on the board I said that Margarito should change his strategy and book a fight with Baldomir at any cost. If he wins and becomes the linear champ, then Floyd will have literally no excuse.

[amagnin]

actaully Harris wanted to fight him before he lost to Massau

but yes, ofcourse..HE HAS FOUGHT WORSE COMPETITION than Massau

But the alternative at that point was to move up to fight the undisputed welterweight champ in Judah. Can't fault him for Zab's mess up.

[amagnin]

The crappy fighters he faced like Brussles were all title eliminators or mandatory defenses. Floyd has never picked a really crappy opponent like that.

[Super_Lightweight]

I agree with that. Two undefeated prospects' heads looks better than one. Cintron already has redeemed himself quite a bit by beating an Angelo Dundee-trained David Estrada, who is a very solid fighter at 147. A win over someone like Quintana or Williams (moreso Quintana) would make the case that much better for Tony.

BTW, here are the WBO rankings at 147:

1. Paul Williams (NABO)
USA
2
2. Carlos Quintana (Latino)
PR
3
3. Shane Mosley
USA
4
4 . Jan Zaveck (Int-Cont)
SLO
5
5. Michael Trabant
GER
6
6. Joshua Clottey
GHA
7
7. Mark Suarez
USA
8
8. Zab Judah
USA
9
9. Joel Julio
COL
10
10. Cosme Rivera (Latino-Int)
MEX
11
11. Mehrdud Takalobighoshi
IRA
12
12. Walter Dario Matthysee
ARG
13 13. Kelvin Anderson GB
14 14. Kermit Cintron USA
15 15. Felix Flores PR

As you can see, the pickings are lean.

[Njord777]

The reasoning for Tony getting to fight Floyd before Baldy is simple.

1) Tony has been considered an upper tier fighter at 147 for much longer.

2) Tony has offered the money that Baldy's camp simply cannot.

3) Wins over Gatti and Judah are no better combined than Lewis and Cintron.

I have to disagree....firstly on point 2.) No, outright Baldomir will not offer Floyd 8 million (if that was more than Bob Arum bull****) but what you have to remember is that Mayweather would be the star attraction. Any Mayweather fight could make a bundle right now and Baldomir just garnered a few nods from both Judah and the large Gatti fans. Coupled with the fact that Mayweather could demand the majority of the money, and almost all the pay-per-view revenue...I think he could make more money than we are giving credit to from Baldomir. Especially without Bob Arum negotating the money.

Secondly, I don't believe that Cintron is better than Judah, even after his losses...though Gatti doesn't mean much at this stage- other than the way in which Baldomir won...taking every shot in the world and not stopping. It showed his size.

So, I don't think Antonio has a much better resume, despite being around longer, and I don't think the money is neccesarily much higher for a Margarito fight. We'll see. Just my opinion...but I think Baldomir is a better option right now at 147 as the linear Welterweight champion of the world. Adds to Floyd's credential.

[amagnin]

I agree with that. Two undefeated prospects' heads looks better than one. Cintron already has redeemed himself quite a bit by beating an Angelo Dundee-trained David Estrada, who is a very solid fighter at 147. A win over someone like Quintana or Williams (moreso Quintana) would make the case that much better for Tony.

BTW, here are the WBO rankings at 147:

1. Paul Williams (NABO)
USA
2
2. Carlos Quintana (Latino)
PR
3
3. Shane Mosley
USA
4
4 . Jan Zaveck (Int-Cont)
SLO
5
5. Michael Trabant
GER
6
6. Joshua Clottey
GHA
7
7. Mark Suarez
USA
8
8. Zab Judah
USA
9
9. Joel Julio
COL
10
10. Cosme Rivera (Latino-Int)
MEX
11
11. Mehrdud Takalobighoshi
IRA
12
12. Walter Dario Matthysee
ARG
13 13. Kelvin Anderson GB
14 14. Kermit Cintron USA
15 15. Felix Flores PR

As you can see, the pickings are lean.

Oh the pickings are lean now. But he has had 6 title defenses to beat 2 highly ranked fighters which he did not do. No use crying over spilt milk...he should do something about it (like fight Baldomir before Floyd can).