Miguel Cotto

[SunSpace]

Exhibit B.

Again, saying so doesn't make it true. You either put up the evidence, or you don't.

And so far, you haven't.

[Sweet Jones]

Again, saying so doesn't make it true. You either put up the evidence, or you don't.

And so far, you haven't.

Just want to make sure I understand this. You want me to provide 'evidence', even though we've seen Miguel Cotto in the ring with both men and it was clearly demonstrated why he's not on their level.

23 rounds, with Cotto maybe winning (generously) 4-5, got dropped multiple times, spent multiple rounds in full blown retreat mode in one of the fights before a mercy stoppage to protect him and couldn't compete with a guy fighting above his optimum weight with a 5 days-away jail sentence hanging over his head.


You know this happened, right? :

[IMG]http://i165.***********.com/albums/u63/tigerbj/db3f7adea4ba.gif[/IMG]

and this right:



In two fights against the best of his generation, the most positive thing you can say is that 'he made them work' and bloodied a dude's nose.

Not on their level, bruh. Deal with it.

[KillaCamNZ]

He was a good fighter who believed he was a great fighter. And when he fell short of his own expectations, he had some ****ty ways of dealing with it.

[SunSpace]

Just want to make sure I understand this. You want me to provide 'evidence', even though we've seen Miguel Cotto in the ring with both men and it was clearly demonstrated why he's not on their level.

23 rounds, with Cotto maybe winning (generously) 4-5, got dropped multiple times, spent multiple rounds in full blown retreat mode in one of the fights before a mercy stoppage to protect him and couldn't compete with a guy fighting above his optimum weight with a 5 days-away jail sentence hanging over his head.


You know this happened, right? :

[IMG]http://i165.***********.com/albums/u63/tigerbj/db3f7adea4ba.gif[/IMG]

and this right:



In two fights against the best of his generation, the most positive thing you can say is that 'he made them work' and bloodied a dude's nose.

Not on their level, bruh. Deal with it.

You're running for the hills now, because fights against each other isn't even the debate topic. We're debating resumes.

So provide evidence, or deal with the reality that Cotto's resume is better.

As to your actual comment, I've already explained that Cotto was in no shape to be fighting them at that point in his career. Which is precisely why they wanted to fight him. That's the definition of cherry-picking.

It means nothing. Even the most ardent Mayweather or Pacquiao fan would acknowledge that facing a prime Cotto would've meant different fights altogether.

Even Roach, now, acknowledges Cotto's too big, too strong for Pacquiao. Which is why the only time they offered a rematch, they wanted to drain him again.

You can have a W in your book against King Kong, but if King Kong was a shell of himself, it means nothing.

And btw, even the shell version of Cotto gave Mayweather an extremely tough fight. Way better than what he was given credit for.

I actually had Cotto winning, but I understand how it could be seen the other way, as well. If you disagree, fine, that's not what's being debated, anyway, but the fact is that it was a tough fight given to possibly the best version of Mayweather I've ever seen in the ring. The only fight arguably tougher in Mayweather's career was Maidana, and I suspect part of that had to do with Floyd not taking Maidana as seriously as he did for the rematch. For Cotto, Floyd has openly stated that he took himself to the limit in training camp, and his whole team said he was in the best form they had ever seen in years. Since Corrales, I believe was the exact quote. And I certainly agree; Mayweather didn't look human that night. I'll leave the IV situation out of this, though, despite Hauser's evidence.

All in all, the case could be made for the shell of Cotto being a peak Mayweather's hardest fight ever...

Imagine a prime version of Cotto in there.

Mayweather knew what would happen, which is precisely why, when asked about facing Cotto back then by Larry Merchant, he said that he wasn't going to let boxing retire him, that he would retire from boxing before taking that kind of punishment.

And retire he did, until the coast was clear. He knew what was up.

Mayweather came back later, after Cotto had been assaulted by Margarito's plaster, and after Margarito had been caught, claiming that he had known something was "wrong" with Margarito, as if that were to excuse ducking everybody like he did.

Please.

And it wouldn't be his last time, by far. We all saw how the Pacquiao rivalry played out.

But again, the actual topic is resumes, so let's not change it:

Cotto's resume is better.

Provide evidence against this

Or

Deal with it.

[Sweet Jones]

You're running for the hills now, because fights against each other isn't even the debate topic. We're debating resumes.

So provide evidence, or deal with the reality that Cotto's resume is better.

As to your actual comment, I've already explained that Cotto was in no shape to be fighting them at that point in his career. Which is precisely why they wanted to fight him. That's the definition of cherry-picking.

It means nothing. Even the most ardent Mayweather or Pacquiao fan would acknowledge that facing a prime Cotto would've meant different fights altogether.

Even Roach, now, acknowledges Cotto's too big, too strong for Pacquiao. Which is why the only time they offered a rematch, they wanted to drain him again.

You can have a W in your book against King Kong, but if King Kong was a shell of himself, it means nothing.

And btw, even the shell version of Cotto gave Mayweather an extremely tough fight. Way better than what he was given credit for.

I actually had Cotto winning, but I understand how it could be seen the other way, as well. If you disagree, fine, that's not what's being debated, anyway, but the fact is that it was a tough fight given to possibly the best version of Mayweather I've ever seen in the ring. The only fight arguably tougher in Mayweather's career was Maidana, and I suspect part of that had to do with Floyd not taking Maidana as seriously as he did for the rematch. For Cotto, Floyd has openly stated that he took himself to the limit in training camp, and his whole team said he was in the best form they had ever seen in years. Since Corrales, I believe was the exact quote. And I certainly agree; Mayweather didn't look human that night. I'll leave the IV situation out of this, though, despite Hauser's evidence.

All in all, the case could be made for the shell of Cotto being a peak Mayweather's hardest fight ever...

Imagine a prime version of Cotto in there.

Mayweather knew what would happen, which is precisely why, when asked about facing Cotto back then by Larry Merchant, he said that he wasn't going to let boxing retire him, that he would retire from boxing before taking that kind of punishment.

And retire he did, until the coast was clear. He knew what was up.

Mayweather came back later, after Cotto had been assaulted by Margarito's plaster, and after Margarito had been caught, claiming that he had known something was "wrong" with Margarito, as if that were to excuse ducking everybody like he did.

Please.

And it wouldn't be his last time, by far. We all saw how the Pacquiao rivalry played out.

But again, the actual topic is resumes, so let's not change it:

Cotto's resume is better.

Provide evidence against this

Or

Deal with it.

Exhibit C.

The delusion of Cotto stans is so, so sad.

[bigjavi973]

And every bit of that is a colossal pile of ***in ****, Jesus you guys arent boxing fans. You are career haters, Id link some videos for you but you are already lost. You fools talk **** about people you wouldnt be able to touch on the best day in your life. There isnt a man on this board who could **** with the journeyman who is fighting the prospect who dont have a ****ing chance of ever making it into the top 100 of any rankings but you feel like you have the right to rate any of them. Its unbelievable the nerve you fat ***ers have. Im positive Id knock every one of you fat ***in ******* out in a round or two. This entire board is filled with mfers who have been around it because of their dads or mfers who wished they could. The damn near entirety of you need to shut the *** up.

Daaaaaaaaaaaaaaaamn

[BM dnobagaV]

Lol, Manny & Floyd are Top Twenty ATG's in the sport. Shame be to Cotto that he couldn't annihilate them!

[-DSG-]

Cotto will be in the HOF the haters can deal with it!

[bigjavi973]

Exhibit B.

[Elroy The Great]

pti,
cotto dodged/blocked most of what pac did in that clip.