who is the number 1 super middleweight in the word-FROCH OR WARD

[Levity]

It doesn't matter. It's a myth in boxing that you're automatically worse if you fight someone a year or two later.

I've asked Kessler myself, and he said he felt 5 times the fighter against Froch in 2010 than he did against Ward in 2009. There were a lot of things that went wrong for Kessler in the build up to the fight.

You mean the Allan Green who almost swallowed his tongue after Kessler rendered him completely unconscious with one left hook?

Kessler didn't just fight Froch a year or two later, he fought him over 3 years later following serious injuries that didn't plague him against Ward or Froch in the first fight. He withdrew from the tournament based on those injuries, meaning they were likely having a negative impact on his health and performances.

He returned and beat lower-tier opponents like Bouadla and Magee, but he was hurt and dropped by Green when he hadn't been put down by such an opponent at any previous time in his career. Sure, he won by KO shortly after, but he had problems that he hadn't faced even against several opponents better than Green, which I think it evidence of him being past his best. He also hasn't fought since the Froch bout, which you would expect him to if he weren't past his best.

As for what Kessler told you, I'd take it with a grain of salt. Fighters typically have excuses for poor performances as a way of rationalizing them and avoiding the possibility that they simply aren't as good as those they lost to. By doing that it allows them to say 'oh ya, I was just off for this fight, but look what happens when I'm not off. I'll be in my regular form if I face X again so this time I'll win."

Facts are that Ward dominated Kessler just before Kessler beat Froch, and he convincingly beat Froch when they actually fought, not when they simply argued about who was better or who the bigger draw was. These aren't the be all end all of how I determine rankings, but they are a large part.

[Dirk Diggler UK]

It doesn't matter. It's a myth in boxing that you're automatically worse if you fight someone a year or two later.

I've asked Kessler myself, and he said he felt 5 times the fighter against Froch in 2010 than he did against Ward in 2009. There were a lot of things that went wrong for Kessler in the build up to the fight.

You mean the Allan Green who almost swallowed his tongue after Kessler rendered him completely unconscious with one left hook?

He said he felt 5 times the fighter in a fight he won than a fight he got he ass kicked in?

Who would have thought it?

[slimshandy69]

now ive schoold dirk and won the debate overall im off to bed. Hopefully you guys will come back better from this defeat like froch did in 2011 and become the number 1....

[Levity]

now ive schoold dirk and won the debate overall im off to bed. Hopefully you guys will come back better from this defeat like froch did in 2011 and become the number 1....

Cong**** bro. Winning on the internet is great, huh?

[RowdyMind]

Considering the fact that Ward already beat Froch with basically one hand, I'd have to go with Ward

[djtmal]

Froch who is Ward

[billeau2]

ward headbutted kessler to death, tis a horrible fight to watch and i feel for kessler who should have been awared the win or a no contest at minimum for that shocking refereeing.

Sergey Kovalev would obliterate froch, ill admit that, but FROCH IS RANKED HIGHER AT SUPER MIDDLE WEIGHT. the is fact. Doesnt mean kovalev is less of a fighter, it just means hes been doing his thing at his weigt class.

As for rodriguez, it was his biggest fight of his career and he weight a massive 2 pounds over. Im sorry that makes the fight irrlevant at 168. I am on about rankings at 168, not head to head, not triangle theories, not whether froch could beat dawson. but 168.

The fact are froch has beaten since his close decision lss IN AMERICA(Wards never left oakland barely) to andre ward, far better ranked and high activity than ward. Therefore he should be ranked above ward.

they are the facts...2011 was 2011, demand and suplly froch is schooling ward for money as well

You should really read your posts out to see how ridiculously biased you are....I should add that some biases have a basis in fact, yours are purely of the sour g****s variety. We have Andre Ward a head butting, provincial lad who would never leave Oakland, who beat up a shell of an Andre Dawson against the King Arthur, the enchanted Karl Froch, who beat a really good version of Kessler and who has fought such glorious competition and will gtravel to boot!

GET THE FVX OUT OF HERE WITH THIS BS!!! Sorry Ward is so much better than Froch and I know that hurts, but swallow you must!! Dawson was an elite fighter who was outclassed by Ward, set up and exploited and taken to school. Ward easily beat Froch who even the judges could not save. And the version of Kessler? WHO cares!!? Kessler is very good, hardly an elite fighter. for that matter? neither is Froch who is simply not in Ward's class. And leaving Oakland has nothing to do with skills, got it?

Ohh and Froch has beat some good fighters and had a chance at the elite level where he was outclassed by.....You guessed it Ward. Ward has easily cleaned out the division and went up and beat an elite figher

[Pigeons]

Don't worry Froch fans, you will get your moment in the sun. Ward won't fight in 2014. Once Jan. 1, 2015 hits and there is still no end in sight for Ward's promotional problems, then you can start excluding him from the SMW rankings due to inactivity.

[LacedUp]

Kessler didn't just fight Froch a year or two later, he fought him over 3 years later following serious injuries that didn't plague him against Ward or Froch in the first fight. He withdrew from the tournament based on those injuries, meaning they were likely having a negative impact on his health and performances.

He returned and beat lower-tier opponents like Bouadla and Magee, but he was hurt and dropped by Green when he hadn't been put down by such an opponent at any previous time in his career. Sure, he won by KO shortly after, but he had problems that he hadn't faced even against several opponents better than Green, which I think it evidence of him being past his best. He also hasn't fought since the Froch bout, which you would expect him to if he weren't past his best.

As for what Kessler told you, I'd take it with a grain of salt. Fighters typically have excuses for poor performances as a way of rationalizing them and avoiding the possibility that they simply aren't as good as those they lost to. By doing that it allows them to say 'oh ya, I was just off for this fight, but look what happens when I'm not off. I'll be in my regular form if I face X again so this time I'll win."

Facts are that Ward dominated Kessler just before Kessler beat Froch, and he convincingly beat Froch when they actually fought, not when they simply argued about who was better or who the bigger draw was. These aren't the be all end all of how I determine rankings, but they are a large part.

Except that's not true. Kessler had injuries dating back to before the Calzaghe fight. Those injuries you are talking about, was an eye-injury - that coincidentally happened vs Ward and was in fact bothering him against Froch in their first fight too, with a lot of unhealed scar tissue - so that's not true either.

It came from 4-5 "accidental" headbutts that made Kessler's face look like this:



Mind you, none of these were caused by punches.

Kessler had double vision for that fight.

He also had a conflict with his former trainer Richard Olsen, whom let go after the Ward fight because nothing was right in the build up.

Then there was the almost full hour delay, the headbutts, the clinching etc. A lot of other things that you obviously don't know about or choose to dismiss.
I wouldn't exactly say Kessler beat Froch convincingly, but he did beat him.

He said he felt 5 times the fighter in a fight he won than a fight he got he ass kicked in?

Who would have thought it?

Everyone who knows Kessler, knows he'd tell the truth instantly. He's by far the most honest guy i've ever met in boxing. By far.

[-PBP-]

Last. Poor Froch fans. Unfortunately rankings are determined in the ring. Not from making more money, having a hot wife and filling up arenas. Maybe boxing can one day be more like WWE. One can only hope.