The Penalty For Being Too Good (Rigondeaux, Golovkin, Ward)

[Pigeons]

Whether or not GGG would have beaten Ward it would have undeniably been a far tougher fight - and less lucrative - than fighting the WBC champ (Cotto or Canelo) for whom he was a mandarory. He opted for the easier, better paid fight - only in the world of boxing forums does this make a man a coward. Furthermore taking the Ward fight would almost certainly have negated his MW mando status and ruled out the biggest payday available to him whereas aiming to fight for the MW lineage now still left open the possibility of moving up to fight Ward or any other top SMW later. Sensible rather than cowardly I would have said, but then maybe thats just me.

That said, with hindsight it's looking increasingly likely that fighting Ward may have been the better option - certainly it's a far more interesting fight IMO, but to call a guy cowardly for letting his promoter make what at the time seemed to be the smart choice is just silly.

Ward was in a similar position. He was out of options at 168, he either beat everyone (Froch, Abraham) or there were political roadblocks (PBC: DeGale, Jack). He could have remained at 168 fighting B- and C-level opposition waiting for Golovkin to either clean out 160 before moving up or hoping Golovkin would take the fight in the future before he cleaned out 160. That would have left Ward waiting at least 2 years for something that may never happen while his career continued to stagnate.

Ward instead looked at the situation for what it was, a fighter from a weight class below his unwilling to fight him. So Ward, like an old school fighter, looked up a weight class and found an opponent harder and scarier than Golovkin. An opponent against which he will likely be a fight night underdog. But win or lose, Ward is risking it. He is trying to solidify his greatness. He is risking it because he understands that's what it takes to be great in this sport.

Golovkin is unwilling to risk it, he is unwilling to be great. He will stay and stagnate at 160 until Canelo either gives him a massive size advantage or Golovkin feels safe enough to ascend to 168 knowing Ward will never return.

Ward wants to be great. Golovkin wants to be rich. Mayweather wanted to be rich too, but I recall different standards for him on this forum.

[-PBP-]

Ward was in a similar position. He was out of options at 168, he either beat everyone (Froch, Abraham) or there were political roadblocks (PBC: DeGale, Jack). He could have remained at 168 fighting B- and C-level opposition waiting for Golovkin to either clean out 160 before moving up or hoping Golovkin would take the fight in the future before he cleaned out 160. That would have left Ward waiting at least 2 years for something that may never happen while his career continued to stagnate.

Ward instead looked at the situation for what it was, a fighter from a weight class below his unwilling to fight him. So Ward, like an old school fighter, looked up a weight class and found an opponent harder and scarier than Golovkin. An opponent against which he will likely be a fight night underdog. But win or lose, Ward is risking it. He is trying to solidify his greatness. He is risking it because he understands that's what it takes to be great in this sport.

Golovkin is unwilling to risk it, he is unwilling to be great. He will stay and stagnate at 160 until Canelo either gives him a massive size advantage or Golovkin feels safe enough to ascend to 168 knowing Ward will never return.

Ward wants to be great. Golovkin wants to be rich. Mayweather wanted to be rich too, but I recall different standards for him on this forum.

Well said. That's why I can't cosign the people that say Ward doesn't belong in this conversation. The only big fight he had left at 168 was Carl Froch who really never wanted the rematch. It was either fight pointless rematches against guys like Bika or Abraham or wait 2-3 years for Golovkin to move up.

Froch was in no hurry to capitalize on the rematch he earned in the ring because Ward is too good. Like Froch said "If I fight Ward, I will lose on points if I don't get the KO." He didn't want to avenge this loss like he avenged the Kessler loss because Ward is too good.

[jqSide]

That's the sad part. There are people in this world that are too fanatical they can't think straight.

Fight could not have happened yet because Ward only made the offer October of last year, to be specific. Ward wasn't even talking about fighting 3G ASAP. He needs undetermined amounts of tuneup fights first. He was hinting late this year. Don't know why they keep saying the fight could have happened when Ward never made any attempt to make the fight happen on numerous occassions last year and the previous one.

Kids will say the darnedest things doe.

To me the bottom line is the fight could have happened had Ward made a serious effort, not just blow up smoke. And I believe GG would have bitten the bullet and agreed to fight at 168.

Remember, this GG team openly states they want four fights a year. There were numerous times when they were desperate for fights. Ward was nowhere to be found! That's why Sanchez was so angry and called him a liar, can't make up his damn mind.

[Citizen Koba]

Ward was in a similar position. He was out of options at 168, he either beat everyone (Froch, Abraham) or there were political roadblocks (PBC: DeGale, Jack). He could have remained at 168 fighting B- and C-level opposition waiting for Golovkin to either clean out 160 before moving up or hoping Golovkin would take the fight in the future before he cleaned out 160. That would have left Ward waiting at least 2 years for something that may never happen while his career continued to stagnate.

Ward instead looked at the situation for what it was, a fighter from a weight class below his unwilling to fight him. So Ward, like an old school fighter, looked up a weight class and found an opponent harder and scarier than Golovkin. An opponent against which he will likely be a fight night underdog. But win or lose, Ward is risking it. He is trying to solidify his greatness. He is risking it because he understands that's what it takes to be great in this sport.

Golovkin is unwilling to risk it, he is unwilling to be great. He will stay and stagnate at 160 until Canelo either gives him a massive size advantage or Golovkin feels safe enough to ascend to 168 knowing Ward will never return.

Ward wants to be great. Golovkin wants to be rich. Mayweather wanted to be rich too, but I recall different standards for him on this forum.

Props to Ward for moving up and seeking to fight the biggest and badest guy in the division. Would he have chosen this option if he had a mandate to fight for the lineal title at 168 against the second biggest draw in the sport for a career high payday do you think?

FWIW I, personally would have much prefered to see GGG fight Ward - I am becoming a little jaded with him beating overmatched opponents - hell I'd be happy to see him fight Degale or Dre Dirrell, but I find it hard to fault him for holding out for the potential Canelo fight although I don't see it as being - outside of the scale of the event - that special a match up.

[Pigeons]

Well said. That's why I can't cosign the people that say Ward doesn't belong in this conversation. The only big fight he had left at 168 was Carl Froch who really never wanted the rematch. It was either fight pointless rematches against guys like Bika or Abraham or wait 2-3 years for Golovkin to move up.

Froch was in no hurry to capitalize on the rematch he earned in the ring because Ward is too good. Like Froch said "If I fight Ward, I will lose on points if I don't get the KO." He didn't want to avenge this loss like he avenged the Kessler loss because Ward is too good.

Froch wouldn't touch Ward with a 10-foot pole. Even though Ward was the champion and had beaten Froch before, he was still the one chasing that fight. He even agreed to go to the UK to make the fight, he just didn't want to do it in Froch's hometown of Nottingham. Froch refused. Ward would have done it in London or Manchester, but Froch had no interest. Froch didn't have the hunger to be great anymore. You had Ward, the lineal champ and the only unavenged loss on Froch's resume, ready and willing to travel to the UK for the fight, but even that wasn't enough for Froch. Froch was mentally defeated. There's no coming back from that.

[Irony123]

Froch wouldn't touch Ward with a 10-foot pole. Even though Ward was the champion and had beaten Froch before, he was still the one chasing that fight. He even agreed to go to the UK to make the fight, he just didn't want to do it in Froch's hometown of Nottingham. Froch refused. Ward would have done it in London or Manchester, but Froch had no interest. Froch didn't have the hunger to be great anymore. You had Ward, the lineal champ and the only unavenged loss on Froch's resume, ready and willing to travel to the UK for the fight, but even that wasn't enough for Froch. Froch was mentally defeated. There's no coming back from that.

Even though he agreed to fight Froch in England Froch had a point that he could sell out much bigger venue at his hometown thus making the fight more lucrative, it could have been all talk from Froch, if Ward would have called his bluff we would have known. Keep in mind that Ward had many fighters come and fight in his hometown of Oakland, why was it such a big deal to fight in Froch's home town?

Anyways fight didn't happen and Ward moved to bigger and better things (or at least definitely more challenging things like Kovalev)

[Pigeons]

Even though he agreed to fight Froch in England Froch had a point that he could sell out much bigger venue at his hometown thus making the fight more lucrative, it could have been all talk from Froch, if Ward would have called his bluff we would have known. Keep in mind that Ward had many fighters come and fight in his hometown of Oakland, why was it such a big deal to fight in Froch's home town?

Anyways fight didn't happen and Ward moved to bigger and better things (or at least definitely more challenging things like Kovalev)

If Ward was chasing say a Kessler rematch, I'd be fine with Kessler choosing the location in Denmark since Kessler fought Ward in Oakland, but Ward fought Froch in New Jersey, 3000 miles away from Oakland. They would have easily sold out O2. Froch just didn't want it.

[Irony123]

If Ward was chasing say a Kessler rematch, I'd be fine with Kessler choosing the location in Denmark since Kessler fought Ward in Oakland, but Ward fought Froch in New Jersey, 3000 miles away from Oakland. They would have easily sold out O2. Froch just didn't want it.

yeah probably right, not like its a fight i wanted to see anyways. Golovkin Ward or Ward Kovalev is where its at.

[BendOver]

That's a very good purse considering his weight class and it would bring him notoriety. 2 division world champion, 2 time gold medalist in less than 20 fights. Holy ****. Then you can really call him The Ring God Doe.

This is what I'm talking about. Missed opportunities:

Rigo - Passed on opportunity to move up as mentioned
GGG - Passed on opportunity to become 2 division world champion and #1 P4P fighter in the world.
Ward - Passed on opportunity to become lineal champion in 2 weight divisions simultaneously like Mayweather


Mayweather and Pacquiao capitalized on these opportunities and that's why they are in the position they're in. I feel like these fighters nowadays goal is to become an opponent/B-side to an already established super star rather than bully their own way into stardom.

you forgot to.mention that Rigondeaux is 35 years old and has grown all he could, actually he is fighting one weight class over, he could make 118 easy,

[original zero]

Did he take a step aside fee after Canelo became champion? i know they agreed on marinating the fight which is really BS and he should have just taken the belt but i am thinking in hopes of getting his biggest pay day he agreed to this ****** deal. i know he took a step aside for Cotto and Canelo to happen but in turn he unified another title which is reasonable... he couldn't fight for both at the same time anyway. dont recall if he took a step aside for Geal to fight Cotto however.

but canelo gained even more leverage by winning the WBC title. GGG could have prevented canelo from picking up that belt in the first place.

GGG brought this on himself.