Comments Thread For: Where Does Roy Jones Belong On The List Of Greatest Boxers?

[Dosumpthin]

Pac didn't win a title till 122

Manny smoked meth up until he became champion. Ducked drug testing for years.


Roy is a known ped user.


Who cares where they rank all time. They are cheaters anyway


Why do people rank these type

[IronDanHamza]

You should be in politics, Dan.

Don't know what to make of that

Anyway, I agree it was Tarver was practically ended his career. Jones was passed his best days but still one of the top fighters in the world, but then Tarver put a brutal end to that. He was never the same fighter after, obviously.

[Street]

#6
Robinson, Armstrong, Gavilan, Mayweather, and Ali are ahead of him

[robertzimmerman]

but he did lol >>> http://boxrec.com/media/index.php/Jo..._Roy_Jones_Jr.

toney lost 46lbs in six weeks. water, muscles whatever u wanna call it.. he was clearly not his best for that fight. period. not roys fault. but again it wasnt tarver and johnsons fault either.. his weight loss from HW is whats cited by the majority of fans and historians to explain his decline. this is the first time i read someone saying the weight loss had nothing to do with it.

For the Ruiz fight, Roy weighed in at 193 fully clothed, but the scales weren't calibrated properly. Mackie Shilstone helped Roy prepare for the fight, and he had him above that weight before the weigh-in. The weigh-in was conducted by Marc Ratner of the NSAC. Mackie told Ratner of the mistake, so Ratner reweighed Roy the day of the fight. And he was 199 clothed. It was documented in the documentary: 'The Sweet Science' and in a column written by Thomas Hauser. After Roy had been reweighed, Mackie and Ratner shared a joke, with Mackie telling him "I told you so"

The other thing to consider, is that Roy only had a few months to shed that weight. He'd kept his physique that he had for Ruiz, as he was still pondering possible HW fights in the Summer of 2003. He contemplated fighting Corrie Sanders in August, but he backed out when he the reward didn't match the risk. He then signed to fight Tarver in September, and the fight was held on the 8th of November. Roy spent most of his camp running.

Regarding Toney, yes, he wasn't 100%. His weight loss also took a lot out of him. Personally, I don't think it would have made any difference if he'd have been 100% fit. Because I think it was just a terrible match up for him stylistically. But it does have to be noted that he wasn't at his best.

Regarding the Tarver and Johnson fights, Tarver caught him with a perfect shot, and Glen beat him just a few months later when he was still shell-shocked. The weight loss was a huge factor, because he lost his reflexes and his punch resistance after he'd dropped back to LHW. A split second is all it takes in boxing.

[robertzimmerman]

Beyond MW cannot be used for MW.
You can't just retroactively add to their career.

It can if you're judging on a H2H basis, and the fighter held the exact same attributes at both weights, weights that he fought at in the same year.

Roy fought Hopkins, Tate and Malinga at MW. Again, he fought Toney the same year he fought Tate.

Roy doesn't need to possess a stacked resume at MW, in order for people to predict he was a great fighter at the weight.

Again, he only had 6 fights at SMW.

Calzaghe spent 14 years there.

Who was the better SMW?

It's clearly Roy.

[robertzimmerman]

Hi JLC

I'm not saying RJJ was not the best in his era in his prime he was for a while he definitely belongs in HOF.

ALL I'm saying is his not a ATG for me you have to look at his whole career and that's his Prime and end career, sadly he did not walk away. The Ali and SRL knew when to walk away so just the blemishes at the end doesn't mean they aren't a ATG. when Roy started to decline and still fought on to be stopped by a shot Maccrinelli he erased himself from a ATG. that's my take I will not decide his status as a ATG the powers that be will, I'm not asking anyone to agree with me but make your own mind up. Let's see where the powers that be rate him it will be interesting.

You're reasoning is silly and illogical.

How on earth does the loss to Enzo at nearly 47 disqualify him from being an ATG?

You're being ridiculous.

[stealthradon]

It can if you're judging on a H2H basis, and the fighter held the exact same attributes at both weights, weights that he fought at in the same year.

Roy fought Hopkins, Tate and Malinga at MW. Again, he fought Toney the same year he fought Tate.

Roy doesn't need to possess a stacked resume at MW, in order for people to predict he was a great fighter at the weight.

Again, he only had 6 fights at SMW.

Calzaghe spent 14 years there.

Who was the better SMW?

It's clearly Roy.

That's the dumbest thing I ever heard.
Was Max Schmeling a good SMW?
Was Michael Spinks?
Prince Naseem was the best Super Flyweight?

If GGG moves up to 168 is he then among the best SMW of all time even if he only has one fight there?

[robertzimmerman]

I respect your opinion.

I think if he had fought some more big names, maybe a rematch w Hopkins earlier, maybe fights w the big name UK fighters like Benn, or Eubank, or even fighting the Michaelwezeski guy that had the wbo at light heavy would have cemented him as an ATG. Admittedly I wasn’t a huge boxing fan in the 90s so I missed his era, as well as the climate, politics, and the feel for some of the fighters I mentioned. Maybe they weren’t making enough noise at the time for Roy to bother with them. Maybe they were already washed up. I can’t say. ( if anyone has any info on why a Roy v Eubank/Benn fight didn’t happen I’d love to hear it. Was it talked about at all back then ? )


He was an ATG talent no doubt. He had excellent accomplishments for sure. He was dominant indeed. The lack of opposition is the ONLY thing that hurts him from my perspective. Even then he was WILDLY popular so I’m not mad at anyone who considers him an ATG. He passes the eye test.

Chris Eubank never wanted to fight the likes of Roy, Toney and Nunn etc. He's on record stating that. He's very honest. He said that fighting Roy would have been career suicide. He also said that he was just content to defend his WBO belt on Sky and ITV in Britain. It was enough for him just be respected. He never sought the best or sought to be the best. However, he did say that he would have fought anyone who became his WBO mandatory, including Roy, even though in his opinion, it would have taken years off of their careers. But that would never have been possible, as guys like Roy would never have been rated by the WBO.

Nigel Benn was a different kettle of fish. He really did want to fight Roy. But the problem was that Don King promoted him alongside Frank Warren. And Don King and Roy's advisors, The Levin Bros, never saw eye to eye. They had a deep dislike and distrust of each other. According to Roy, King always wanted future options on him which he and the Levin's were never willing to agree to.

[robertzimmerman]

You're ****ing right I am. Emanuel Steward was commenting how Tarver was having trouble with Roy's footspeed and handspeed only minutes before he was knocked out in the second fight. When asked again after the fight Steward said he saw no signs of Roy being diminished and that Tarver simply "had his number."

Oh right.

And did Glen Johnson just have his number too?

Are you saying there was no difference between the versions of Roy who fought Hill and Griffin, to the ones who fought Tarver and Glen?

Roy's unique ability was based around his incredible athleticism.

He was never the same after he dropped back from HW.

Tarver would always have caused Roy problems, but in their rematch, he just caught him with a peach.

[robertzimmerman]

Do you have any idea what you're talking about? You're just making **** up.

Did Naseem Hamed become "shot" at 28 years old after Barrera took his soul???

Have you seen the Calvo fight??? He didn't even look like the same guy after his confidence got snatched. He was slow AF.. You people don't seem to understand the faintest thing about athletes and sports psychology..

I'm an advocate of how huge psycholology is in any aspect of life. It really does play a huge role.

Yes, I agree that Tarver turned his world upside down, before Glen Johnson capitalised on that. Yes, it made him gun shy. But that does not alter the fact that he was 35 years old, and he'd been up to HW and back over a 50 fight year career.

If he hadn't have fought Tarver or Glen, I agree that he'd have had huge confidence fighting someone else. But realistically, if he wasn't willing to adapt his style to his advancing years, it was always going to happen sooner or later. He was a reflex based fighter. A split second is all it takes.

Look at his fights after his mini comeback when he fought Tito and Calzaghe. He had the hand speed but not the legs. His reflexes were also diminished. It's clear to see.

Look what happened to Chris Byrd and Chad Dawson when they dropped weight. I think Tarver also suffered when he dropped weight to fight Hopkins.

With Roy, it was a mixture of confidence, diminished reflexes, and diminished punch resistance. The shot he took against Glen wasn't particularly brutal, yet he was out for a long time.