Will Sergey "The Klutcher" Holdalev do more than a head lock to stop inside fighting

[TonyGe]

How the hell did I not answer your question? There was no head contact with his body.

I like how suddenly you have no mention of a "body headbutt" Now it's all about Ward ducking below the waist. Is that a foul perpetrated against Kovalev?

What did Kovalev say when he was warned by the ref? Did he say, "Well he's ducking below the waist." Did he say, "Well, he's butting my body." Nope.

You're full of shlt and the way you are responding shows you are full of shlt. There was no body head-butt period. Kovalev wasn't grabbing because Ward ducked below the waist. Furthermore, you yourself kept talking about how one instance of ducking below the waist doesn't mean anything, yet you refuse to move past this one instance of it.


Thank you for proving you're just a butthurt fan making excuses.

Ducking below the waist is an illegal tactic. A foul in other words. Yeah it's a foul committed by Ward.

[therealpugilist]

There weren't any because Kovalev stuffed Ward when he came in with his head down.

then why complain about things that didnt happen, and thanks for admitting the guy used front head locks like he is a high school wrestler

[therealpugilist]

Ducking below the waist is an illegal tactic. A foul in other words. Yeah it's a foul committed by Ward.

...ward kept his hands high, bending his knees and would pivot or use head movement...were no headbutts at all....he wasnt ducking below the waist with his head past his knees...you're reaching bro

[satiev1]

Quite possibly the worst troll thread in the history of Boxing scene.

[travestyny]

Ducking below the waist is an illegal tactic. A foul in other words. Yeah it's a foul committed by Ward.

So every time Kovalev clinched, Ward ducked below his waist, or is that just an excuse?

[Mr Objecitivity]

How the hell did I not answer your question? There was no head contact with his body.

I like how suddenly you have no mention of a "body headbutt" Now it's all about Ward ducking below the waist. Is that a foul perpetrated against Kovalev?

What did Kovalev say when he was warned by the ref? Did he say, "Well he's ducking below the waist." Did he say, "Well, he's butting my body." Nope.

You're full of shlt and the way you are responding shows you are full of shlt. There was no body head-butt period. Kovalev wasn't grabbing because Ward ducked below the waist. Furthermore, you yourself kept talking about how one instance of ducking below the waist doesn't mean anything, yet you refuse to move past this one instance of it.


Thank you for proving you're just a butthurt fan making excuses.

How the hell did I not answer your question?

The more appropriate question is: how did you answer my question?

I specifically asked about what Andre Ward's head was doing after he raised it to Sergey Kovalev's chest height when he came back up from a ducked / lower position. Your response had no relevance to that particular question.

There was no head contact with his body.

Yes, there was!

I like how suddenly you have no mention of a "body headbutt"

I've mentioned it enough times already. Just because I did not repeat it in my previous post doesn't mean I've taken that particular point back.

Now it's all about Ward ducking below the waist.

Which is exactly what occurred and which is something that is illegal!

Is that a foul perpetrated against Kovalev?

Doesn't have to be! If Andre Ward commits the initial / first foul in a particular sequence, then he is the one 'initiating' the fouls / illegal moves.

What did Kovalev say when he was warned by the ref?

Non sequitur logical fallacy! Sergey Kovalev doesn't have to say anything to the referee. He and his team have already said what they needed to in the locker room before the fight whilst wrapping up.

Just because Kovalev didn't say anything to the referee regarding Ward's fouls during the fight doesn't mean Ward wasn't committing a foul / illegal move.

You're full of shlt

You're full of fallacies, flawed logic and ad hominem / personal attacks.

There was no body head-butt period.

Yes, there was a body head-butt period!

Kovalev wasn't grabbing because Ward ducked below the waist.

Which is irrelevant because the main argument was, IF ANDRE WARD WAS INITIATING FOULS / ILLEGAL MOVES. The fact is, in that particular sequence, Andre Ward ducked below the waist (which is a foul) before Sergey Kovalev committed any fouls of his own.

Furthermore, you yourself kept talking about how one instance of ducking below the waist doesn't mean anything, yet you refuse to move past this one instance of it.

Singular instances don't mean much, yes! However, there isn't any reason for moving to another point until the initial point has been resolved.

I'm not moving over to another point until we come to an agreement that:

1) Andre Ward committed illegal moves before Sergey Kovalev committed any illegal moves of his own

2) Andre Ward ducked below the waist (which is a foul / illegal move).

3) Andre Ward attempted a headbutt and made contact on Sergey Kovalev's body with his head, both which are illegal

in the gif I posted. Until we do, then we're moving to a new problem with the first problem being unresolved, which is irrational and illogical (which I am not, but I can't speak for you).

[travestyny]

1) Andre Ward committed illegal moves before Sergey Kovalev committed any illegal moves of his own

WRONG. To see who made the first illegal move with regard to clinches, you have to look at the first clinch. You refuse to look at the first clinch in this fight because....? Well let me stop there before you go on with more of your (il)logical bullshlt. You want to "resolve" the first issue. There is nothing to resolve. You say there is a body headbutt. I say there isn't. You REFUSE to show the exact moment that his head made contact with Kovalev's body. I wonder why.

2) Andre Ward ducked below the waist (which is a foul / illegal move).

Being that I've never seen a professional fighter warned for this, I'm wondering if a crouch is the same as what you are describing. In any event, and for the sake of moving this along so that you stop your blatant ducking, let's say Ward ducked below the waist in this particular instance. So Ward committed a foul first. Care to look at the other 53 instances of Kovalev clinching now??? Or will you still duck?

3) Andre Ward attempted a headbutt and made contact on Sergey Kovalev's body with his head, both which are illegal

Once again, are you going to step up and tell me the exact moment that his head makes contact with Kovalev's body, or will you keep ducking. I'm noticing a trend. Duck duck duck.

in the gif I posted. Until we do, then we're moving to a new problem with the first problem being unresolved, which is irrational and illogical (which I am not, but I can't speak for you).

I aced every single one of my logic courses at an Ivy League university. You aren't impressing me with your ******ed argument based on false premises.

[travestyny]

Yes, there was a body head-butt period!

Even TonyGe, who agrees with you about bending below the waist, went on record saying there were no headbutts.

where we the headbutts in his fight with kovalev?

There weren't any because Kovalev stuffed Ward when he came in with his head down.

We all know you can't commit a foul in retaliation for a foul, right? I think what this discussion has evolved into is the topic of Robbie Barrett's thread, which is who initiated the fouling in the instances of clinches.

If Ward did not headbutt Kovalev, then he simply can not be seen as initiating a foul. Again, there is no foul if there is no headbutt. Now, if you want to discuss ducking below the waist, which we should all agree is done nearly in every fight and is not an egregious foul (but you guys clearly want to be very technical for the sake of your agenda), then I would ask whether you believe Ward ducked below the waist during the 54 times that Kovalev clinched. The video is out there and it will prove that this did not happen.

[TonyGe]

...ward kept his hands high, bending his knees and would pivot or use head movement...were no headbutts at all....he wasnt ducking below the waist with his head past his knees...you're reaching bro

It's ducking below the waist of your opponent. When I say headbutt I mean their heads didn't make contact. I'm sure if Kovalev didn't control Ward's head he would have recieved a headbutt from Ward.

[Mr Objecitivity]

WRONG. To see who made the first illegal move with regard to clinches, you have to look at the first clinch. You refuse to look at the first clinch in this fight because....? Well let me stop there before you go on with more of your (il)logical bullshlt. You want to "resolve" the first issue. There is nothing to resolve. You say there is a body headbutt. I say there isn't. You REFUSE to show the exact moment that his head made contact with Kovalev's body. I wonder why.

Being that I've never seen a professional fighter warned for this, I'm wondering if a crouch is the same as what you are describing. In any event, and for the sake of moving this along so that you stop your blatant ducking, let's say Ward ducked below the waist in this particular instance. So Ward committed a foul first. Care to look at the other 53 instances of Kovalev clinching now??? Or will you still duck?



Once again, are you going to step up and tell me the exact moment that his head makes contact with Kovalev's body, or will you keep ducking. I'm noticing a trend. Duck duck duck.



I aced every single one of my logic courses at an Ivy League university. You aren't impressing me with your ******ed argument based on false premises.

What was Andre Ward's head doing after he raised his head from a ducked / lower position?

Wasn't Ward moving his head towards Sergey Kovalev's body from less than an arm's length distance?

Didn't Andre Ward cause a reaction from his headbutt?

The answer is yes to all of those questions and Andre Ward's actions in that gif are fouls / illegal moves.

If you answer no to any of those questions, then you need to explain yourself and provide evidence to the contrary.