Who's the better defensive fighter Floyd Mayweather Jr. or Pernell Whitaker?

[SalimShady1212]

Stop trying to rewrite history. People criticized Whitaker's style in the same way they do with Mayweather. You're full of sh it.

This is true, Pernell was very unappealing at times.

[!! Shawn]

I think you will find that is true.

There is no known footage of Charley Burley other than highlights from the Oakland Billy Smith fight. Which is no where near enough to gauge how good his defense is and especially not to rank him amongst the greats in that catergory.

So you're either lying or you have managed to get hold of something that doesn't exist.

Where did you get this footage of Burley? And what fights are they?

He is probably confusing it with the footage of Georgie Benton. Who besides being legendarily slick himself, also trained Pernell Whitaker.

[joseph5620]

The problem is that people are using longevity as a reason to make Floyd the greatest ever, but then there is the elephant in the room that is Bernard Hopkins...

If longevity is one of your criteria, then we should be talking about Bernard Hopkins being the best defensive fighter of all time, not Floyd. His resume after 40 is better than Floyd's after 30.

Hopkins is also remarkably slick, and has a much larger bag of tricks than Floyd has.

Floyd is frustrating because he is always going to be a questionmark like Roy. His career is the product of careful matchmaking, and we never saw him face the best when they were the best.

Roy we saw it a few times, but the rest was garbage, but what we saw was incredible.

Hopkins on the otherhand has a long legacy of fighting the best at their best and spoiling thier party, and he has done it through his 30's and into his late 40's.

No it isn't. Not even close either.

[!! Shawn]

No it isn't. Not even close either.

How many fights has Floyd entered as an underdog or with the odds even reasonably close?

Compare that with Bernard, he has entered fights 3-1+ underdog more than once, only to dominate.

Undefeated Calzaghe, Undefeated Pavlik, Wright, Pascal, Dawson, Kovalev, undefeated Cloud, Tarver off his KO of Jones.

Compare that to Ortiz, Maidana, Guerrero, Cotto that was beaten by pac then immediately lost to trout after, old man mosley after over a year layoff, Marquez at 147?

Its not really debatable, Hopkins has always stepped up and taken the challenging fights that looked like bad fights for him to take, and he won them dominantly for the most part, all the way up to 50 years old.

Not saying Floyd isn't great, but when you move the goalpoasts from who had the best defense, to oh but floyds defense was better for longer so his is the best. Then you have to include Hopkins, and Hopkins defense has been amazing since Floyd was basically in diapers. So if you want to move the goal posts, you move it into Nard territory, and FLoyd isn't going to win a longevity based arguement against Nard.

[IronDanHamza]

How many fights has Floyd entered as an underdog or with the odds even reasonably close?

Compare that with Bernard, he has entered fights 3-1+ underdog more than once, only to dominate.

Undefeated Calzaghe, Undefeated Pavlik, Wright, Pascal, Dawson, Kovalev, undefeated Cloud, Tarver off his KO of Jones.

Compare that to Ortiz, Maidana, Guerrero, Cotto that was beaten by pac then immediately lost to trout after, old man mosley after over a year layoff, Marquez at 147?

Its not really debatable, Hopkins has always stepped up and taken the challenging fights that looked like bad fights for him to take, and he won them dominantly for the most part, all the way up to 50 years old.

Not saying Floyd isn't great, but when you move the goalpoasts from who had the best defense, to oh but floyds defense was better for longer so his is the best. Then you have to include Hopkins, and Hopkins defense has been amazing since Floyd was basically in diapers. So if you want to move the goal posts, you move it into Nard territory, and FLoyd isn't going to win a longevity based arguement against Nard.

You say "Marquez at 147" why don't you highlight that Pavlik and Wright were at 170?

He lost to Calzaghe, Dawson and Kovalev.

So that leaves Tarver, Tavouris Cloud and Pascal.

I'll go with Mayweather.

And Mayweather can argue longevity. Hopkins is older but age is a number. How long since Hopkins was first champion? 21 years to Floyd's 19.

Hopkins was considered green at age 28 and didn't win his first title until age 29 whereas Floyd won his first title at age 21.

Hopkins hit his prime at age 35. Floyd was passed it at 35.

Floyd's consistency however is much better.

[dan_cov]

Probably Floyd I mean your defense has to be seriously good if people have to post slow motion gifs proving you can be hit.

Seems to be just the same 2-3 gifs too.
Like is that it? In 48 fights you can only make 2-3 gifs of him being hit with a good clean shot?

[-PBP-]

If anyone who voted 'don't know/equal' is reading this....

Would you have picked one or the other if that option wasn't there or just not voted?

I haven't voted because there is no right answer and that's why it's deadlocked 50/50.

You can say Floyd got hit less but can counter that with Whitaker was in the pocket longer and was a more offensive minded fighter. It's a matter of preference.

[joseph5620]

How many fights has Floyd entered as an underdog or with the odds even reasonably close?

Compare that with Bernard, he has entered fights 3-1+ underdog more than once, only to dominate.

Undefeated Calzaghe, Undefeated Pavlik, Wright, Pascal, Dawson, Kovalev, undefeated Cloud, Tarver off his KO of Jones.

Compare that to Ortiz, Maidana, Guerrero, Cotto that was beaten by pac then immediately lost to trout after, old man mosley after over a year layoff, Marquez at 147?

Its not really debatable, Hopkins has always stepped up and taken the challenging fights that looked like bad fights for him to take, and he won them dominantly for the most part, all the way up to 50 years old.

Not saying Floyd isn't great, but when you move the goalpoasts from who had the best defense, to oh but floyds defense was better for longer so his is the best. Then you have to include Hopkins, and Hopkins defense has been amazing since Floyd was basically in diapers. So if you want to move the goal posts, you move it into Nard territory, and FLoyd isn't going to win a longevity based arguement against Nard.

Funny how you left out Canelo, Pacquiao,, and Hatton. Dismiss Mosley but praise Pascal? Yeah, okay. You also left out the fact that Hopkins lost two fights to Jermaine Taylor. Mayweather beat every one of his opponents. It's not close. At all.

[Doctor_Tenma]

How many fights has Floyd entered as an underdog or with the odds even reasonably close?

Compare that with Bernard, he has entered fights 3-1+ underdog more than once, only to dominate.

Undefeated Calzaghe, Undefeated Pavlik, Wright, Pascal, Dawson, Kovalev, undefeated Cloud, Tarver off his KO of Jones.

Compare that to Ortiz, Maidana, Guerrero, Cotto that was beaten by pac then immediately lost to trout after, old man mosley after over a year layoff, Marquez at 147?

Its not really debatable, Hopkins has always stepped up and taken the challenging fights that looked like bad fights for him to take, and he won them dominantly for the most part, all the way up to 50 years old.

Not saying Floyd isn't great, but when you move the goalpoasts from who had the best defense, to oh but floyds defense was better for longer so his is the best. Then you have to include Hopkins, and Hopkins defense has been amazing since Floyd was basically in diapers. So if you want to move the goal posts, you move it into Nard territory, and FLoyd isn't going to win a longevity based arguement against Nard.

Hopkins is great defensively but he's never effortlessly made opponents miss the way Mayweather and Whitaker have. The underdog stuff is irrelevant, if Mayweather slowed considerably more than where he is now, I'm talking years from now, he too would find himself an underdog for sure.

[soul_survivor]

Who was better at making their opponent swing @ air Floyd Mayweather Jr or Pernell Whitaker?

Defence is more than just making guys miss, it's about wrong footing the guy, blocking punches and dissuading him from throwing.

In that regard mayweather is better but whitaker had the superior counter punching ability and offense.