Leonard and Duran speak on Mayweather

[The Gambler1981]

these match ups are nowhere near as cut and dry as people on either side of these arguments want to believe.

That is all that needs to get said, all those guys are great fighters so one losing to the other is no great shame and they would all be interesting contests in their own ways.

There are no clear cut answers and ever if you feel one guy would win it certainly would not be easy work.

[bray26]

[QUOTE=AntonTheMeh;13358963]floyd's never fought a 15 rounder in his career, but he'd beat a guy in a 15 round fight who has? i can't see anyway that he beats hearns.

last i recall duran and leonard fought more than that one time he quit. by that same token anyone could be of the opinion that cotto gave floyd his toughest fight since forever so duran would have busted his ass cause he was so much better at everything that cotto does best.

i don't think he would have lasted against hagler in a 15 rounder.

i say this as a person who believes that floyd is the most talented boxer that ever walked the face of the earth, but he's a guy that started at super featherweight; at some point not only does the weight catch up to you, but the gap in ability closes when you start talking about atg's like leonard hearns and duran.

I'm one of those that thinks the Cotto fight shows just good Floyd truly is, he fought a great fight and clearly won but it was not a wipe out! And that's because of the class of Cotto and that's a Cotto that has seen better days! At his best Floyd Is a great fighter but he loses to the greats in this conversation! If Cotto busted him up, these guys take him out!

[Barn]

Floyd's D and conditioning would have given him the nod against Leonard

Yeah, because Leonard had terrible conditioning. It wasn't like he fought 15 round fights against ATG's or anything. He also was a complete mess against defensive fighters like Benitez and could barely land on him.

In all seriousness Leonard had a masterful jab and exquisite timing. Fighters like Cotto had some success with the jab against Floyd and Leonard's jab is a much bigger, faster, smarter and better version than Cotto's. I'll tell you for free that Floyd's defence alone wouldn't win him the fight.

Hearns vs. Floyd would have been interesting until Floyd started timing him and potshotting him and taking him to the late rounds and started toying with him due to conditioning. Hearns might have stood a chance with Mayweather in a 12 rd fight, but not 15 rds.

So Floyd would "potshot" Hearns who has a huge reach and height advantage? Potshot as in hit in range and then get out of there? That might be the worst tactic ever against Hearns who would jab him to death on the outside and then smash him as he moved inside with Floyd barely being able to get to him. The way to beat Hearns is with sustained hard-punching pressure, you can't outbox him. Leonard nearly learned that the hard way.

Not to mention, Hearns' stamina is more proven that Floyd's so that statement really has no validity. Considering Floyd is rarely in competitive 12 round fights where he has to work hard. Hearns only faded in the 14 round after being pummeled by hard body and head shots from Leonard and still never went properly down.

The notion of "toying with Hearns" is flat out ******.

Mayweather would have outskilled Hagler also.

At Middleweight? Don't be ridiculous.

[The Comic DON]

Yeah, because Leonard had terrible conditioning. It wasn't like he fought 15 round fights against ATG's or anything. He also was a complete mess against defensive fighters like Benitez and could barely land on him.

In all seriousness Leonard had a masterful jab and exquisite timing. Fighters like Cotto had some success with the jab against Floyd and Leonard's jab is a much bigger, faster, smarter and better version than Cotto's. I'll tell you for free that Floyd's defence alone wouldn't win him the fight.



So Floyd would "potshot" Hearns who has a huge reach and height advantage? Potshot as in hit in range and then get out of there? That might be the worst tactic ever against Hearns who would jab him to death on the outside and then smash him as he moved inside with Floyd barely being able to get to him. The way to beat Hearns is with sustained hard-punching pressure, you can't outbox him. Leonard nearly learned that the hard way.

Not to mention, Hearns' stamina is more proven that Floyd's so that statement really has no validity. Considering Floyd is rarely in competitive 12 round fights where he has to work hard. Hearns only faded in the 14 round after being pummeled by hard body and head shots from Leonard and still never went properly down.

The notion of "toying with Hearns" is flat out ******.


At Middleweight? Don't be ridiculous.

I co-sign this. Do people on this board really believe Floyd could just potshot Leonard, Duran, Haglar, and Hearns for 12 straight rounds?

I have an had time believing he can do that to any true elite fighters and that's why he chose to stay far, far, far away from them.

[SkillspayBills]

I co-sign this. Do people on this board really believe Floyd could just potshot Leonard, Duran, Haglar, and Hearns for 12 straight rounds?

I have an had time believing he can do that to any true elite fighters and that's why he chose to stay far, far, far away from them.

PLEAS PLEASE PLEASE name these "true elite fighters" he chose to stay away from?


I'll wait...

[jimboinbigd]

Yeah, because Leonard had terrible conditioning. It wasn't like he fought 15 round fights against ATG's or anything. He also was a complete mess against defensive fighters like Benitez and could barely land on him.

In all seriousness Leonard had a masterful jab and exquisite timing. Fighters like Cotto had some success with the jab against Floyd and Leonard's jab is a much bigger, faster, smarter and better version than Cotto's. I'll tell you for free that Floyd's defence alone wouldn't win him the fight.



So Floyd would "potshot" Hearns who has a huge reach and height advantage? Potshot as in hit in range and then get out of there? That might be the worst tactic ever against Hearns who would jab him to death on the outside and then smash him as he moved inside with Floyd barely being able to get to him. The way to beat Hearns is with sustained hard-punching pressure, you can't outbox him. Leonard nearly learned that the hard way.

Not to mention, Hearns' stamina is more proven that Floyd's so that statement really has no validity. Considering Floyd is rarely in competitive 12 round fights where he has to work hard. Hearns only faded in the 14 round after being pummeled by hard body and head shots from Leonard and still never went properly down.

The notion of "toying with Hearns" is flat out ******.


At Middleweight? Don't be ridiculous.

Yeah, because Leonard had terrible conditioning. It wasn't like he fought 15 round fights against ATG's or anything. He also was a complete mess against defensive fighters like Benitez and could barely land on him.


I didn't say Leonard had terrible conditioning. But it can be argued that no fighter in the history of the sport consistently enters the ring better conditioned than Floyd. Advantage Floyd.

In all seriousness Leonard had a masterful jab and exquisite timing.

SRL is one of my top 3 favorite Boxers of ALL TIME. Him, Tyson, and Floyd. I grew up a fan of his, but I'm telling you, he wasn't nearly as dominant in as many areas as Floyd has been. SRL has the bigger fights and bigger moments on his resume, and the showmanship, and big flurries and combinations, but Floyd has everything else...by far.

Fighters like Cotto had some success with the jab against Floyd and Leonard's jab is a much bigger, faster, smarter and better version than Cotto's. I'll tell you for free that Floyd's defence alone wouldn't win him the fight.

Floyd was not as sharp in the Cotto fight, and he got popped a few times. Big deal. Floyd was never hurt or in trouble during that fight. And this is exactly the kind of thing I'm talking about. Even in a comfortable victory for Mayweather, people get excited about that fight, because Mayweather actually took a little punishment. SRL took punishment and got hit on a regular basis but nobody remembers that.



So Floyd would "potshot" Hearns who has a huge reach and height advantage?

Go and watch the Floyd and Diego Corralles fight then come back here and tell me Mayweather can't potshot taller and longer reaching opponents.


Potshot as in hit in range and then get out of there? That might be the worst tactic ever against Hearns who would jab him to death on the outside and then smash him as he moved inside with Floyd barely being able to get to him. The way to beat Hearns is with sustained hard-punching pressure, you can't outbox him. Leonard nearly learned that the hard way.


In my opinion, Floyd's Defense and athleticism would have allowed him to survive Hearns early, then outbox him later for the victory. Especially in a 15 rd fight. Floyd could go 20 rds, dude. Perhaps the greatest conditioned athlete in the sport. And I'm not just talking cardio and endurance. The kid has done it all and dominated every style he's ever faced. He would have been too smart to go toe to toe with Hearns, and with that, Floyd would have had every advantage after that, imo.

Not to mention, Hearns' stamina is more proven that Floyd's so that statement really has no validity.

I disagree. I've only seen Floyd get stronger in fights while I recall Hearns clearly gassing out against Leonard in their first fight. Where is your proof he was better conditioned than Floyd?

Considering Floyd is rarely in competitive 12 round fights where he has to work hard. Hearns only faded in the 14 round after being pummeled by hard body and head shots from Leonard and still never went properly down.

Hearns and Leonard were both fading in that fight, but Leonard had a few flurries remaining and took advantage of Hearns' dead legs. And don't kid yourself, Hearns was getting beat up and would have fallen had the fight not been stopped. Mayweather is go good, he's never come close to a situation like that. This is part of the problem. Because Floyd has yet to be seriously tested, people don't give him his proper respect.




At Middleweight? Don't be ridiculous. :lol1

At Middleweight maybe not, but I won't rule it out, and at 154, Floyd beats him in a UD.

[megas30]

Floyd would have never stepped up to welter if he was in the early 80's with duran leonard and hearns

Also he would have never in the late 90's with tito oscar and ike

If he had he would not be undefeated like he is today

you don't get, he would have to. The Floyd you are seeing now is not hungry, his belly is full, so he doesn't need or want to take on additional risk. However, back then would have been different, for the spotlight would have been on Leonard, Hearns, Duran, Hagler and those guys. Knowing how arrogant Floyd is, he wouldn't be content with this, so he would push to fight them.

Look at Floyds career, anytime he feels someone is getting more attention than he is, he used to always push to fight them. Contrary to all the noobs hatred on this site, Floyd at the lower weight, minus the spotlight, was calling out everyone from 130-147. There is a video to prove this. Even his stable mate, Cotto, whom he felt was getting bigger and more attention, he started to call out and Arum said no, so i have no doubts if he sees Leonard and those guys as the money fights, and he's unrecognized, he would have wanted to fight them.

[Barn]

I didn't say Leonard had terrible conditioning. But it can be argued that no fighter in the history of the sport consistently enters the ring better conditioned than Floyd. Advantage Floyd.

How can it be advantage Floyd when Leonard fought tougher, longer fights against better fighters?

SRL is one of my top 3 favorite Boxers of ALL TIME. Him, Tyson, and Floyd. I grew up a fan of his, but I'm telling you, he wasn't nearly as dominant in as many areas as Floyd has been. SRL has the bigger fights and bigger moments on his resume, and the showmanship, and big flurries and combinations, but Floyd has everything else...by far.

SRL fought much better fighters at WW. Maybe he didn't look as dominant in as many areas because he was fighting Duran, Hearns and Benitez. All of these fighters are a leagues better than anyone Floyd has faced at WW.

Floyd was not as sharp in the Cotto fight, and he got popped a few times. Big deal. Floyd was never hurt or in trouble during that fight. And this is exactly the kind of thing I'm talking about. Even in a comfortable victory for Mayweather, people get excited about that fight, because Mayweather actually took a little punishment. SRL took punishment and got hit on a regular basis but nobody remembers that.

I'm not getting excited. I scored it 9-3 for Floyd I'm just pointing out there is success to be hard there. Why was he "not as sharp" either Cotto is just good enough to cause problems and therefore Leonard would be or Mayweather isn't "the most consistently conditioned fighter ever? Which one is it?

Go and watch the Floyd and Diego Corralles fight then come back here and tell me Mayweather can't potshot taller and longer reaching opponents.

Diego Corralles isn't on the level of Hearns, that fight was at SFW not WW and Corrales only had a 70 inch reach (to Floyd's 72, so he wasn't longer reaching), Hearns had a 78 inch reach. There isn't a comparison there.

In my opinion, Floyd's Defense and athleticism would have allowed him to survive Hearns early, then outbox him later for the victory.

As I've said, the bigger, more powerful, just as fast and almost equally smart Ray Leonard couldn't outbox Hearns so what makes you think Floyd could?

Especially in a 15 rd fight. Floyd could go 20 rds, dude. Perhaps the greatest conditioned athlete in the sport. And I'm not just talking cardio and endurance. The kid has done it all and dominated every style he's ever faced. He would have been too smart to go toe to toe with Hearns, and with that, Floyd would have had every advantage after that, imo.

That implies Hearns would have to go toe-to-toe to win. Hearns is a master boxer and had perfected his style of long range boxing. He wouldn't need to go toe-to-toe.

I disagree. I've only seen Floyd get stronger in fights while I recall Hearns clearly gassing out against Leonard in their first fight. Where is your proof he was better conditioned than Floyd?

Where's your proof that Floyd was better conditioned. I never said Hearns was better conditioned just that he has more proven stamina by going 14 rounds in tough, close fights against ATG's. Floyd at WW has went 12 easy rounds with over-matched opponents.

Hearns and Leonard were both fading in that fight, but Leonard had a few flurries remaining and took advantage of Hearns' dead legs.

Leonard wasn't fading, he turned it up in the 13th. Just before that Hearns was doing well. It was a 4 part tale. Hearns doing well early, Leonard in the middle, Hearns at the beginning of the latter half and then Leonard getting the stoppage.

And don't kid yourself, Hearns was getting beat up and would have fallen had the fight not been stopped

I agree

Mayweather is go good, he's never come close to a situation like that. This is part of the problem. Because Floyd has yet to be seriously tested, people don't give him his proper respect.

He's yet to be seriously tested at WW because he hasn't fought anyone that was incredibly good. Hence people pick Hearns over him.

At Middleweight maybe not, but I won't rule it out, and at 154, Floyd beats him in a UD.

Shame Hagler never fought at 154... The idea that Floyd beats Hagler at MW is mere delusion and nothing else.

[The Comic DON]

PLEAS PLEASE PLEASE name these "true elite fighters" he chose to stay away from?


I'll wait...

Well one would be be Manny as we all know it and don't start with the whole drug testing fiasco, because we all know it was bull on Floyds part. He never asked any other challenger, but when Manny is on a roll and set to give Floyd a challenge a million excuses start to fly.

Sergio Martinez would be the 2nd. Martinez isn't that much bigger then Floyd. I believe Iran Barkley had a bigger size over Duran when they fought. The only difference is size of heart and the fact that Floyd doesn't want to risk a lost.

Floyd isn't on par with these guys and his resume doesn't prove other wise.

[bray26]

PLEAS PLEASE PLEASE name these "true elite fighters" he chose to stay away from?


I'll wait...

Please don't be one of those guys! Was Guerro the best fighter available? Ortiz? De la Hoya, was the last fighter on top of the sport that fought the best fighter available! Take away the word elite, just think of making the biggest fights in boxing! He's his own boss, he decides who he fights! That's his word! And he decides to fight guys he knows he can beat! Period point plank! Oscar went to 160 to fight Hopkins! You think he had to take that fight? He fought Floyd, you think he had to take that fight? No! But he did, to challenge himself! Truly call himself the best! Not fight average fighters and call himself the greatest of all time! Get real! Floyd calls the shots now, and if he keeps giving these BS excuses when it comes to anyone that can truly push him to be great in the ring! Making ****** statements like after I beat so and so, they will just want me to fight someone else! Of course they will! That's the game! Maybe Jordan should have stopped at one ring! Maybe Lebron should quit now! As long as you are in the game you got to keep proving it year after year! That's the game, you don't like it! Retire! But stop running your mouth if you're not gonna step up, sad thing is his fans got just as many excuses as he does!