Fighters who ducked fighters but tried to make it look like the other way around

[alexguiness]

One that annoyed me is when Bradley tried to fight Khan and Khan wouldn't agree. Then a while down the line Bradley's contract with Shaw was running down and he had an offer from Arum, it became clear Timmeh was going to sit out and wait, so then Khan went full-on pretending he wanted the fight because he knew him and GBP could spin it to the media as 'everyone ducking Khan' etc. and most of this forum believed it.

It was frustrating to see at the time, but I guess as the years have gone on people have accepted that Bradley was someone who wanted to fight the best whereas Khan is a joke.

You are correct, this duck by Khan was overlooked at the time. Khan 'ducks no-one ' ducked Bradley andthen said he never got the offer or some BS.

['b']

Is the argument that Mayweather ducked Pacquiao operating under the assumption that a younger Mayweather in his prime wouldn't beat a younger Pacquiao in his prime?

[Willy Wanker]

One that annoyed me is when Bradley tried to fight Khan and Khan wouldn't agree. Then a while down the line Bradley's contract with Shaw was running down and he had an offer from Arum, it became clear Timmeh was going to sit out and wait, so then Khan went full-on pretending he wanted the fight because he knew him and GBP could spin it to the media as 'everyone ducking Khan' etc. and most of this forum believed it.

It was frustrating to see at the time, but I guess as the years have gone on people have accepted that Bradley was someone who wanted to fight the best whereas Khan is a joke.

I remember that whole fiasco and I was one of those people hating on Bradley, until I realized he was just doing all the right moves to secure a Pacquiao fight. He ended up getting three of them and a big fight with Marquez as well. Now he has a job with ESPN.

Since then Khan took three Ls, two by KO and he's still talking about fighting Floyd and Manny. He has wife problems. Hasn't fought in almost two years. He got caught beating off for a webcam girl. And now Muslims want to kill him because he likes Christmas trees.

[GrandmasterWang]

Is the argument that Mayweather ducked Pacquiao operating under the assumption that a younger Mayweather in his prime wouldn't beat a younger Pacquiao in his prime?

Maybe Mayweather would have won, maybe he wouldn't have, we'll never know because Floyd made it pretty obvious that he didn't want the fight.

Every time he was asked back then about Pacquiao he would um and ar and come up with some excuse.

The one where he said he needed to protect his health was my favourite though.

With Pac being an offensive fighter and Floyd being a defensive fighter, it was clear that Pac would have less longevity as defensive fighters almost always have longer careers/primes as they take less risks.

Floyd even said that sometimes fighters just have hot streaks that you have to wait out... which he did.

Sucks as a fan, but if I was Floyd's manager I would have advised him to duck Pacquiao as well.... which he did.

Made business sense to duck the dangerous, harder punching and faster Pacquiao when Floyd could make bank fighting lessor opponents.

It was when watching Pacman/Bradley 1 and seeing how Pac didn't have the stamina to keep his output or pressure up that I thought...hmm, maybe Floyd will actually consider fighting Pacquiao now.

All the drug testing demands etc by Floyd were just cover to deflect from his ducking.

Floyd also retired to avoid dangerous opponents, but that had nothing to do with Pacquiao. I'm a big fan of Floyd and his amazing technique but he's never sought out the biggest challenges.

[yankees7448]

Jones Faded? that is a ridiculous understatement on Jone's condition as a fighter in 2010.

You're 100% correct. Jones was more than faded was done. He should have retired after the Glen Johnson KO and many points afterwards. He had just been destroyed by Danny Green in the fight right before the B-hop rematch.

[yankees7448]

So because a 160 pound fighter wanted a catch weight in the middle with a smw that some how makes ggg the one who ducked?

Right on the money. Its called being fair.

[yankees7448]

Why can't we just agree that neither Ward nor GGG wanted to give up a weight advantage to fight the other? Each of them contradicted themselves. It's a wash.

That's definitely fair.

[yankees7448]

Triple jab shouldve actually took a risk with his career and fought ward at 168. He could actually make that weight but no he didnt want to.

Little Ward could have agreed to come down to 164 to fight GGG much like Dawson dropped down from 175 to fight Ward. Ward was using GGG to remain relevant while he was busy ducking Dan Goosen. Ward knew the fight would never get made.

[yankees7448]

They both obviously only offered up those relatively low weights because it was for the kind of money you'd give up almost anything for. I wouldn't hesitate to get in the ring with AJ or Wilder (or both) for that kind of money.

Holding them to that for every fight is silly. GGG shouldn't be expected to go down to 154 reasonably, and Ward shouldn't be expected to go down to 160 reasonably.

Offering up a catchweight in general is a weak move - you are either flexing the A-side for an advantage or you are requesting a weight you know is too low for the other fighter to accept.

Around the time period GGG made the 164lb offer Ward had just weighed in for Paul Smith at just under 172 and GGG had not yet even fought Lemieux. He was not just requesting an advantage as the A-side, he was asking for Ward to come down a lot of weight to avoid the fight.

Except at that time GGG was the mandatory for the Canelo/Cotto winner at 160. It is ridiculous to expect the more popular fighter to risk a star making fight against geniune PPV stars to go up another division to fight a much bigger and stronger opponent who also happens to be one of the most skilled boxers of his generation. Asking him to meet GGG halfway is a reasonable request especially when Ward was so inactive as to be comparatively irrelevant. Ward was barely fighting during GGG's rise because of Ward's promotional problems.

[yankees7448]

In what alternate reality does GGG ever beat Ward? 164, 168, 175 whatever - Ward gets a wide UD or stops GGG.

GGG is too hittable for Ward and would get stopped in the later rounds most likely. The best decision Dis-Abel 'Dirty' Sanchez ever made was to keep GGG from Ward, or else his stock would have dropped MASSIVELY.

Ward's offer was fake because he knew he probably couldn't make 168 let alone 164. He was using GGG's reputation to make him relevant again. He was so inactive during GGG's rise he was forced to settle for headlining the only boxing card ever aired on BET. Calling out GGG was a marketing ploy. Pure and simple.