Comments Thread For: Mayweather Wants Legit Loss, Not Tainted With Steroids

[ModernTalking]

[QUOTE=LeadUppercut;10771810]LMAO, I just removed " Afighter4u " from ignore, mainly just to have another laugh at him, and I noticed that he has me " sigged " .

LMAO In context, that post was as funny as hell, I'm gonna re-post, just for fun.....

==============================

Well, I wasn't sure, so I rang around.....

I got some funny sounding kid on the phone, at first he thought that I was calling from WADA, so he repeatedly hung up..... but once I convinced him that I just wanted some business advice, he was most happy to help.

He told me..... ALWAYS TAKE THE MONEY !!

" Yay..... Osky like me..... me take money..... me smart"

LMAO[/QUOTE


Yea right...more like he owned your ass that's why you got him on ignored in the first place.

[qcd]

All he say make sense

[AFighter4U]

LMAO, I just removed " Afighter4u " from ignore, mainly just to have another laugh at him, and I noticed that he has me " sigged " .

LMAO In context, that post was as funny as hell, I'm gonna re-post, just for fun.....

==============================

Well, I wasn't sure, so I rang around.....

I got some funny sounding kid on the phone, at first he thought that I was calling from WADA, so he repeatedly hung up..... but once I convinced him that I just wanted some business advice, he was most happy to help.

He told me..... ALWAYS TAKE THE MONEY !!

" Yay..... Osky like me..... me take money..... me smart"

LMAO

oh, i didn't know that you put me on ignore.

and i'm glad that you can laugh at your own idiocy. its always good to have a positive attitude. Let me show you my sig again since apparently you can't remember exactly how you owned yourself.

[AFighter4U]

Watch from sec .41 to .47 from the vid
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4wg3XgmDSxI
Pac says Morales size no problem and that he felt confortable in the weight they fought in and that the only reason he couldn't KO morales was because of the gloves...also that he couldn't see from his right eye either lol.....Their was no indication by him that he felt weak in the fight!!! and that is right after the fight not a couple days after. You would know right away if you felt weak the momment you are in the ring and would comment about it afterwards with out question if you truly felt weak.

Post fight interview > news interview days after the fight when you can go over with PR person.

i did know about that vid until just now. Thank you for showing it to me. true, it may seem like post fight interview>news interview days after the fight, but its only upon retrospect that one can evaluate exactly what happened and why it happened.

you've just been beaten, your head is ringing from all the punches, the adrenalin is still in your body and all sorts of emotions are going through you. its natural that one cannot think clearly.

BUT.

if you want to use that as a basis to question pac on whether he's taking steroids or not, NOTE that morales CAME FROM A LOSS, Manny came off a controversial draw.

and yet Manny lost VIA UNANIMOUS DECISION.

and yes, Pac may have said a few days after the fight that his loss was because of blood taken from him, but this was WAAAAY before people even CONSIDERED him fighting Floyd. this was literally years before that.

[tangalog2200]

“If you beat me, I want you to earn it. I don’t want it to be tainted"

Huh... Sounds like someone isn't as "easy work, easy payday" as you made it sound like before Floydie. Why the change of tune?

rightly so......

the crux of this thread is that if you are pbf's opponent, then you are suspect of using peds???....and you are to toe the ost line pbf (not the boxing commissions) demands..

the sample pbf mosley fight where the testing was used did not convince many that it has really served the intended purpose......

discussions or posts just in this forum/site point to the fact that people are still so divided in the merit of or need for ost....

the fact that the ost issue and the ped use cheating allegations remain a non-issue to authorities having administrative oversight on boxing is indicative also of the above....

the fact that other fighters agree to undergo ost to fight pbf could not be really taken that these fighters really are for ost testing.....for the opportunity to gain more, financially and stature wise, a pbf fight brings, is hard to resist.......like a carrot

and this is the carrot pbf uses.....

but only a few fighters bite........

sadly, it is boxing, the intended recipient of the "cleaning-up the sports crusade", that for the time being suffers all the more.........

for the proponents of ost testing could not put their act together.....

[littlemac]

i did know about that vid until just now. Thank you for showing it to me. true, it may seem like post fight interview>news interview days after the fight, but its only upon retrospect that one can evaluate exactly what happened and why it happened.

you've just been beaten, your head is ringing from all the punches, the adrenalin is still in your body and all sorts of emotions are going through you. its natural that one cannot think clearly.

BUT.

if you want to use that as a basis to question pac on whether he's taking steroids or not, NOTE that morales CAME FROM A LOSS, Manny came off a controversial draw.

and yet Manny lost VIA UNANIMOUS DECISION.

and yes, Pac may have said a few days after the fight that his loss was because of blood taken from him, but this was WAAAAY before people even CONSIDERED him fighting Floyd. this was literally years before that.

Now we are having a discussion and I appreciate your time and argument.

Now as for your recollection point. I would agree if he(Manny) was reflecting back on his execution like maybe he(Manny) should had used the jab more or should have had his hands up more. That's very different then being aware of your physical state. Manny would have known (if he was not 100% physically/because of the extraction of his blood 2 days prier from the fight or a day of not sure which is it, but either way close to fight night) if something was off physically especially as a professional and experience athlete. The average Joe would know if they were feeling sluggish or sick at work or at the gym. Point is that you would remember especially if your a professional athlete because your profession requires and is demanded of you to be in tune with your body more so then the average Joe. So this is why I don't agree on Manny recollecting later that he felt weak because its something that is too obvious to miss especially for an athlete who is very in tune with his/her body. I just can't agree that Manny two or more days later remembered he felt weak lol....Come on!!!!

Now as far as Manny giving a heads up on his feeling weak about testing before OST was propose is a good argument until it falls apart because of his(Manny) constant change and different contradicting excuses. He gave to many different excuses and also to many different positions as to when its ok for him to be able to be tested, but the biggest red flag for me is that he(Manny) shows more of an issue with the Random aspect of testing then the actual timing of it. His willing to test close to the fight as long as he knows when it will be happening. That shows really no support of him really having an issue about testing taken place to close to the fight especially because of his rejecting of a 14day cut-off which should have taken care of his issue on testing too close to the fight.

This is why I am su****ious about Pac. It has nothing to do with hate, but with Manny's unclear and contradicting position of the whole testing thing. Plus the lawsuit now that would only complicate things into making the fight which further makes me believe Manny truly doesn't want it. Now the reason why he doesn't show interest I don't know. Could be his roiding and doesn't want to get expose, could be Arum, could be Roach, or simply just Manny himself. What ever the reason, in my eyes, Manny or Manny's camp are really not showing interest in Floyd.

I apologize for ranting on a bit longer then I planned and my grammar.

[AFighter4U]

Now we are having a discussion and I appreciate your time and argument.

Now as for your recollection point. I would agree if he(Manny) was reflecting back on his execution like maybe he(Manny) should had used the jab more or should have had his hands up more. That's very different then being aware of your physical state. Manny would have known (if he was not 100% physically/because of the extraction of his blood 2 days prier from the fight or a day of not sure which is it, but either way close to fight night) if something was off physically especially as a professional and experience athlete. The average Joe would know if they were feeling sluggish or sick at work or at the gym. Point is that you would remember especially if your a professional athlete because your profession requires and is demanded of you to be in tune with your body more so then the average Joe. So this is why I don't agree on Manny recollecting later that he felt weak because its something that is too obvious to miss especially for an athlete who is very in tune with his/her body. I just can't agree that Manny two or more days later remembered he felt weak lol....Come on!!!!

Now as far as Manny giving a heads up on his feeling weak about testing before OST was propose is a good argument until it falls apart because of his(Manny) constant change and different contradicting excuses. He gave to many different excuses and also to many different positions as to when its ok for him to be able to be tested, but the biggest red flag for me is that he(Manny) shows more of an issue with the Random aspect of testing then the actual timing of it. His willing to test close to the fight as long as he knows when it will be happening. That shows really no support of him really having an issue about testing taken place to close to the fight especially because of his rejecting of a 14day cut-off which should have taken care of his issue on testing too close to the fight.

This is why I am su****ious about Pac. It has nothing to do with hate, but with Manny's unclear and contradicting position of the whole testing thing. Plus the lawsuit now that would only complicate things into making the fight which further makes me believe Manny truly doesn't want it. Now the reason why he doesn't show interest I don't know. Could be his roiding and doesn't want to get expose, could be Arum, could be Roach, or simply just Manny himself. What ever the reason, in my eyes, Manny or Manny's camp are really not showing interest in Floyd.

I apologize for ranting on a bit longer then I planned and my grammar.

no problem man.

i agree with you in the fact that i myself didn't like manny's multiple excuses for his loss. a simple thing for him to say was that he lost to a better man that day and move on.

nonetheless, for me, it only shows manny is human.

regarding the randomness, please note that manny is willing to take unlimited urine tests up to and even after the day of the fight.

the only problem he has with blood tests is he doesn't want blood taken from him close to a fight and is asking for a mere seven days. Assuming we take Conte's word that it takes 24 hours to effectively cycle whatever drugs he's taking, two things must be considered in light of Pac's request:

1. IF he is indeed taking something that can be detected by blood tests, he must take it for ONLY six days and only during the tone-down period when he's actually no longer training.

2. And note that during this same time, he's STILL TAKING TESTS THAT CAN DETECT PEDS, in the form of urine tests which are PROVEN to detect PEDs, with the only exception of HGH.

3. Floyd himself thought 14 days was sufficient and acceptable. 14 Days!

4. HGH, to be effective for boxers, needs to be taken DURING THE PEAK OF TRAINING, to maximize the length of time and stamina of the fighter. the seven days Manny's asking for is AT THE END OF TRAINING, when he's basically resting and toning down in preparation for the fight.

5. LASTLY, Conte HIMSELF advised floyd to accept pac's 14 days request.

http://www.east side boxing.com/forum/archive/index.php/t-229151.html

(take away the spaces between "east side boxing")

he even called floyd's stubborn stance of no compromise as BS!

here's an audio of that transcript:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HB1-mqZUZGg


now i fault Pac for not taking the 14 days when it was offered, but i'm still hoping that somehow, both camps can think up of an acceptable compromise eventually. pac went from 30 days to 24 to 7. I'm HOPING he'd take the final step, or that somehow floyd would give him those 7 days.

its been great talking to you btw. there's nothing more satisfying than to have an even tempered discussion with a person with an opposing point of view.

[Brother Jay]

no problem man.

i agree with you in the fact that i myself didn't like manny's multiple excuses for his loss. a simple thing for him to say was that he lost to a better man that day and move on.

Yet he didn't. Whether you liked it or not is inconsequential. This is a clear case that Team Pacquiao as Pacquiao himself are prone to lying and making excuses. This sets the precedent for what he's been doing in negotiations with the Mayweather Camp.

nonetheless, for me, it only shows manny is human.

And as a human, Pacquiao is flawed. He is susceptible to ego and greed just like anyone else. No Floyd fan has ever argued that Floyd is a saint. *******s who have NEVER even met Pacquiao argue daily about what Manny would and would not do based on their own adolation.

regarding the randomness, please note that manny is willing to take unlimited urine tests up to and even after the day of the fight.

Floyd never asked for urine random tests. He asked for random USADA tests which call for blood and urine. A demand is a demand. And this demand is no more absurd than Roach and Pacquiao asking for $10 million per pound that Floyd comes in over 147lbs. If Floyd argued that the penalty be $10 thousand per pound, people would say that Floyd intends to come in over the stipulated weight. Why wouldn't people think that Manny is dirty because he consistently attempts to tweak the testing demands?

the only problem he has with blood tests is he doesn't want blood taken from him close to a fight and is asking for a mere seven days. Assuming we take Conte's word that it takes 24 hours to effectively cycle whatever drugs he's taking, two things must be considered in light of Pac's request:

1. IF he is indeed taking something that can be detected by blood tests, he must take it for ONLY six days and only during the tone-down period when he's actually no longer training.

Just because Conte was at one time the czar of PED's doesn't mean that new and improved technologies haven't come about since Conte has claimed to have "gone straight". Conte is not Pacquiao's nutritionist. He does not know what Pacquiao is doing. That and Conte has already stated that Pacquiao's rise in weight while maintaing his speed and power is suspect.

2. And note that during this same time, he's STILL TAKING TESTS THAT CAN DETECT PEDS, in the form of urine tests which are PROVEN to detect PEDs, with the only exception of HGH.

If urine tests detect PEDs, why was Mosley never caught? And HGH is a PED that many feel that Pacquiao may have been using. Why not test for HGH? All steroids do is keep the protein in the muscle for longer periods of time so that you can train longer. HGH is how you make the gains.

3. Floyd himself thought 14 days was sufficient and acceptable. 14 Days!

Floyd accepted the 14 days in THE FIRST ROUND OF NEGOTIATIONS, not the second round. Pacquiao refused ANY and ALL random blood tests. Once Floyd beat Mosley, the terms had become more severe. Pacquiao DOES NOT call the shots. He's not the draw!

4. HGH, to be effective for boxers, needs to be taken DURING THE PEAK OF TRAINING, to maximize the length of time and stamina of the fighter. the seven days Manny's asking for is AT THE END OF TRAINING, when he's basically resting and toning down in preparation for the fight.

What's hilarious is that you are attempting to justify Pacquiao's stance using PED science! HGH and steroids are NOT the only ways of cheating. ****, there's even blood doping, which by conventional methods would go undetected! There are literally dozens of way to dope, but random USADA methods are the best chance for fairness. Its all about Manny taking a supposed moral stance against fairness!

5. LASTLY, Conte HIMSELF advised floyd to accept pac's 14 days request.

Is Conte a Mayweather advisor? Do you not see a conflict of interests here? The CEO of BALCO is advising Floyd to take a fight where his opponent may be receiving product from Conte himself! Conte is not out of the game. He simply has made claims to have gone "legitimate". Using Conte's word as "law" in matters like these makes about as much sense as appointing a former CEO of Philip Morris as the Surgeon General.

Conte's insight into PEDs is always worth listening to, but if you think that Conte has or ever will reveal all his secrets then you aren't that bright. Conte peddled PEDs. Yet he is now some top nutritionist? What kind of marshmallows is he putting in his client's cocoa?

http://www.east side boxing.com/forum/archive/index.php/t-229151.html

(take away the spaces between "east side boxing")

N/A

he even called floyd's stubborn stance of no compromise as BS!


here's an audio of that transcript:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HB1-mqZUZGg

And with Conte's reputation, he's the reliable authority on what's bull****. This coming from a man who has made MILLIONS off helping athletes, both pro and Olympic, cheat with PEDs and beat the tests that are designed to catch them!

now i fault Pac for not taking the 14 days when it was offered, but i'm still hoping that somehow, both camps can think up of an acceptable compromise eventually. pac went from 30 days to 24 to 7. I'm HOPING he'd take the final step, or that somehow floyd would give him those 7 days.

Outstanding. You, an ardent Pacquiao supporter, have just admitted that it was Pacquiao who has held up the mega fight for years by refusing to negotiate in good faith. Pacquiao and Arum have made every excuse to remove blame from their side for this fight not happening, but a hardcore Pacquiao supporter like you has found the integrity to admit that the real obstacle standing in the way of this fight getting done for years is Manny Pacquiao himself.

Thank you for your honesty. Most *******s ... I mean pacfans, don't have the character for such candor. I applaud you.

its been great talking to you btw. there's nothing more satisfying than to have an even tempered discussion with a person with an opposing point of view.

Littlemac is pretty cool to converse with, huh? Especially when he's crushing the dreams of fanatics with facts and figures. Those are my favorite posts by him.

[mikemurni]

Translation:

I will come out of retirement when Pac is signed for another fight so that he wont be obligated to follow through with my accusation. I will then announce my vacation after his done with his fight so that I can have an excuse to duck him and hide behind OST.

[AFighter4U]

Yet he didn't. Whether you liked it or not is inconsequential. This is a clear case that Team Pacquiao as Pacquiao himself are prone to lying and making excuses. This sets the precedent for what he's been doing in negotiations with the Mayweather Camp.

because of the extremely disorganized, or more aptly described as "chaotic" organization Manny has, it is quite understandable that various conflicting/contradicting statements are made on his behalf and this is only magnified by Manny's not making official statements more often to clarify pertinent points.

it is easy to equate these inconsistencies as lies, especially by those already su****ious of Manny and his team. the discussion will never end and thus i'll leave it at that save for one point: if Team Pacquiao is plagued by inconsistencies and contradictions, SO IS TEAM MAYWEATHER.

if anyone is accusing Manny and his team of lying due to inconsistencies, then the same accusation must be leveled to team floyd as well since they are just as inconsistent and ******ed statements have also been made in his camp.

And as a human, Pacquiao is flawed. He is susceptible to ego and greed just like anyone else. No Floyd fan has ever argued that Floyd is a saint. *******s who have NEVER even met Pacquiao argue daily about what Manny would and would not do based on their own adolation.

that is true and i have no trouble with that statement. but that only holds true to overly zealous fans which is common to athletes of Manny's caliber.

Floyd never asked for urine random tests. He asked for random USADA tests which call for blood and urine. A demand is a demand. And this demand is no more absurd than Roach and Pacquiao asking for $10 million per pound that Floyd comes in over 147lbs. If Floyd argued that the penalty be $10 thousand per pound, people would say that Floyd intends to come in over the stipulated weight. Why wouldn't people think that Manny is dirty because he consistently attempts to tweak the testing demands?

Pac's $10million/lb demand ISN'T absurd, mainly because

1. floyd has already proven to cheat at the weight, even when he could EASILY and practically effortlessly keep the weight.
2. the weight demand is something he is already expected to keep without problems. in other words, the only way floyd would fail the weight is if he would willfully do so. is coming in at 147 lbs unheard of from floyd?

the ONLY difference between the blood and urine tests is the detection of HGH. nothing more. if i'm wrong, then enlighten me and i'll acknowledge my mistake.

Just because Conte was at one time the czar of PED's doesn't mean that new and improved technologies haven't come about since Conte has claimed to have "gone straight". Conte is not Pacquiao's nutritionist. He does not know what Pacquiao is doing. That and Conte has already stated that Pacquiao's rise in weight while maintaing his speed and power is suspect.

according to conte ALL CHAMPIONS ARE SUSPECT. that includes floyd. and please note that floyd APPROACHED HIM for advice on what tests to detect PEDS. so though you may have no confidence in him, FLOYD CERTAINLY HAS.

If urine tests detect PEDs, why was Mosley never caught? And HGH is a PED that many feel that Pacquiao may have been using. Why not test for HGH? All steroids do is keep the protein in the muscle for longer periods of time so that you can train longer. HGH is how you make the gains.

if you reread conte's description of how he prevents detection, mosley NEVER WENT THROUGH RANDOM URINE TESTING. they were always informed ahead when a test is due. remember that it takes AT LEAST 24 hours to hide the steroids from the system. this means that THEY NEED TO BE INFORMED A DAY AHEAD AT LEAST to prepare for the tests.

and the fact that athletes STILL GET CAUGHT USING URINE TESTING prove that those tests do work.

Floyd accepted the 14 days in THE FIRST ROUND OF NEGOTIATIONS, not the second round. Pacquiao refused ANY and ALL random blood tests. Once Floyd beat Mosley, the terms had become more severe. Pacquiao DOES NOT call the shots. He's not the draw!

1. if floyd accepted 14 days, then why is it no longer acceptable? people NEVER answer that question.
2. i won't debate on who calls the shots or not, but one fact remains: unless BOTH fighters face each other, NEITHER will find true closure. Floyd will forever be considered a coward, and Pac will forever have the question of steroids attached to his name.

What's hilarious is that you are attempting to justify Pacquiao's stance using PED science! HGH and steroids are NOT the only ways of cheating. ****, there's even blood doping, which by conventional methods would go undetected! There are literally dozens of way to dope, but random USADA methods are the best chance for fairness. Its all about Manny taking a supposed moral stance against fairness!

funny you mentioned blood doping. do you know how those who used it were caught? when people noticed certain athletes had unusual puncture wounds in their forearms. yes, blood doping requires ridiculously large needles to use.

you do realize that tests only find chemicals which they are designed to detect right? those so called other ways of cheating possibly using different chemicals or agents WON'T BE DETECTED IF THEY ARE UNKNOWN IN THE FIRST PLACE. in other words, floyd's vaunted blood tests won't detect them. in fact, at the time floyd championed those blood tests, those tests had a dismal track record of catching a total of less than THREE cheats in the hundreds of tests they took.

in other words, the ONLY thing those blood tests have over urine tests is that they can detect HGH. and even then, its reliability is in serious doubt.

Is Conte a Mayweather advisor? Do you not see a conflict of interests here? The CEO of BALCO is advising Floyd to take a fight where his opponent may be receiving product from Conte himself! Conte is not out of the game. He simply has made claims to have gone "legitimate". Using Conte's word as "law" in matters like these makes about as much sense as appointing a former CEO of Philip Morris as the Surgeon General.

Conte's insight into PEDs is always worth listening to, but if you think that Conte has or ever will reveal all his secrets then you aren't that bright. Conte peddled PEDs. Yet he is now some top nutritionist? What kind of marshmallows is he putting in his client's cocoa?

tell that to floyd who APPROACHED HIM FOR ADVICE. besides, if you put it that way, then NO TEST could ever detect all those unknown secret agents and EVERYONE, INCLUDING FLOYD can now be accused of taking PEDS.

for all you know, this is simply some elaborate scheme from floyd to take away attention from him who'se actually the one taking PEDS and to put the limelight to Manny. heck, we might as well do away with tests altogether then!

who is more credible in determining the effectiveness of tests. those who made the tests, or the one who was able to fly circles around those tests and cheat it for YEARS?

or would you rather trust floyd?


N/A

Outstanding. You, an ardent Pacquiao supporter, have just admitted that it was Pacquiao who has held up the mega fight for years by refusing to negotiate in good faith. Pacquiao and Arum have made every excuse to remove blame from their side for this fight not happening, but a hardcore Pacquiao supporter like you has found the integrity to admit that the real obstacle standing in the way of this fight getting done for years is Manny Pacquiao himself.

Thank you for your honesty. Most *******s ... I mean pacfans, don't have the character for such candor. I applaud you.

thank you. but though i say Pac is partially responsible for the fight not happening, I BLAME FLOYD AS WELL.

Littlemac is pretty cool to converse with, huh? Especially when he's crushing the dreams of fanatics with facts and figures. Those are my favorite posts by him.

i don't savor crushing dreams. there is enough pain and suffering in the world as it is. i prefer sharing ideas with those who are willing to listen and hope those who are hardheaded and foolish change their minds (just like Pac and Floyd)