Can Boxing Fans criticise Pacquiao for his catchweight fights and accept that Ward

[Bushbaby]

It seems like you're making up a timeline.

Foreman didn't have that "strap" for too long. He didn't -I repeat- did NOT have 1, not 1, successful title defense.

So there was only a small window of time to make such fight....The Clottey fight at 147 was more credible than a Foreman fight at any weight...

When that BS farce of a garbage Marg fight happen, Foreman was pretty much done with boxing. He had that one thing with Wolak and never seen again.

Don't try to make this sound like I'm wrong & you're right because that's not the case. Foreman had the title when he was too tall for Pacman.

However I do believe that the Clottey fight was Pacman's best win over 140.

Furthermore Foreman didn't have a title defense does not change the fact that he had, I repeat he had a title. That's a far greater fight, win than Margarito for a phantom title period.

If we were talking about different things fine, leave it at that Jro.

[damned1974]

142 lbs

On the night of the fight,Pac weighed more than Oscar-literally. There was no REAL risk in that fight-Freddie trained Oscar and knew how far spent he was as a fighter,let alone the weight issues.
The only risk was how they hyped the fight-saying how much "bigger" Oscar will be than Manny,etc...they sold you their version of risk and the public's perception bought it up without even asking themselves how a fighter like Oscar could even attempt to make a weight he hasn't been at in over a decade,let alone being at the very end of his career....

[Roman Moreno]

The thing is-Cotto would not go down at all these days and Manny still wanted him at WW for his belt,but Floyd got to fight him at 154-the honorable thing to do!

People do a lot of things for money,it doesn't mean that they will be at their 100% best on the night of the fight.A few pounds makes a major difference in fights-there are a lot of reasons,but that's another story.

Do you think Cotto is going to say he will struggle to make weight before or during the pressers???!!! Hell no-they are trying to sell the fight as a competitive fight with a high risk-not a weight drained and outclassed opponent-that is hard to hype up.

No one is talking about what would have been a waste of time rematch...

I'm not talking about before or during the presser with Pac. I'm talking about the before the fight with Foreman AFTER THE FIGHT WITH PAC. During those pressers. Where he said he felt fine against Pac there was no excuses and after Foreman if there is any good offers he would go back down to WW....Pretty much saying he had no trouble AT THAT TIME to fight at WW. However, fast forward to what you mentioned. He didn't want to sacrifice his body "AGAIN" insinuating he did the first time. When before he said he was OK AFTER THE FACT not BEFORE but AFTER.

I expect Dawson to do the same thing...Even if his body is just as good as Cotto body was at that time...I expect Dawson to give the weight excuse if he losses. It will be interesting though too see how fans would react to that excuse.

[4Corners]

Don't try to make this sound like I'm wrong & you're right because that's not the case. Foreman had the title when he was too tall for Pacman.

However I do believe that the Clottey fight was Pacman's best win over 140.

Furthermore Foreman didn't have a title defense does not change the fact that he had, I repeat he had a title. That's a far greater fight, win than Margarito for a phantom title period.

If we were talking about different things fine, leave it at that Jro.

Really?????? I thought Pac beating a past prime-still good Cotto was his best win above 140 lbs. Clottey was a solid/decent win over a Top 10 WW.

[Roman Moreno]

Don't try to make this sound like I'm wrong & you're right because that's not the case. Foreman had the title when he was too tall for Pacman.

However I do believe that the Clottey fight was Pacman's best win over 140.

Furthermore Foreman didn't have a title defense does not change the fact that he had, I repeat he had a title. That's a far greater fight, win than Margarito for a phantom title period.

If we were talking about different things fine, leave it at that Jro.

I'm not making it sound like anything.

You're a creating a timeline.

You're acting as if Pac said that Foreman is "too tall"(taken out of context) in order to fight Margarito.

Like if the choice was either Foreman or Margarito.. And, that wasn't the case...

It was either Foreman or Clottey. And, regardless if Foreman had a "strap" he wasn't a better opponent than Clottey.

[4Corners]

No one is talking about what would have been a waste of time rematch...

I'm not talking about before or during the presser with Pac. I'm talking about the before the fight with Foreman AFTER THE FIGHT WITH PAC. During those pressers. Where he said he felt fine against Pac there was no excuses and after Foreman if there is any good offers he would go back down to WW....Pretty much saying he had no trouble AT THAT TIME to fight at WW. However, fast forward to what you mentioned. He didn't want to sacrifice his body "AGAIN" insinuating he did the first time. When before he said he was OK AFTER THE FACT not BEFORE but AFTER.

I expect Dawson to do the same thing...Even if his body is just as good as Cotto body was at that time...I expect Dawson to give the weight excuse if he losses. It will be interesting though too see how fans would react to that excuse.

Whcih is why Ward should have gone to 175 or at least fought him at like 172 or something. He's going to get zero credit if he does beat Dawson.

[D4thincarnation]

On the night of the fight,Pac weighed more than Oscar-literally. There was no REAL risk in that fight-Freddie trained Oscar and knew how far spent he was as a fighter,let alone the weight issues.
The only risk was how they hyped the fight-saying how much "bigger" Oscar will be than Manny,etc...they sold you their version of risk and the public's perception bought it up without even asking themselves how a fighter like Oscar could even attempt to make a weight he hasn't been at in over a decade,let alone being at the very end of his career....

Oscar wanted the fight and dragged Pacquiao up 3 weight in a year.

You really think Pacquiao could have bossed Oscar around the negotiation table?

Oscar called the shots.

[damned1974]

Don't try to make this sound like I'm wrong & you're right because that's not the case. Foreman had the title when he was too tall for Pacman.

However I do believe that the Clottey fight was Pacman's best win over 140.

Furthermore Foreman didn't have a title defense does not change the fact that he had, I repeat he had a title. That's a far greater fight, win than Margarito for a phantom title period.

If we were talking about different things fine, leave it at that Jro.

Ironic that Clottey didn't try to fight,said he was there to do "a job" in an interview after the fight, and was paid a $1.5 million bonus AFTER that fight (why would anyone give a supposed bonus after that performance?)...sounds dodgy to me.

[Roman Moreno]

Really?????? I thought Pac beating a past prime-still good Cotto was his best win above 140 lbs. Clottey was a solid/decent win over a Top 10 WW.

I agree, I actually think Cotto is his best win past 130...I will take that win over Hatton win.

[Roman Moreno]

Whcih is why Ward should have gone to 175 or at least fought him at like 172 or something. He's going to get zero credit if he does beat Dawson.

I agree,I don't think he is going to get any credit...I mean it's easy to say now that he will. But, that will change after the fact when weight excuse will be brought up.

Ironic that Clottey didn't try to fight,said he was there to do "a job" in an interview after the fight, and was paid a $1.5 million bonus AFTER that fight (why would anyone give a supposed bonus after that performance?)...sounds dodgy to me.