Where does Tyson rank on the all time Heavyweight List

[czars_salad]

Where do you think Tyson ranks among the best heavyweights of all time

among the greatest quitters of all time

[JUYJUY]

Youngest Ever Heavyweight Champion
First Man To Ever Unify The Heavyweight Title
Regained The World Titles After Being Imprisoned

He cleared out the HW division in the 1980's, which was the best era of HW's in history in my honest opinion. You had great depth, even the likes of Tony Tubbs had great skills and he won't be remembered as a top-five fighter of the 1980's yet he was very competent. The 1970's showed a rusty Ali, a rusty Frazier and a one-dimensional Foreman. The 1990's showed a fat bald Grandad coming back to win the titles, and the best of the 90's was fatty Bowe closely followed by Moorer. In the 1980's, Tyson was King and he was just a Kid. People preferred to pay to watch Ali watch Larry Holmes than to pay to watch Larry Holmes. But when Tyson came along, he saved a dying sport and we cannot thank him enough for that.

An undefeated Michael Spinks would of won every round against Lennox Lewis (beat Holmes twice on points, Holmes clearly beat Mercer in the 90's, Mercer clearly beat Lewis in the 90's). An undefeated Tony Tucker would of won every round against Lennox Lewis (almost did beat Lewis six years past his best and a shadow of his former self). Mike overcome adversity to defeat Tucker and Spinks, he was the underdog in those fights but he beat them EASY. Pinklon Thomas was WBC Champ in the 1980's, he was an awesome fighter, but Mike beat him EASY. Mike beat Larry Holmes EASY. Mike was never even close to being hurt from 1985-1988 while he was still at the Catskills with Rooney in his corner. Infact, he was never even close to even being caught cleanly in 35 fights. But when he fired everybody in 1988 and had all his no end of problems - he deteriorated. He was a shadow of his former self in his first fight without Rooney (Bruno 89) and the end was near, he didn't even train for the Bruno fight and had lost all his hunger by then. The end was near from June 1988 onwards.. infact, that WAS the end, it was the end of an era.

In terms of actual physical ability, a 20-year-old Tyson is tops. The guy's hand speed was breathtaking, he was so fast and skilled, his punching accuracy was breathtaking, he NEVER tired, his sharpness was out of this world, his combinations were frightening, his jab was awesome, his body shots were extremely sapping, and his defence was the best ever.

[JUYJUY]

You cannot deny that no fighter in history carried the invinciblity factor that Tyson carried in his prime, you had to of lived in that era to realise. Mike was genuinely seen as invincible, like no other. When he came along, he caught public imagination like nobody else had done.

[JUYJUY]

If you watch the Tucker Vs Douglas fight in 1987 (when Douglas was good) and then watch the Holyfield Vs Lewis fight in 1999, you'll see clearly that the standard in the 1980's was much higher. The HW's evolved in the 1990's, Holyfield and Lewis were using tonnes of steroids and were just muscle-bound sacks of **** relying on strength. But when you look back at, for example, the Tucker-Douglas IBF fight in 87, you'll see much quicker and more accurate punches and better quality combinations etc. Yes I admit, the HW's in the 80's were much smaller and weaker (Tyson was 215 back then and didn't use weights), but better quality.

[JUYJUY]

Mike back then was also more composed, more patient, a much better physical specimen and a much better athlete from the aggressive, overly-musclular idiot of the 1990's onwards (not to mention a much better man, too).

But from Bruno 89 onwards he became a one-punch-hoping freakshow. Though back when he was with Rooney, he was a combination puncher. There's a clear difference, you see the 1990's freakshow following through with each punch (one-punch-power) but you see the 1980's superstar naturally bringing his arm back quickly after connecting to set himself for follow-up punches. His punches were sharp and accurate back then, rather than just one-punch-hopefuls. He had guys crumbling in front of him because his punches were that quick and stunning, but back then when a guy that Mike hit crumbled down you always had Mike ready for follow-ups or following up after the guy had gone down (punching thin air as the guy was falling because he was so quick at getting set into the position for a combination). He was unbeatable!

But he literally just stopped training from June 1988 onwards (after he split from Rooney), and didn't ever train right again. You also have to take into account the fact that he was suicidal after his divorce, he smashed his car into a tree in a suicide attempt in the winter of 88.

[solo1bc]

JuyJuy - your replying to yourself mate!

First sign of madness!

Nicely laid out post though.. If I could work out the karma/rep thing I'd give you some..

Agree with you that Tyson was good for the sport but still disagree that he was better than Frazier, Foreman or Ali.. How can you say Foreman was 1 dimensional next to Tyson? Two big hooks were the extent of his arsenal!

I don't think you can say Lewis was a muscle bound bag of **** either... watch his fights mate... the man had skills!

[JUYJUY]

Two big hooks were the extent of his arsenal!

Please tell me that your joking, maybe you haven't seen a sharp Tyson from 85-88?

[tri4ben2]

Tyson would have been considered the best ever if he either died and had not lost to Douglas, or was undefeateed before he went to prison.

Was Tyson ever the best ever? No

Was he the most exciting fighter for almost two decades, possibly ever? Yes

Would he have had a punchers chance against anyone in history? Yes.

Would 9 out of 10 all time greats finished him within 15 rounds? Yes

Does his fight last night change what he did 15 years ago? No

Will the disturbed people who as of last night thought that he could beat Byrd, Ruiz, and Brewster and be a beltholder again change their mind? Unfortunatly not

[JUYJUY]

Was Tyson ever the best ever? No

Yes he was.

[JUYJUY]

Would 9 out of 10 all time greats finished him within 15 rounds? Yes

No chance whatsoever.