Fantasy: Would a Welter Andre Ward do well VS Floyd?

[Los Zetas]

I am going out Murkaman. Of course I can have a normal debate but since you accuse me of talking about small first, I need you to admit that I didn't. You say I might be a troll but maybe you trolled me?

Anyway I'll be back. It's a good debate.

[intoccabile]

I think Andres dirty rough house tactincs in the clinch favors him big in that matchup. It would also make Floyds elbow more noticeable as he'd be forced to use it more often, which could see points being deducted as well.

I like wards chances on style alone.

[MurkaMan]

Can you please quote me next time. Some long ass post now.

Anyway let me read up and reply to a paragraph and then read again.

Anyone who beats anyone shows how to beat someone. Anyone who wins rounds consistently of near 6 shows how to beat someone. To say Floyd showed Manny is fine, but you didn't state the others that beat Mosely which deserve mentions. Since you were called out on that point was when you mentioned size. Give up on that argument my friend, you lost it to a point you didn't even know you were the first to talk about size.

Mosely was shot to me, he was no where near his best at all. He was a shell of himself who couldn't pull the trigger. Any fighter who has to open his mouth by round 4 aint serious. Roy Jones just won, does that mean he is not shot? A Shane that was not shot was an athletic powerful beast. The one who showed up for Mayorga was not.

I would say Shane was placed as an underdog by fans yes. For myself I give a boxer 70 % chance to beat a brawler. If the boxer loses, in a rematch I still give them a 60% chance to win if they work on mistakes.

I am not always right but I am intuitive. For example I predicted and made a thread on Shawn Porter beating Alexander. If I know (Seen a lot of fights, watched sparring etc...) and see enough of a boxer my judgement tends to be pretty good. I didn't think Marg could beat Mosely.

If you don't think someone winning a fight, even close laid out anything then you need to think about that. If a man outjabs you and it is working for say 5 rounds, and stops jabbing and loses the next 7, even then you laid out a blueprint in that lost. It's funny how you got to say dominated etc... now. Who is the one talking about tangents?

Mosely landed more than twice, but perhaps wobbled Floyd 2 times yes. However he literally was breathing from his mouth quite early on in the fight considering. He was gassed and as stated couldn't pull the trigger. A 1 year and 3 month lay off don't help a man his age.

OK the point on Ortiz, Canelo etc... Floyd has a set foundation that he always has no matter what. Fine tuning him like a race car is what Snr did. He looked impressive VS Canelo and Guerrerro more than Cotto. At the top level all it takes when you're as good as Floyd is adding some adjustments. Ortiz fight was a lot faster than the Canelo fight. Ortiz ran into shots hard and it ended in 4 rounds. I just didn't see how that is even the same as Canelo or JMM who didn't even come close to winning a round, while Ortiz wasn't far off since it was erratic. PS. You don't need to do anything to make Ortiz look dumb. He said he wanted to fight Floyd when he was 9 years old. Floyd wasn't even that known at that time. Plus he said he's a tree... and the Maidana fight showed us what was up with his brain. I'm too young to get beat up LOL.

For Cotto you probably saw Omar Henry spar Floyd on U stream right? Well Floyd did get hit by jabs and particularly the left hand, and more so on the ropes. I made a thread on my banned account on this. I know sparring is sparring but it landed more than I would have expected.

Well guess what, Cotto did the same. He didn't win but he landed flush, more than we are use to. Snr believe in a jab and always said he is better the Roger as a trainer. Not that Floyd never had a jab, but Snr emphasised on that, and more movement. IMO Floyd has looked great recently that he may even beat someone like Sturm for a MW title. (I am pushing it but would be good to end his 6 fight deal with a MW title)


I aint seen what Brother Naz saw. For all we know Ward was killing his sparring partners. If that is the case then yeah he has hidden KO power. Ward has respectable power like Floyd. His has a low KO ratio but Ward does hurt people. What we have to say is, Ward has faced guys who never been knocked out. I know Froch, Kessler, Abraham haven't been knocked out. I think Bika was never knocked out. Dawson was never knocked out when he faced him. So Ward is facing top guys and as you know, it's hard to KO top guys. They are there for a reason.

This is a video from my memory on Naz talking about Ward. He said on the lines of: he saw one dude get cracked in sparring, why don't you do that in the ring? If he decides to crack someone he can.

Ward said he don't have to.

What's so special about what he said? You see people get dropped in sparring all the time and you can get impressed with it.




Why you using an old stat for Floyd to argue with me but use a recent one for Ward in the plus minus debate? Come on man, numbers don't lie as they say. I don't mind you using an old stat but I feel you did it on purpose for your argument. Floyd is accurate and has a great defence, we know this. You can't talk bad about that at all. Ward has a good one too, but still 10% off, not the 15% off as your numbers would have told.

I had to delete the long quote, too long it said.

I was about to say the same thing about your long azz post. Your post are just tangents that make the debate about nothing. If we stayed on topic, we wouldnt say as much.

Yes Floyd did show Manny. The others who beat Mosley really dont deserve mention because they all had close fights with him. Floyd gave the blueprint on how to beat him which is my opinion. And you condescendingly say "You lost that argument my friend" GTFO LOL. If you feel I lost this or lost that, that is your opinion and its okay for you to feel however you feel.

And no matter how much you copiously repeat; "Mosley was shot, Mosley was shot, Mosley was shot" doesnt make it true. That just makes it YOUR OPINION which I thought we agreed to disagree to a long time ago. And you went into a tangent talking about Roy Jones beating up on some bum. Mosley beat a guy he was expected to get destroyed by.
So when your wrong, you will profusely repeat that your right?

And your going into a tangent about boxer, brawler, all this crap about Shane Vs Margarita. This is a conversation not worth having and its making your posts longer. Regardless of what you thought, he was an underdog and DOMINATED a guy he was supposed to get destroyed by.

You made a comment about how your not always right. For some reason I think your saying that because I made a comment about how you pretend to get confused, then go into a tangent. Its really no excuse for that. We can simplify everything and make it more easier.

You made a point about Mosley breathing out of his mouth. Which is true. But what isnt true, is that he gassed out. He didnt gas, he just breathed out of his mouth and looked tired. He actually tried to win the entire fight and never really got tired. But Floyd made him gun shy like all the rest. But I dont want to get into a new debate about Mosley's breathing.

You made a long comment again, about Ortiz and how the fight ended. Its just a tangent to avoid admitting that Floyd landed the most shots on Ortiz, and avoided all of Ortiz's shots, same way he did the other opponents. But a while back you admitted that Floyd did beat them all easily. And at that time, you made a comment about how you were smart because you can point out the tactical differences in each fight, which really had nothing to do with what I was saying. As long as you admitted that he made them all look clumsey and dumb, its really no need in discussing this portion as well. Its just going to make us debate further about nothing.

Onto a topic that somehow got brought up

Im about to make a comment that I hope wont drag into another debate. But Sr didnt finely tune Floyd. He just reminded Floyd to not overtrain because he was 36 and not 26. Floyd was overtrained for Cotto. Sr changed that the first day of training for the Ghost. He told Floyd he was doing too much, and thats the only reason he improved. Nothing tactical about it at all.

As far as this long paragraph about ****im I already said in MY opinion, when I pointed out that he was exagerrating, you basically agreed with me. Now you wont say you agree with me, but you will ramble a good while to avoid admitting you do. Thats just MY opinion. Agree to disagree on that as well. As far as what we do agree on, we both agree that Ward has shown the best he will show.

I didnt have to use an old stat on purpose. I actually used Ward's old stat as well. If Im not mistaken, when that article was written they also mentioned that SRL had a number of 15 as well. I got all of my info from that article. I dont even know what Ward's current number is. But I also dont believe that you actually think I posted it on purpose. I called you out on a few things, and maybe you accusing me of doing that intentionally is your way of getting something out of this. In my opinion I dont believe that you actually feel that way. Agree to disagree on that as well.

And when I first mentioned the numbers you ignored them. That made me feel that you had changed your mind about who would win. But you didnt want to admit that so you took us into tangents. A while back I made a comment that Floyd would walk him down. In that comment I gave allot of reasons why. After that comment you seemed as if you had then changed your mind and agreed with me. You made a comment basically saying if anything, he would outbox him, but not walk him down. At that moment, I had felt that you had began to feel indifferent. But you never came out and flat out said it. At least I dont think you have.

[MurkaMan]

Look at the damn pics. Cotto is shorter (Pic clearly) and has shorter arms. Boxrec isn't always right but they are right on these two guys.

Look at the pic. Who is taller?

Cotto is immensely strong in wrestling. He made Floyd go where he wanted physically. He is stronger than Shane in wrestling it seems. Shane can do weights though, but that isn't always transferred to wrestling, boxing power etc...

I looked at the pics but to me, Im just seeing it differently. I been said we can agree to disagree. To me Cotto is bigger and stronger than Mosley. Floyd walked Shane down, but Cotto although short, looked way bigger to me. Shane just has a wide back and upperbody but he's really a little guy.

[MurkaMan]

I am going out Murkaman. Of course I can have a normal debate but since you accuse me of talking about small first, I need you to admit that I didn't. You say I might be a troll but maybe you trolled me?

Anyway I'll be back. It's a good debate.

I dont have to troll. Its easy to say whether Ward would beat Floyd or not. But you are going out of your way to avoid admitting it arent you?

[DARKSEID]

Nobody beats Andre Ward easy. It just doesn't happen.

He's going to approach the fight from multiple angles and have and have multiple backup plans for whatever floyd might do.

He's going to come into the fight in peak physical form and mental preparedness.

The fight would come down to whoever thinks and reacts faster, and adjusts better.

I think a Prime Floyd would beat Ward due to his athleticism alone but Floyd as he is right now, Ward might beat him.

[MurkaMan]

Nobody beats Andre Ward easy. It just doesn't happen.

He's going to approach the fight from multiple angles and have and have multiple backup plans for whatever floyd might do.

He's going to come into the fight in peak physical form and mental preparedness.

The fight would come down to whoever thinks and reacts faster, and adjusts better.

I think a Prime Floyd would beat Ward due to his athleticism alone but Floyd as he is right now, Ward might beat him.

You say it just doesnt happen almost as if he has been doing it for as long as Floyd. Look at the stats and athletically difference between these two fighter's boy Ward is tailor made. You know Ward's plus minus was 15, and Floyd's is 30. Floyd is twice as accurate and twice as defensively skilled and way faster, complete, better, and more of a natural fighter. He gonna try to outbox Floyd or bully him. It would look like Bhop vs a version of Roy Jones who is on steroids and pumped with endless precious boxing secrets lol.

[Los Zetas]

I dont have to troll. Its easy to say whether Ward would beat Floyd or not. But you are going out of your way to avoid admitting it arent you?

I'm out now. On my phone. I'll reply back later.

I never said ward would beat Floy, iI feel he has the athletic ability and style / skill to do well.

I don't see Khan or guys who set to punch like Canelo doing well. Ward is not flat footed and can throw e shots quick hence lack of ko

[Los Zetas]

I looked at the pics but to me, Im just seeing it differently. I been said we can agree to disagree. To me Cotto is bigger and stronger than Mosley. Floyd walked Shane down, but Cotto although short, looked way bigger to me. Shane just has a wide back and upperbody but he's really a little guy.

Still out but I can reply to Smaller posts
Ok well to me Shane looks bigger.
And Borec says shane is too

[Los Zetas]

You say it just doesnt happen almost as if he has been doing it for as long as Floyd. Look at the stats and athletically difference between these two fighter's boy Ward is tailor made. You know Ward's plus minus was 15, and Floyd's is 30. Floyd is twice as accurate and twice as defensively skilled and way faster, complete, better, and more of a natural fighter. He gonna try to outbox Floyd or bully him. It would look like Bhop vs a version of Roy Jones who is on steroids and pumped with endless precious boxing secrets lol.

Floyd is not twice as accurate. Ward is at 38 connects and Floyd 42 from the compubox pic

Floyd is no. 30 iit's 24 while ward 14.7

Floyd has the better defence which is why his plus minus is so good

His opponents connect is 18 per cent and wards 24



The percentage are high but if you look at the shots landed in each round, it's very close. Floyd lands 17 a round and ward 18

Boxing isn't judged on what misses but what lands. Well the emphasis is a punch landing anywaywhich wins you rounds.