Would prime Tommy Morrison be undisputed HW champion against the current crop?

[DreamFighter]

no, but he could maybe win one belt, fair chance of doing it.

[DreamFighter]

He'd be David Price level.

The fact that an obese, 40 year old with a mummy guard was able to win a title speaks volumes about how weak the 90s division was.

thats just one 40something though, you'd need evidence of more than one to prove your point.

in fact your evidence proves the opposite, that the 40something was outstanding.

[billeau2]

Grew up pretty much without TV and and with a lot of books, man. Didn't formally study anything, though my old man used to make me read political philosphy in my early teens - tested me on that ish too. Ran away from home when I was like 17 and never got back into education - just dribs and drabs here and there, some night classes and stuff, but I never stopped reading and never lost my curiosity.

Well what you used in your post was very well done, and it is quite a sophisticated image. Medieval European philosophy became obsessed with logically proving the existence of God. And of course... Lets not forget Angels! Some of the logic became ridiculous, and one such enterprise was allegedly showing how many Angels could fit on a pin. Monty Python also spoofs some more of the crazier stuff like for example, if the world sits on a giant turtle, what does the giant turtle sit upon? Or, a witch is light and airy and will float on the surface of the water....you know the rest lol.

Books are imo the best teacher there is. I studied philosophy formally up to the MA level with a few years towards PHD at University of Toronto and while it was fun, it was hardly necessary to be a philosopher.

Its great to see someone else who grew up with books lol. I was in a similar situation growing up actually, as I would cut school, but would go home and read from our library which is now in my mother's apartment lol. I am 55 so the library has remained in tact which makes me feel good.

[Cutthroat]

thats just one 40something though, you'd need evidence of more than one to prove your point.

in fact your evidence proves the opposite, that the 40something was outstanding.

Your logic is flipped, if that happened to Wilder/AJ/Fury, how do you think this forum would react? I'm guessing with laughter.

Look at Jarrell Miller, he gets criticized for being overweight yet the guy is like 50lbs heavier than that version of Foreman & in significantly better shape.

Douglas KO'd Tyson, Rahman Lewis, Foreman Moorer, etc.

That's 3 champions from that era that were knocked out by the caliber of fighters AJ, Wilder, Fury toy with.

[UNBIASED BOXING]

He'd be David Price level.

The fact that an obese, 40 year old with a mummy guard was able to win a title speaks volumes about how weak the 90s division was.

The fact that a 41 year old Wladimir Klitschko was able to give AJ a very difficult fight speaks volumes about how weak the 2010s division was.

Not to mention, Wladimir had been stopped previously by Lamon Brewster, Corrie Sanders, and Ross Puritty. Wow, AJ must be a terrible fighter to struggle hard against an old Wladimir who clearly proved himself to be a bum!111!1

Let's not forget Wilder vs grandpa Ortiz, who is 'supposedly' 39 now.

Your logic is flipped, if that happened to Wilder/AJ/Fury, how do you think this forum would react? I'm guessing with laughter.

Look at Jarrell Miller, he gets criticized for being overweight yet the guy is like 50lbs heavier than that version of Foreman & in significantly better shape.

Douglas KO'd Tyson, Rahman Lewis, Foreman Moorer, etc.

That's 3 champions from that era that were knocked out by the caliber of fighters AJ, Wilder, Fury toy with.

Buster Douglas was actually a decent fighter with a lack of work ethic. When he fought Tyson, the tables were turned. Tyson was the one who lacked, and Douglas actually became a dedicated fighter. Too bad it didn't last for long, when he turned into a fat **** for his next fight against Holyfield.

Jarrell Miller doesn't have even half the resume Foreman does. The ****?

So what if Rahman knocked out Lewis? Lewis avenged that loss, did he not?

[_Rexy_]

thats just one 40something though, you'd need evidence of more than one to prove your point.

in fact your evidence proves the opposite, that the 40something was outstanding.

like I mentioned a few pages back, a 44 year old Larry Holmes (after his second retirement) beat a 30 year old undefeated Ray Mercer who had just almost murdered Tommy Morrison a few months earlier.

[_Rexy_]

Your logic is flipped, if that happened to Wilder/AJ/Fury, how do you think this forum would react? I'm guessing with laughter.

Look at Jarrell Miller, he gets criticized for being overweight yet the guy is like 50lbs heavier than that version of Foreman & in significantly better shape.

Douglas KO'd Tyson, Rahman Lewis, Foreman Moorer, etc.

That's 3 champions from that era that were knocked out by the caliber of fighters AJ, Wilder, Fury toy with.

Douglas was a good fighter though. Just didn't have his heart in it/was lazy. Lots of guys are like that.

[Cutthroat]

The fact that a 41 year old Wladimir Klitschko was able to give AJ a very difficult fight speaks volumes about how weak the 2010s division was.

Not to mention, Wladimir had been stopped previously by Lamon Brewster, Corrie Sanders, and Ross Puritty. Wow, AJ must be a terrible fighter to struggle hard against an old Wladimir who clearly proved himself to be a bum!111!1

Let's not forget Wilder vs grandpa Ortiz, who is 'supposedly' 39 now.



Buster Douglas was actually a decent fighter with a lack of work ethic. When he fought Tyson, the tables were turned. Tyson was the one who lacked, and Douglas actually became a dedicated fighter. Too bad it didn't last for long, when he turned into a fat **** for his next fight against Holyfield.

Jarrell Miller doesn't have even half the resume Foreman does. The ****?

So what if Rahman knocked out Lewis? Lewis avenged that loss, did he not?

Wlad was a ripped 40 year old though and AJ at the time was barely 3 1/2 years pro. It'd be one thing if Foreman was actually in shape but he literally had his **** and belly hanging out, and he was coming out of retirement.

Ortiz is in much better shape at 240lbs as well, Foreman was a fat 250-257 in the 90s and had a close MD win against Stewart. You're talking about different classes of fighters here.

Steward version Wlad wasn't getting sparked out like Lewis was. Pre-Steward Wlad would've lost to any modern HW too.


Miller gets criticized for not being in shape and is used as an example of a "Fat" heavyweight despite him being in significantly better shape than an old fat Foreman that won a title in the 90's.

Ortiz, Miller, etc. are knocking out Alex Stewart level guys, not going to close decisions like 90's Foreman was.

[DreamFighter]

Your logic is flipped.

no.

ONE 40something and NO others makes it in 90s. Thats the exception.

If there were several it would be the rule. How do you even manage to write "your logic is flipped?" without a hint of self irony.

As it happens we are seeing more near 40 year olds "contending" these days.

[DreamFighter]

like I mentioned a few pages back, a 44 year old Larry Holmes (after his second retirement) beat a 30 year old undefeated Ray Mercer who had just almost murdered Tommy Morrison a few months earlier.

mercer and morrison were mediocre, one with a great chin the other with great media coverage. Larry Holmes is the arguable number 3 best ever HW H2H. He didnt win not title at 44, I tihnk you agree, but he was clever.

Whilst I agree that the proliferation of titles made winning a title easier in the 90s, the top fighters were much better than today. The OP had to use Jarrell MIller as his shining example, speaks volumes. Miller is this decades Eric Esch.