Rocky Marciano Statue To Be Built By The WBC

[Spray_resistant]

Blah blah.....overrated Marciano.....Blah blah they should have made a statue of: insert random black American HW- other posters in this thread.

[ShoulderRoll]

Blah blah.....overrated Marciano.....Blah blah they should have made a statue of: insert random black American HW- other posters in this thread.

Hey, jackass, if you want a great white heayweight you didn't go far back enough to the greatest one, Jack Dempsey.

Where is his statue? I guess he doesn't deserve one because he wasn't undefeated.

Skin color has nothing to do with it.

[Ravens Fan]

All right I will put my 2 cents in the pot. All I keep hearing is that Marciano fought either fighters that were old or just plain bums. I did a little research and this is what I came up with. I did not do all his opponents because, well I am lazy so I checked the ages of Rocky's last fourteen opponents. And I am only going to put the year of their birth. Rocky was born in 1923 and his opponents, in no particular order, were born in the following years 1928,1922, 1914, 1915, 1922, 1925, 1922, 1914, 1927, 1921, 1928 and 1916. I am no math whizz but to me it does not look like he was beating up on to many old men. There are also many that claim Rocky's record was padded. Well, again I only checked his last fourteen opponents and their combined record was 896-151-38. I must say that is not to shabby by anyone's standards

One other issue that keeps being stated is that Rocky beat up on smaller men. Do I really need to address this issue? I guess I will. I will just ask one question. What was the average weight of a heavyweight in the late 1940's and into the early 1950's, maybe 185 pounds or so? And what is the limit on light heavyweights 175? So what do you think the walking around weight would have been for those so called smaller guys. Maybe in the 195 to 200 pound range. I know Marciano fought most of his fights in the 185 range so does anyone really believe he had a big advantage over fighters that came up from light heavy that most likely even had a longer reach then his?

As far as who he fought, who else was he supposed to fight? He did what most up and comers do by beating an old champ like Louis. As far as him fighting Walcott, who else could he have fought to win the title, his barber? And a tough fight it was and then he gives him a rematch as he also did after the first tough fight with Charles who happened to be only two years older then Rocky. And those fights just happen to be ring classics. Someone also stated that ****ell was the British Light Heavy champ and he was. But, he was also the British World Heavyweight champ. As far as Moore is concerned he fought Rocky in 1955 and successfully defended his Light Heavyweight championship for the last time six years later. He was like an earlier version of Bernard Hopkins. Someone also mentioned that the ref in the Moore Marciano fight gave Rocky a brake when Moore knocked him down. I did not want to make any rash statements so I watched it myself on You Tube, thank God for the internet. And between the time Rocky went down and Moore was back on him 5 seconds elapsed. To be honest I was maybe expecting a mini version of the famous Dempsey long count but it was over before I even started counting. I also encourage you all to watch it yourself. And the poster of that statement also forgot to mention that Moore was punished and knocked down five times before Rocky stopped him.

In closing I will give you my personal opinion of Rocky Marciano. I am not going to debate where Rocky falls in the line of great champs. But I believe he belongs in at least the top 15. But to me it really does have anything to do with that. Because, when I think of Rocky I don't think of jab and move or for that fact anything fancy. I think of a man with short arms with plenty of power with a huge heart that beat all comers. And honestly what I believe made Rocky great was that he was obviously in great shape and what he lacked in skill he made up with that huge heart. And if you need an example of someone who had all the skill to have been a great Heavyweight Champ but lacked the heart see one Buster Douglas.

[Spray_resistant]

Hey, jackass, if you want a great white heayweight you didn't go far back enough to the greatest one, Jack Dempsey.

Where is his statue? I guess he doesn't deserve one because he wasn't undefeated.

Skin color has nothing to do with it.

Can't we just say good for him and leave it at that.....no need to give obviously biased reasons to discredit him in this thread.....there are many many fighters who deserve statues including Dempsey, Ail, and many others......posters on here are to critical and negative....

[The Hammer]

Blah blah.....overrated Marciano.....Blah blah they should have made a statue of: insert random black American HW- other posters in this thread.

Exactly...

[The Hammer]

All right I will put my 2 cents in the pot. All I keep hearing is that Marciano fought either fighters that were old or just plain bums. I did a little research and this is what I came up with. I did not do all his opponents because, well I am lazy so I checked the ages of Rocky's last fourteen opponents. And I am only going to put the year of their birth. Rocky was born in 1923 and his opponents, in no particular order, were born in the following years 1928,1922, 1914, 1915, 1922, 1925, 1922, 1914, 1927, 1921, 1928 and 1916. I am no math whizz but to me it does not look like he was beating up on to many old men. There are also many that claim Rocky's record was padded. Well, again I only checked his last fourteen opponents and their combined record was 896-151-38. I must say that is not to shabby by anyone's standards

One other issue that keeps being stated is that Rocky beat up on smaller men. Do I really need to address this issue? I guess I will. I will just ask one question. What was the average weight of a heavyweight in the late 1940's and into the early 1950's, maybe 185 pounds or so? And what is the limit on light heavyweights 175? So what do you think the walking around weight would have been for those so called smaller guys. Maybe in the 195 to 200 pound range. I know Marciano fought most of his fights in the 185 range so does anyone really believe he had a big advantage over fighters that came up from light heavy that most likely even had a longer reach then his?

As far as who he fought, who else was he supposed to fight? He did what most up and comers do by beating an old champ like Louis. As far as him fighting Walcott, who else could he have fought to win the title, his barber? And a tough fight it was and then he gives him a rematch as he also did after the first tough fight with Charles who happened to be only two years older then Rocky. And those fights just happen to be ring classics. Someone also stated that ****ell was the British Light Heavy champ and he was. But, he was also the British World Heavyweight champ. As far as Moore is concerned he fought Rocky in 1955 and successfully defended his Light Heavyweight championship for the last time six years later. He was like an earlier version of Bernard Hopkins. Someone also mentioned that the ref in the Moore Marciano fight gave Rocky a brake when Moore knocked him down. I did not want to make any rash statements so I watched it myself on You Tube, thank God for the internet. And between the time Rocky went down and Moore was back on him 5 seconds elapsed. To be honest I was maybe expecting a mini version of the famous Dempsey long count but it was over before I even started counting. I also encourage you all to watch it yourself. And the poster of that statement also forgot to mention that Moore was punished and knocked down five times before Rocky stopped him.

In closing I will give you my personal opinion of Rocky Marciano. I am not going to debate where Rocky falls in the line of great champs. But I believe he belongs in at least the top 15. But to me it really does have anything to do with that. Because, when I think of Rocky I don't think of jab and move or for that fact anything fancy. I think of a man with short arms with plenty of power with a huge heart that beat all comers. And honestly what I believe made Rocky great was that he was obviously in great shape and what he lacked in skill he made up with that huge heart. And if you need an example of someone who had all the skill to have been a great Heavyweight Champ but lacked the heart see one Buster Douglas.

Excellent post! Best post I've seen on boxingscene in 2009.

[MexicanMauler]

[edgarg]

All right I will put my 2 cents in the pot. All I keep hearing is that Marciano fought either fighters that were old or just plain bums. I did a little research and this is what I came up with. I did not do all his opponents because, well I am lazy so I checked the ages of Rocky's last fourteen opponents. And I am only going to put the year of their birth. Rocky was born in 1923 and his opponents, in no particular order, were born in the following years 1928,1922, 1914, 1915, 1922, 1925, 1922, 1914, 1927, 1921, 1928 and 1916. I am no math whizz but to me it does not look like he was beating up on to many old men. There are also many that claim Rocky's record was padded. Well, again I only checked his last fourteen opponents and their combined record was 896-151-38. I must say that is not to shabby by anyone's standards

One other issue that keeps being stated is that Rocky beat up on smaller men. Do I really need to address this issue? I guess I will. I will just ask one question. What was the average weight of a heavyweight in the late 1940's and into the early 1950's, maybe 185 pounds or so? And what is the limit on light heavyweights 175? So what do you think the walking around weight would have been for those so called smaller guys. Maybe in the 195 to 200 pound range. I know Marciano fought most of his fights in the 185 range so does anyone really believe he had a big advantage over fighters that came up from light heavy that most likely even had a longer reach then his?

As far as who he fought, who else was he supposed to fight? He did what most up and comers do by beating an old champ like Louis. As far as him fighting Walcott, who else could he have fought to win the title, his barber? And a tough fight it was and then he gives him a rematch as he also did after the first tough fight with Charles who happened to be only two years older then Rocky. And those fights just happen to be ring classics. Someone also stated that ****ell was the British Light Heavy champ and he was. But, he was also the British World Heavyweight champ. As far as Moore is concerned he fought Rocky in 1955 and successfully defended his Light Heavyweight championship for the last time six years later. He was like an earlier version of Bernard Hopkins. Someone also mentioned that the ref in the Moore Marciano fight gave Rocky a brake when Moore knocked him down. I did not want to make any rash statements so I watched it myself on You Tube, thank God for the internet. And between the time Rocky went down and Moore was back on him 5 seconds elapsed. To be honest I was maybe expecting a mini version of the famous Dempsey long count but it was over before I even started counting. I also encourage you all to watch it yourself. And the poster of that statement also forgot to mention that Moore was punished and knocked down five times before Rocky stopped him.

In closing I will give you my personal opinion of Rocky Marciano. I am not going to debate where Rocky falls in the line of great champs. But I believe he belongs in at least the top 15. But to me it really does have anything to do with that. Because, when I think of Rocky I don't think of jab and move or for that fact anything fancy. I think of a man with short arms with plenty of power with a huge heart that beat all comers. And honestly what I believe made Rocky great was that he was obviously in great shape and what he lacked in skill he made up with that huge heart. And if you need an example of someone who had all the skill to have been a great Heavyweight Champ but lacked the heart see one Buster Douglas.

It's easy to see that you can write a great letter, but you are either obfuscating the REAL qualities that count in matchups, or else don't know much about boxing. However that's no crime.

Sorry to disappoint you, but ****ell was NOT British World Heavyweight Champion, He was English, and at one time also British Empire Lt heavyweight champ. He suffered from glandular problems and food gorging, and his weight ballooned up to well over 200-220 lbs. He was an average good fighter, with a shaky jaw who was always [well...nearly always] being KD, even though he'win. It was his heart that was a world champion. ****ell used to sometimes have as many as a dozen fights a year or thereabouts, and by the time he fought Rocky, was on the verge of retirement. That qualified him as a Rocky opponent. He may have had another fight or two, but was actually finished. I met ****ell in London, and he was a nice guy.

The term BBBof C, which seems to have misled you, stands for British Boxing Board of Control. Lee Savold was as worn as an old shoe, and had many tough fights. By losing to, and beating, Bruce Wood**** he "qualified as a Rocky opponent, basically dragged out of a well earned retirement. Wood****, was one of those china chinned British horizontal heavyweights. I actually saw both of those fights.

I can't remember enough of your letter to do it full justice, but, facts are facts. Truth is truth, not what you want it to be.

I don't give a tinker's flute for the ages of Rocky's opponents. How I judge a Rocky win over someone, depends on (to some degree) age, but mostly records, who THEIR opponents were that made up their records, and how many tough fights they had had.
You may have noticed that Rocky fought a guy named Ross, who had a sparkling record, a great opponent to beat you might say, but.........look at Ross's own record of opponents. From memory I think that in his first 14 fights, 10 had had NO fights, another 3 had won ONE fight [one guy was 1-13) and the last of the 14 HIS record was 15-27. When you look at these stiffs opponents you arrive at the conclusion to "forget about it". Many oif Rocky's "opponents" had similiar records.

It matters little that there were a few great fighters in Rocky's resume; except for Archie Moore, they were so worn out and sick, they should have been in nursing homes. Louis had been in and out of sanitariums, used to lock himself in his apartment and hide under the table, Ezzard Charles, a natural lt. heavy was not that old, in today's terms but in those days with well over a hundred fights, some of which were very tough, was as spent -in boxing terms- as an half empty long opened bottle of 7up.
He died from Lou Gehrigs disease at a young age, acerbated by the heavy punishment he took against bigger, stronger men. I think that in his 4 fights before Rocky, he'd lost 2, one being against Harold Johnson, whom he outweighed by about 10lbs. I think Harold beat him several times. Harold is one of the best "forgotten lt. heavyweights ever. But then, so was Ezzard Charles. It all depends on what period in the careers they fought, and how worn out either was. And I'm telling you that Ezz was finished in CAPITALS, when he gave Rocky those 2 very tough fights.

What I AM saying, and can prove, if anyone has the patience and interest in bothering to read, is that Rocky didn't fight a really live, at his peak heavyweight in his whole career.

[edgarg]

Ravens Buddy writes;

"And the poster of that statement also forgot to mention that Moore was punished and knocked down five times before Rocky stopped him".
************************************************** ********

No "this poster" did NOT forget to mention that Moore was down several times you just didn't read my letter properly. It's stated quite plainly, in simple language.......

Just one quick question......./ If two guys are fighting, both aged ,say 27, one has had 25-30 fights all wins and he happens to have a good chin and a tolerance for punishment, as well as a KO punch, (not to forget that he attacks his opponent with everything but" the kitchen sink") and
the other has had maybe 150 fights with about 35 losses including 18 KO's, would it surprise you if the fresher man won???

This is just a made-up example.

[The Hammer]

Ravens Buddy writes;

"And the poster of that statement also forgot to mention that Moore was punished and knocked down five times before Rocky stopped him".

No "this poster" did NOT forget to mention that Moore was down several times you just didn't read my letter properly. It's stated quite plainly, in simple language.......

This is just a made-up example.

Did you have a problem with Muhammed Ali fighting Archie Moore eight years later?

Archie was old in 1963 when he fought Ali, but he was still close to his prime in 1955. Current example: Vitali may be age 38 but is obviously still very good.

I find it difficult to understand why any boxing enthusiast would discredit and bash a great boxer like Rocky Marciano.