Pacquiao/Marquez Post Fight Discussion- Please re-vote in the poll. .

[PACsmash]

i think roach was so sure that marquez is going to come out blazing looking to KO manny but when that didnt happen roach had no answer for pac. manny just didnt get off at saturday night. its not like manny is a slick fighter, manny is known to take hits to land his own but saturday night manny just wasnt doing anything. He was waiting to much for marquez to make the move so he can counter but thats not his style, manny is good when he is on the attack.

[KFC(Fforfloyd)]

my analyzation-

equipments( downloaded video of marquez-pac 3 and VLC to watch in slow motion{ 0.33x speed})


1st round
start of round"pacquiao jabs- miss
2:49:- marquez jabs andhits pac's glove
2:47- pac jabs marquez's glove
2:42- pac jabs marquez face( clean)
2:38- double jab by pac both miss
2:34- pac jabs and misses
2:33- pac jabs marquez glove
2:27: marquez right straight and misses while pac backpeddles1
2:27-pacc counters with a jab and misses
2:20- marquez jabs and hits between pac's arms
2:17- marquez throws loose jab to distance himself aand pac
2:14- marquez throws left hook and misses
2:10-pac throws a jab and hits marquez glove
2:07- pac throws a jab and misses
2:04- marquez throws a jab and hits between pac forearms and misses head
2:02- pac throws jab and misses
2:00- pac double jabs both are missed
2:00- marquez counters with a left hook and misses3
1:56- marquez looping left hook grazes pac's gloves4
1:54-marquez jab to the body ( in real time, it looked clean but watching in slomo, it hit pac's elbow and it went down to his body touching it.. partially blocked, not clean or hard)
1:51- pac double jabs and both are missed
1:49- pac straight left( clean and hard) 3/11
1:49- marquez with right straight and misses5
1:46- pac double jabs and throws left straight and finishes it off with right hook, first 3 misses except the right hook which made marquez looses his footing 2/10
1:43-marquez jabs and doesnt land on anything
1:40- marquez right hook (misses)
1:39-pac counter right hook follows it up with a double jab and a left straight( all misses) 1/8
1:35- marquez jabs and misses
1:34- marquez and manny both jab each others gloves
1:32- marquez jabs and misses
1:27- marquez jabs and misses
1:26- marquez right body hook tags pac while pac backpeddles( not consider clean and hard)
1:19- pac left straight hits marquez's gloves 1/6
1:18- both lean into each other and feign punchess, pac then jabs and it goes over marquez's head
1:15- pac jabs and misses
1:12- marquez jabs manny's temple( clean)
1:11- manny counter right and left hook both misses
1:11- marquez counter right hhook( clean and hard), left hook and right hook triple combo( 1 hit 2 misses) 1/10
1:02- pac jabs and misses
1:01- pac jabs and misses
0:59- pac jabs and hits gloves
0:58-marquez jabs and misses
0:55 pac jabs and throws right hook combo( both missed) 1/5
0:46-pac jabs and missed
0:42-pac jabs and missed
0:38- marquez jabs and missed
0:36-pac jabs and missed
0:33-marquez jab and right hook combo (both missed)
0:30- pac left straight snaps marquez's head back( clean and hard) 1/4
0:30- marquez counter jabbed and missed
0:27- pac double jab( both missed)
0:22- pac jabs and missed
0:18- pac jabs and missed
0:15- looping right hook by marquez is missed
0:14- pac counter left hook and marquez ducked3
0:10- marquez jab/right straight combo missed 1/13
0:09-pac jab/left straight combo both missed 2
0:04- marquez throws right hook and it grazes pac;s shoulder, throws left hook and pac squats, throws right body hook and missed pac's body
0:01- pac does a jab, left hook combo both missed1
0:01- marquez counters and hits below the belt with a right hook,looks like he holds pac with his left hand and throws another right hook to pacs body and missed as pac backpeddles (neither punches count)
round 1

jabs connected/ jabs total
pac:1/27
marquez:1/12
note: marquez used alot of feign jabs to keep pac at a distance in which i didnt count them

power punches connected/total
pac:3/11
marquez:1/18

TOTAL PUNCHES CONNECTED/ATTEMPTED
pac:4/38
marquez:2/30

{compuboxes's numbers}
{pac:11/38}
{marquez:7/32}


defensively pac was better since he defended against power punches better, pac outlanded jmm by a mere two punches in the clean and hard punches category, both are tied for ring generalship and of course the effective aggressor was he that landed the power punches better or defended better against it

PAC WINS ROUND 1 but not by much

***will post round 2 later***

[Rico1965]

I'm a fan of both fighters, I was rooting for Marquez and I scored it a draw. If Pacquiao was fighting for Marquez's belt the fight would of went to Marquez. Plain and simple if your the challenger your going to have to take the belt don't leave it in the hands of the judges.

[ßringer]

The excuses keep rolling in, Freddie Roach "We overtrained"



First it was the foot cramps, now Freddie is blaming the performance on overtraining.

[savorduhflavor]

Another ****** thread.

If one guy wins 7 rounds then he wins the fight, regardless of who's champion and who's challenger.

[hurtbizness83]

How bout marquez has our number and manny still has some things to work on. Act humble

[Toyman]

Well, the same can be done for the punch stats you're bringing up. They're a tallied TOTAL. They're not tallied on a round-by-round basis. Pacquiao could have landed many of those shots over the course of 3 or 4 particularly good ones. Just because he landed a lot of them over the course of the fight doesn't automatically mean they were landed evenly over the course of 12 rounds...

Just sayin'...

the round by round compubox shows pac outlanded jmm in about 8 or 9 rounds i think.


[oddly enough, it shows pac also outlanding jmm in 7 of 12 rounds in the 2nd fight]



at the end of the day, compubox is only a supporting tool....the proper way to do it is a scorecard with justification for each round..

im seeing lots of those with 116-112 or 115-113 for pac..

ive actully yet to see even 1 for jmm..

[PACsmash]

No excuses team pacman!! and im a manny fan myself, but there shouldnt be any excuses! if manny over train then that was YOUR job as his trainer to prevent that from happening, also to ariza u're manny's strength and conditioning coach, u're the one to tell manny what to do your not suppose ask him if he feels like doing this drill today or not.

[r3robinson]

Why bash a Man for his opinion? You can debate why u don't agree but why bash....it his opinion not yours..

[Eaner0919]

If Roach is overrated, then Nacho is a big failure.

What trainer tells you to take it easy on the last few rounds coz u are winning? In a fight that historically has always been close? This is the reason De La Hoya fired his trainer in the Trinidad fight. 1. Nacho is the same guy that derailed Marquez' career, fought for peanuts in Indonesia instead of fighting an immediate rematch with Pac, then blames it on Pacquiao. 2. There is a reason why Rafael fired Nacho.

to the numbered points

1. that was as manager to JMM not trainer. Horrible mistake and one that JMM realized and now has a team of advisors in place
2. From what I have been told by several people Nacho did not like the way Rafa was reacting to punches in sparring and told him maybe it's time to hang them up. Rafa decided to move forward