Comments Thread For: Mayweather Wants Legit Loss, Not Tainted With Steroids

[Brother Jay]

because of the extremely disorganized, or more aptly described as "chaotic" organization Manny has, it is quite understandable that various conflicting/contradicting statements are made on his behalf and this is only magnified by Manny's not making official statements more often to clarify pertinent points.

Manny doesn't really make official statements. A YouTube clip does not qualify as him agreeing to USADA random tests up until the day.

it is easy to equate these inconsistencies as lies, especially by those already su****ious of Manny and his team. the discussion will never end and thus i'll leave it at that save for one point: if Team Pacquiao is plagued by inconsistencies and contradictions, SO IS TEAM MAYWEATHER.

Inconsistencies in terms of facts are an indication of falsehoods. In business, men deal with THE BOTTOM LINE. And in this instance the bottom line is that all of Pacquiao's demands were met. Not all of Mayweather's demands were met. The fault lies with the party that did not fulfill its obligation. In this case, that party is Team Pacquiao.

if anyone is accusing Manny and his team of lying due to inconsistencies, then the same accusation must be leveled to team floyd as well since they are just as inconsistent and ******ed statements have also been made in his camp.

I have no made no argument to contest that the allegations that suggest individuals in Team Mayweather have made inconsistent statements. However, that is a red herring, as the real issue is about who is responsible for halting the mega fight from being made.

that is true and i have no trouble with that statement. but that only holds true to overly zealous fans which is common to athletes of Manny's caliber.

I agree here, except *******s are more than simply overly zealous. They have attempted to deify Manny Pacquiao despite his resume and his legacy being less impressive and definitely less legitimate than other boxers. If Manny had truly and legitimately done all that his PR team claim, I would be among those singing his praises! However, next to every great milestone Pacquiao has achieved in boxing, there is an asterisk because there is additional information required to get the full picture of what he really did, and more importantly what he didn't really do.

Pac's $10million/lb demand ISN'T absurd, mainly because

1. floyd has already proven to cheat at the weight, even when he could EASILY and practically effortlessly keep the weight.

I challenge this statement. When has Floyd ever effortlessly proven to be able to go below 147? In fact, other than Hatton who chased Floyd from 140lbs, Marquez is the only other guy Floyd has fought from a smaller division than the one he was competing in.

2. the weight demand is something he is already expected to keep without problems. in other words, the only way floyd would fail the weight is if he would willfully do so. is coming in at 147 lbs unheard of from floyd?

The weight demand wasn't the issue. The excessive $10 million per lb price tag was the absurd aspect of the demand. Yet Floyd met the demand and fulfilled his obligation!

the ONLY difference between the blood and urine tests is the detection of HGH. nothing more. if i'm wrong, then enlighten me and i'll acknowledge my mistake.

I don't see how this last point makes any sense: "Pac's $10million/lb demand ISN'T absurd mainly because the ONLY difference between the blood and urine tests is the detection of HGH. nothing more."

How does that make any sense? Are you aware of all the ways that exist to dope? I don't think so. I don't think that even Victor Conte is aware of every way to dope. New innovations are created everyday. So to speculate that only HGH cannot be detected is foolish.

the ONLY difference between the blood and urine tests is the detection of HGH. nothing more.according to conte ALL CHAMPIONS ARE SUSPECT. that includes floyd. and please note that floyd APPROACHED HIM for advice on what tests to detect PEDS. so though you may have no confidence in him, FLOYD CERTAINLY HAS.

Yet Floyd has been the only one consistently willing to take all the tests randomly! Its only Pacquiao that has ever refused a test when tens of millions are on the table. Mosley and now Ortiz were both willing to do ANY tests to make the fights with Mayweather happen. Also, I did state that "Conte's insight into PEDs is always worth listening to", but his past creates a conflict of interests when he begins to pontificate as to who should just fight who.

if you reread conte's description of how he prevents detection, mosley NEVER WENT THROUGH RANDOM URINE TESTING. they were always informed ahead when a test is due. remember that it takes AT LEAST 24 hours to hide the steroids from the system. this means that THEY NEED TO BE INFORMED A DAY AHEAD AT LEAST to prepare for the tests.

We don't know what Manny is taking. So why do you insist that a urine tests is adequate? You've already admitted that HGH is undetectable by urine tests. Why do you then ignore the possibility that other drugs may exist that urine tests cannot detect when HGH has already established reasonable doubt?

and the fact that athletes STILL GET CAUGHT USING URINE TESTING prove that those tests do work.

The fact that some athletes may not be thorough is not the same as urine tests being a stringent enough testing method to detect the majority of PEDs in modern sports. One is not the other.

1. if floyd accepted 14 days, then why is it no longer acceptable? people NEVER answer that question.

A better question is if Floyd offered 14 days and Pacquiao refused it, then why is 14 days acceptable now? And whose fault is it that the 14 days is no longer on the table?

There was no wrong doing on Floyd's part by asking for even more deeper and probing testing methods and standards once he defeated the #1 WW in the world. He was then in a position strength and Pacquiao was in a position of weakness. Be that as it may, Floyd NEVER asked to lower the penalty for coming in over weight. He simply wanted the best and most stringent testing available.

2. i won't debate on who calls the shots or not, but one fact remains: unless BOTH fighters face each other, NEITHER will find true closure. Floyd will forever be considered a coward, and Pac will forever have the question of steroids attached to his name.

Floyd is an Olympian who turned pro and fought a world champion and future HOF in just his 18th fight. Floyd challenged at defeated the best in every division that he's fought in, with the exception of Kostya Tszyu who demanded a 60/40 split and instead fought and lost to Hatton, who would immediate go up in weight after that fight to seek a match with Floyd.

Floyd Mayweather has conducted his career with integrity & has intentionally gone after the WBC title[the most respected and prestigious title in the alphabet title era] in every division he's boxed in. Floyd has been the most dominant boxer since Roy Jones in his prime, and is the most accurate boxer since the inception of Compubox into the sport of boxing.

Pacquiao, a guy who has used 5 vacant belts to make his case for being a multi-division champion, holds nothing for Mayweather's legacy. The man has been making excuses for himself since the beginning starting with being "too small". He's used catchweights to weaken his WW opponents, and Manny only fights WWs who are coming off the biggest losses of their careers. Six in a row in fact.

There is no comparison. Manny Pacquiao relies on accolades bestowed upon him by the media to legitimize his place as a top boxer, not his own accomplishments. Playing "little monkey see, little monkey do" is not blazing any trails. When Mayweather beats him, the media and *******s alike will simply say "Pac has heart and did well for a small guy".

funny you mentioned blood doping. do you know how those who used it were caught? when people noticed certain athletes had unusual puncture wounds in their forearms. yes, blood doping requires ridiculously large needles to use.

So you are saying that boxers have an extensive body examination before fight??? You are saying that they couldn't get away with holes? Even in the legs or on the ass cheeks?

[Brother Jay]

... Continued

... continued

you do realize that tests only find chemicals which they are designed to detect right? those so called other ways of cheating possibly using different chemicals or agents WON'T BE DETECTED IF THEY ARE UNKNOWN IN THE FIRST PLACE. in other words, floyd's vaunted blood tests won't detect them. in fact, at the time floyd championed those blood tests, those tests had a dismal track record of catching a total of less than THREE cheats in the hundreds of tests they took.

I love it. Your argument is that because Floyd's requested USADA tests may NOT detect those other methods, Floyd should simply forgo the random USADA testing all together? If not, what could possibly be your point?

in other words, the ONLY thing those blood tests have over urine tests is that they can detect HGH. and even then, its reliability is in serious doubt.

They are leaps and bounds better than athletic commission tests. That's all that matters. You do realize that you criticizing the reliability of the tests is reason for more stringent tests and not less, right? LOL .. we agree!

tell that to floyd who APPROACHED HIM FOR ADVICE. besides, if you put it that way, then NO TEST could ever detect all those unknown secret agents and EVERYONE, INCLUDING FLOYD can now be accused of taking PEDS.

Again, its Floyd who has always been willing to take the tests, not Pacquiao. Floyd should approach the top drug peddler for advice on how to detect them. He shouldn't however listen to the man's career advice. Just ask Mark Mcgwire!

for all you know, this is simply some elaborate scheme from floyd to take away attention from him who'se actually the one taking PEDS and to put the limelight to Manny. heck, we might as well do away with tests altogether then!

Now THAT is the ******* logic that I've been waiting for. If Floyd is willing to take ALL the same tests, and Manny Pacquiao has for the last few years publicly refused to, the limelight is on Pacquiao because of his own choices, not because of Floyd's. If Manny would have taken the tests before now, the fight would be done and he'd be blaming the blood tests for the loss.

who is more credible in determining the effectiveness of tests. those who made the tests, or the one who was able to fly circles around those tests and cheat it for YEARS?

I don't question the legitimacy of Conte's information. I doubt that Conte has disclosed all the different ways that there are to cheat, but I believe that he has been truthful about what he has already gone on record to say simply because there are others in the world who are experts that would have exposed him .. and he knows it.

or would you rather trust floyd?

I don't see how both fighters taking random USADA tests requires us to trust either of them. The tests are because we DO NOT trust either of them! LOL

thank you. but though i say Pac is partially responsible for the fight not happening, I BLAME FLOYD AS WELL.

You can blame whomever you like, but the truth about the whole matter is that it was only the issue of testing that has held up this fight. Nothing more. The only skewed way an individual could find blame in Team Mayweather is if they saw Floyd not relenting back to the original terms as blame-worthy. That would be, of course, utterly ridiculous. Arum isn't Floyd's Daddy anymore. Hasn't been in years. He's Manny's Pappy these days. He isn't calling the shots anymore.

i don't savor crushing dreams. there is enough pain and suffering in the world as it is. i prefer sharing ideas with those who are willing to listen and hope those who are hardheaded and foolish change their minds (just like Pac and Floyd)

I do. I differ in that way because I believe that ******ity and those who subscribe to it deserve to be punished. Its one thing to have a conflicting opinion. Its another to have facts that refute that opinion but the one goes on to remain ignorant out of sheer pride. That's called ******ity, and it needs to have its ass kicked daily. Twice on Sunday.

I gotta say though, when you want to, you sure can hold yourself to a higher standard. You are NOT what I'd call a *******, even though you do have *******-like tendencies. LOL

I like watching Pacquiao fight, much in the same way that I thought Gatti/Ward was a candidate for one of the greatest fights of all time. Those two weren't elite, but they put on a great show. That's the same way I feel about Manny Pacquiao.

[LeadUppercut]

[QUOTE=ModernTalking;10775690]

LMAO, I just removed " Afighter4u " from ignore, mainly just to have another laugh at him, and I noticed that he has me " sigged " .

LMAO In context, that post was as funny as hell, I'm gonna re-post, just for fun.....

==============================

Well, I wasn't sure, so I rang around.....

I got some funny sounding kid on the phone, at first he thought that I was calling from WADA, so he repeatedly hung up..... but once I convinced him that I just wanted some business advice, he was most happy to help.

He told me..... ALWAYS TAKE THE MONEY !!

" Yay..... Osky like me..... me take money..... me smart"

LMAO[/QUOTE


Yea right...more like he owned your ass that's why you got him on ignored in the first place.

No, he continuously filled up his dribble-bucket, until I could bear no more

[LeadUppercut]

oh, i didn't know that you put me on ignore.

and i'm glad that you can laugh at your own idiocy. its always good to have a positive attitude. Let me show you my sig again since apparently you can't remember exactly how you owned yourself.

LMAO How?

That quote was so funny, in context, that I might sig it myself

I havent talked to you for awhile, are you still a dishonest whiney b1tch ?

Or shall I put you back on ignore ?

========================================

Well, I wasn't sure, so I rang around.....

I got some funny sounding kid on the phone, at first he thought that I was calling from WADA, so he repeatedly hung up..... but once I convinced him that I just wanted some business advice, he was most happy to help.

He told me..... ALWAYS TAKE THE MONEY !!

" Yay..... Osky like me..... me take money..... me smart"

LMAO

[LeadUppercut]

i did know about that vid until just now. Thank you for showing it to me. true, it may seem like post fight interview>news interview days after the fight, but its only upon retrospect that one can evaluate exactly what happened and why it happened.

you've just been beaten, your head is ringing from all the punches, the adrenalin is still in your body and all sorts of emotions are going through you. its natural that one cannot think clearly.

BUT.

if you want to use that as a basis to question pac on whether he's taking steroids or not, NOTE that morales CAME FROM A LOSS, Manny came off a controversial draw.

and yet Manny lost VIA UNANIMOUS DECISION.

and yes, Pac may have said a few days after the fight that his loss was because of blood taken from him, but this was WAAAAY before people even CONSIDERED him fighting Floyd. this was literally years before that.

I was correct, you are still a dishonest whiney b1tch

Even Haye came straight out with the toe excuse IMMEDIATELY after the fight..... he did not need a couple of weeks to think about it like Manny did.

[LeadUppercut]

rightly so......

the crux of this thread is that if you are pbf's opponent, then you are suspect of using peds???....and you are to toe the ost line pbf (not the boxing commissions) demands..

the sample pbf mosley fight where the testing was used did not convince many that it has really served the intended purpose......

discussions or posts just in this forum/site point to the fact that people are still so divided in the merit of or need for ost....

the fact that the ost issue and the ped use cheating allegations remain a non-issue to authorities having administrative oversight on boxing is indicative also of the above....

the fact that other fighters agree to undergo ost to fight pbf could not be really taken that these fighters really are for ost testing.....for the opportunity to gain more, financially and stature wise, a pbf fight brings, is hard to resist.......like a carrot

and this is the carrot pbf uses.....

but only a few fighters bite........

sadly, it is boxing, the intended recipient of the "cleaning-up the sports crusade", that for the time being suffers all the more.........

for the proponents of ost testing could not put their act together.....

No, the crux of this thread is similar to most other Pac threads.

Pages and pages of whiney little kids, peddling ridiculous dribbly excuses as to why a grown man cannot take a simple blood test.

[Ringlife]

Well that makes sense because if you lose a fight and than they can't do nothing about it every body seen you get your butt kicked a good thing that De La Hoya beat Vargas because the didn't find it before the fight and that sad so if you lose you lost fair and square.

[LeadUppercut]

If you are the best, then take the test....

You kids have just about run out of dribbly excuses anyways.

It is nearly time to pay the piper

Pacquiao has nowhere left to run and nowhere left to hide.

" Pacquiao, you're next " !!
~ FMj

There are no more old men and bums left for Pacquiao to hide behind, although I am sure that Arum will attempt to peddle Cintron, Jones, and the Cotto/Margo winner..... and Manny's inept fanbase will likely support it

But I feel that Pac's time has run out, everybody has already seen the Manny circus, and punters are sick of Pacquiao's exhibition match-up's against less than inspiring opponents.

After Marquez it is time to pay the piper Arum, and Manny..... so you think that you are the greatest fighter that ever lived, huh? Well, we will soon see about that. Time for you to front up against someone who aint an old man, faded champion, or bum..... and he aint no lightweight either.

Or is the " lawsuit " sooooo important to Manny that he will feel the need to see it through to the bitter end, and just continue fighting a host of old men in the meantime?

Either way, the truth comes out real soon.

And check out fighthype over the next day-or-so if you want the real oil on the "second negotiations". Won't that be fun The Manny-circus is falling to bits, capitalise Bob, before you run past your sell-by date

[LeadUppercut]

I do. I differ in that way because I believe that ******ity and those who subscribe to it deserve to be punished. Its one thing to have a conflicting opinion. Its another to have facts that refute that opinion but the one goes on to remain ignorant out of sheer pride. That's called ******ity, and it needs to have its ass kicked daily. Twice on Sunday.

I gotta say though, when you want to, you sure can hold yourself to a higher standard. You are NOT what I'd call a *******, even though you do have *******-like tendencies. LOL

I like watching Pacquiao fight, much in the same way that I thought Gatti/Ward was a candidate for one of the greatest fights of all time. Those two weren't elite, but they put on a great show. That's the same way I feel about Manny Pacquiao.

Jay, props for your perseverance, and for your diplomacy.

But I will give you the tip.....

That ******* is one of the worst, he is likely about to peddle you a half-page full of the whiniest dribble you have ever seen. In fact, I would bet on it, which is why he became my second "ignore".

I am picky how I spend my time now.

*** dishonest posters.

[John Barron]

Floyd Mayweather has conducted his career with integrity & has intentionally gone after the WBC title[the most respected and prestigious title in the alphabet title era] in every division he's boxed in. Floyd has been the most dominant boxer since Roy Jones in his prime, and is the most accurate boxer since the inception of Compubox into the sport of boxing.

Pacquiao, a guy who has used 5 vacant belts to make his case for being a multi-division champion, holds nothing for Mayweather's legacy. The man has been making excuses for himself since the beginning starting with being "too small". He's used catchweights to weaken his WW opponents, and Manny only fights WWs who are coming off the biggest losses of their careers. Six in a row in fact.

There is no comparison. Manny Pacquiao relies on accolades bestowed upon him by the media to legitimize his place as a top boxer, not his own accomplishments. Playing "little monkey see, little monkey do" is not blazing any trails. When Mayweather beats him, the media and *******s alike will simply say "Pac has heart and did well for a small guy".

a fucking men. i used to be big on pacquiao back in the day before i stopped to smell the bullshit. most *******s aren't able to do that because either they're way too nationalistic and or way too in love with the guy and not the sport.