Comments Thread For: James Toney Too Risky For Vitali Klitschko, Says Goossen

[Tiozzo]

On the other hand, a 2003 version of Vitali would put any version of Toney in the grave.

Nobody puts James Toney to the grave. A 2003 version of Vitali was better, but not enough to dominate Toney.

[Clyde Barrow]

Vitali would murder Toney.

[Tiozzo]

Vitali ain't boring. Wlad's had a couple of boring fights -- no different than Lennox Lewis or Holyfield or most other top heavies -- and some idiots blame Vitali for them. Vitali comes to fight, baby. Always.

Vitali is boring because of his style, not because he doesn't come to fight. He uses his reach, keeps his upper body bent backwards to avoid incoming punches, and he moves like some fish out of the water. So it makes for boring fights. To this day, Byrd is one the fighters who were the most effective against Vitali, so it's not hard to believe the Toney of 2003 beats up Vitali.

[Dave Rado]

To this day, Byrd is one the fighters who were the most effective against Vitali, so it's not hard to believe the Toney of 2003 beats up Vitali.

Yeah, right. The scores at the end of the Byrd fight were:

Judge: Melvina Lathan 83-88 in favour of Vitali
Judge: Ruben Garcia Dr. 82-89 in favour of Vitali
Judge: Joachim Jacobsen 83-88 in favour of Vitali

Byrd was totally ineffective.

[Tiozzo]

Yeah, right. The scores at the end of the Byrd fight were:

Judge: Melvina Lathan 83-88 in favour of Vitali
Judge: Ruben Garcia Dr. 82-89 in favour of Vitali
Judge: Joachim Jacobsen 83-88 in favour of Vitali

Byrd was totally ineffective.

If you knew what you were talking about, you would know the scoring doesn't always reflect what happened during the course of the fight (hell no). With that said, yes, Vitali was winning the fight. I haven't said Byrd was winning, I said he was one of the most effective fighters against Vitali. Byrd was making Vitali miss a whole lot, and he landed some good punches of his own. Take a look at the punch stats, you'll see it was a closer fight than the scoring indicates. Byrd was effective at what he was doing. I hope you actually haven't watched the fight to make such a silly and unaccurate comment.

[edgarg]

Vitali is boring because of his style, not because he doesn't come to fight. He uses his reach, keeps his upper body bent backwards to avoid incoming punches, and he moves like some fish out of the water. So it makes for boring fights. To this day, Byrd is one the fighters who were the most effective against Vitali, so it's not hard to believe the Toney of 2003 beats up Vitali.

The only thig which prevented Klitschko from utterly destroying Byrd was the fact that he tore his rotator cuff in the second round. As it was was, the only thing which kept Byrd inside the ring for 9 rounds were the ropes.

[Tiozzo]

Yeah, right. The scores at the end of the Byrd fight were:

Judge: Melvina Lathan 83-88 in favour of Vitali
Judge: Ruben Garcia Dr. 82-89 in favour of Vitali
Judge: Joachim Jacobsen 83-88 in favour of Vitali

Byrd was totally ineffective.

Here are the punch stats of Byrd vs Vitali at the end of round 8.

Vitali landed 116 out of 436 punches = 26 %
Byrd landed 100 of 246 punches = 41 %

So yes, we can see, with the help of evidence, how right you are : Byrd was totally ineffective with 41 % of his punches landed and only 16 landed punches less in total than Vitali. You rock.

In round 9, Byrd landed 24 out of 38 punches = 63 %
Vitali landed 17 of 66 = 26 %

Then Vitali, ahead on the score cards, elected to quit because of an injury.

Again, you are right : Byrd was totally ineffective.

[Tiozzo]

The only thig which prevented Klitschko from utterly destroying Byrd was the fact that he tore his rotator cuff in the second round. As it was was, the only thing which kept Byrd inside the ring for 9 rounds were the ropes.

Excuses. Byrd was in the fight all along thanks to his slickness, skills and speed. The comment about the ropes is very inaccurate too. The fight happened in the middle of the ring and Byrd, at times, was the aggressor, backing Vitali up. Vitali is a *****, as he has shown when he quit like a ***** ahead on the scorecards instead of enduring the pain and fighting on.

''It hurts too much.'' - Vitali

Vitali has a thing or 2 to learn from Jean Pascal about heart.

[nomadman]

It would be a massacre at this stage of Toney's career, he needs to retire not fight a guy who weighs in at 250 lbs

Is that Toney in your av?

[ChopperRead]

Vitali is boring because of his style, not because he doesn't come to fight. He uses his reach, keeps his upper body bent backwards to avoid incoming punches, and he moves like some fish out of the water. So it makes for boring fights. To this day, Byrd is one the fighters who were the most effective against Vitali, so it's not hard to believe the Toney of 2003 beats up Vitali.

I find it very hard to believe.

As the Klitschkos are so dominant and therefore hard to legitimately find fault with, one argument that always recurs with people who just plain resent them (especially in the US) is that they are "boring." The reason for this is that it's impossible for anyone to prove otherwise, as being "boring" is a totally subjective thing. You can't truthfully say they aren't great athletes, that they aren't winners, that they duck people, because they don't. All that's really left is to call them "boring."

Personally, I don't find Vitali "boring" at all. I thought his win over Arreola, for instance, was a masterpiece of intelligent yet still brutally effective boxing, a smart veteran fighting at the height of his powers. But that's why they have different brands of cereal in the supermarket: choice. If you don't like watching Vitali, you can always choose not to do so. Trying to argue against people who say he's "boring" is a waste of time. All I can say is, if you think Vitali is "boring," just wait until he retires and see how exciting the division is without him.