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NSB PICK EM 2025: ROUND 1. PICK EM #17 - #20: SATURDAY 1st MARCH

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  • #31
    Crocker, DEC, Close
    Puello, DEC, clear
    Russell, ko late
    Davis, KO, 9​
    Last edited by eco1; 03-01-2025, 08:55 PM.

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    • #32
      edpboxing

      Donovan, DEC, clear
      Puello, DEC, close
      Russell, DEC, close
      Davis, KO, late

      Comment


      • #33
        Originally posted by HisExcellency View Post
        PICK EM CREW Tatabanya Joseph Citizen Koba

        Firstly, BIG RESPECT to you guys for Pick 'Em - it's a great, fun way for forum users to test their boxing knowledge against each other and I appreciate the hard work you guys put into organising it. Sht can't be easy!

        However, like I mentioned to Tata the other week, personally I feel that the multiplier spoils the game because it SKEWS the results. For example, if you look at the table as it stands right now, the guys at the top have used up almost all of their multipliers as opposed to the guys at the bottom. Kudos to them for picking wisely but they're so far ahead of the competition that it's going to be extremely difficult for everybody else to catch up (unless they also pick the right multipliers).

        Therefore, I propose creating 2 tables:- one with the results of the multiplier and one without. Whilst I appreciate that this is a LOT of work and will probably take some time to put together, issuing 2 tables would give a better indication as to who has truly made the correct number of picks over a given time period. For example, in Football (Soccer), teams are awarded 3 points for every victory but you don't earn bonus points (akin to a multiplier) for beating a stronger opponent or scoring 'X' number of goals. Therefore, I believe that Pick 'Em should work in the same way.
        Thanks for your comments man, as mentioned by Tat above the conversation has been had before, I won't delve into the history here although if you look in the still stickied 2024 Masterthread you'll find near the bottom links to the previous Masterthreads going back to 2018 and somewhere in the archives or in the threads themselves also the links to associated pre-season discussion threads where we canvass players over proposed rule changes and ideas that they may want to see included or whatever. There's been plenty of lively discussion over the years about all aspects of the game rules and scoring balance and so on. We did in fact have a more comprehensive scoring system up until 2022 including far more detail such as correct pick totals, longest streaks, total picks and correct pick % and so on...

        https://www.boxingscene.com/forums/b...2-masterthread

        At that time I was also including an individual table for the result from each week, points scored, multipliers used etc for the resord and for the purposes of redundancy and back checking for errors and so on..

        https://www.boxingscene.com/forums/b...6#post31296606

        https://www.boxingscene.com/forums/b...1#post31296611

        End of the day I got no issues with your proposal, and using the old comprehensive scoring system most of the info could have been relatively easily pulled out anyway, but what it boiled down to in the end was simply a matter of the time involved, when I took over the running of the Pick Em in 2018 and right through COVID I had a lot more time on my hands, but these last few years I just had a lot more stuff going on IRL and dedicating 3 or 4 hours each week to running the PIck Em was simply no longer an option and I nearly threw in the towel altogether.

        Thankfully Tat stepped up to the plate to keep up with the scoring using a more managable and streamlined system and MikeyG took over the video links (now taken over at least temporarily by Joseph) which allowed us to keep it running and the half hour or so it takes each week to put up threads is something I'm willing to keep on doing even though I probably only watch one major card a month these days.

        Ha ha - in short I ain't willing to put in the extra time (even typing this post is cutting into time I'm suppossed to be working on my college assignment due in next week)... but I also got no objections whatsoever if someone else, even Your Excellency yourself wishes to do so.

        Two main suggestions either a) start drumming up support and / or canvassing opinion with the other players and / or b) start keeping your own personal tally of w/l and points scored and pick percentage sans multipliers. Once you got a spreadsheet set up ought to take no more than 20 mins or so to fill in the results most weeks since the multipliers (both optional and underdog) add an extra layer of complexity.

        If Tat wishes to add to his workload he could add that in too I guess, but like all of us he also has other pressures on his time and I wouldn't presume for second to ask him to do any more than he already does - TBH without him this thing wouldn't still be going at all.

        EDIT: Last thing I would say though is I been running this game a long time now, and I would say that the multipliers do tend to even out over time... countless times we seen players storm into early season leads just to get gradually reeled back in over the course of the season - it's that Tortoise and Hare story - do you throw all in on your multipliers early to establish a commanding lead or save them to spend em when the best opportunites come up throughout the season? What I've found over the years is that as often as not it's the 'tortoises' that end up at the top of the table when the dust settles...

        The dynamic may have shifted over the last two years since we split the 12 month season into quadrimestres and TBH I haven't been giving it the attention to really keep track on how that's affected play balance but if nothing else it might be worth opening the discussion over whether we want to keep with the 4 month seasons or return to single 12 month annual game since a large part of the rationale for the change was related to to the Prize incentives being offered by the previous mangement of the site which appear to be no longer forthcoming.

        Bear in mind that the wise use of multipliers is itself a reflection of skill and knowledge - it's a means of reflecting and rewarding your level of confidence in a particular underdog prediction - it's more a matter of how heavily you want to lean on gamesmanship and how heavily just on pure accuracy, over the years we've established a balance that's (I think) mostly reflected the views of the player base at any given time, but as the player base gradually changes so too can sentiment so there's no good reason these issues can't be raised over again, main thing is to try to ensure most players are getting the kind of game they would enjoy the most.

        Comment


        • #34
          Originally posted by Tatabanya View Post

          For one, I would agree with the removal of the multipliers. But I feel like we are in a minority. This issue has already been discussed in the past, and I think that after your post the discussion will be reignited. What do you think, people?
          Although probably right - ie no multiples = better idea of who is better picker - I'm against it
          a/ this is a GAME so the multiples add intrigue and an element of fortune and that helps with intrigue
          b/ people at bottom of table ave the same multipliers as those at top, we've often seen late runs from bottom of table
          c/ not having multiples you could kind of game the cop by just picking the favourite all the time - only with the SAudi cards have we seen a plethora of even matchups
          BigBobArum HisExcellency likes this.

          Comment


          • #35
            I get Excellency's point about multipliers, and a percentage bracket showing the actual best without multipliers could be intriguing, but at the end of the day, everyone has the same amount and whether a person uses a multiplier or not when picking correctly, they still picked correctly. Anyone at the bottom has the same chance.

            I'm all for the addition of a purer system, but as I am now only a couple of points away from commanding the lead, I say keep the multipliers. Haha.

            Comment


            • #36
              I will add that I lurked here for almost ten years before I decided to actually join and post, and I never even paid attention to the game until around 2023 or 2024, so I am still learning some of the nuance, especially now that I am helping out with it.
              BigBobArum HisExcellency likes this.

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              • #37
                ShoulderRoll:

                Crocker, DEC, CLOSE
                Martin, DEC, CLOSE, x2
                Valenzuela, DEC, CLOSE
                Davis, KO, LATE

                Comment


                • #38
                  Originally posted by Joseph View Post
                  I will add that I lurked here for almost ten years before I decided to actually join and post, and I never even paid attention to the game until around 2023 or 2024, so I am still learning some of the nuance, especially now that I am helping out with it.
                  You've certainly mastered the multipliers that's for sure...next time you place one I'm gonna copy!
                  JosephHH Joseph likes this.

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Originally posted by Citizen Koba View Post

                    Thanks for your comments man, as mentioned by Tat above the conversation has been had before, I won't delve into the history here although if you look in the still stickied 2024 Masterthread you'll find near the bottom links to the previous Masterthreads going back to 2018 and somewhere in the archives or in the threads themselves also the links to associated pre-season discussion threads where we canvass players over proposed rule changes and ideas that they may want to see included or whatever. There's been plenty of lively discussion over the years about all aspects of the game rules and scoring balance and so on. We did in fact have a more comprehensive scoring system up until 2022 including far more detail such as correct pick totals, longest streaks, total picks and correct pick % and so on...

                    https://www.boxingscene.com/forums/b...2-masterthread

                    At that time I was also including an individual table for the result from each week, points scored, multipliers used etc for the resord and for the purposes of redundancy and back checking for errors and so on..

                    https://www.boxingscene.com/forums/b...6#post31296606

                    https://www.boxingscene.com/forums/b...1#post31296611

                    End of the day I got no issues with your proposal, and using the old comprehensive scoring system most of the info could have been relatively easily pulled out anyway, but what it boiled down to in the end was simply a matter of the time involved, when I took over the running of the Pick Em in 2018 and right through COVID I had a lot more time on my hands, but these last few years I just had a lot more stuff going on IRL and dedicating 3 or 4 hours each week to running the PIck Em was simply no longer an option and I nearly threw in the towel altogether.

                    Thankfully Tat stepped up to the plate to keep up with the scoring using a more managable and streamlined system and MikeyG took over the video links (now taken over at least temporarily by Joseph) which allowed us to keep it running and the half hour or so it takes each week to put up threads is something I'm willing to keep on doing even though I probably only watch one major card a month these days.

                    Ha ha - in short I ain't willing to put in the extra time (even typing this post is cutting into time I'm suppossed to be working on my college assignment due in next week)... but I also got no objections whatsoever if someone else, even Your Excellency yourself wishes to do so.

                    Two main suggestions either a) start drumming up support and / or canvassing opinion with the other players and / or b) start keeping your own personal tally of w/l and points scored and pick percentage sans multipliers. Once you got a spreadsheet set up ought to take no more than 20 mins or so to fill in the results most weeks since the multipliers (both optional and underdog) add an extra layer of complexity.

                    If Tat wishes to add to his workload he could add that in too I guess, but like all of us he also has other pressures on his time and I wouldn't presume for second to ask him to do any more than he already does - TBH without him this thing wouldn't still be going at all.

                    EDIT: Last thing I would say though is I been running this game a long time now, and I would say that the multipliers do tend to even out over time... countless times we seen players storm into early season leads just to get gradually reeled back in over the course of the season - it's that Tortoise and Hare story - do you throw all in on your multipliers early to establish a commanding lead or save them to spend em when the best opportunites come up throughout the season? What I've found over the years is that as often as not it's the 'tortoises' that end up at the top of the table when the dust settles...

                    The dynamic may have shifted over the last two years since we split the 12 month season into quadrimestres and TBH I haven't been giving it the attention to really keep track on how that's affected play balance but if nothing else it might be worth opening the discussion over whether we want to keep with the 4 month seasons or return to single 12 month annual game since a large part of the rationale for the change was related to to the Prize incentives being offered by the previous mangement of the site which appear to be no longer forthcoming.

                    Bear in mind that the wise use of multipliers is itself a reflection of skill and knowledge - it's a means of reflecting and rewarding your level of confidence in a particular underdog prediction - it's more a matter of how heavily you want to lean on gamesmanship and how heavily just on pure accuracy, over the years we've established a balance that's (I think) mostly reflected the views of the player base at any given time, but as the player base gradually changes so too can sentiment so there's no good reason these issues can't be raised over again, main thing is to try to ensure most players are getting the kind of game they would enjoy the most.
                    Fair enough and thank you for the detailed response...I suspected that it would probably be too time consuming and since I haven't got time to do it myself I can certainly understand your position.

                    Perhaps when this game resets (in a year or season or however long it runs for), you could start the new season of Pick 'Em with 2 tables (including the multiplier and without).

                    Thanks again for the great effort you guys put into running this game. It's appreciated!
                    Last edited by HisExcellency; 03-01-2025, 11:05 AM.
                    Citizen Koba Citizen Koba likes this.

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Mammoth, Donavan, Decision, Clear
                      Mammoth, Puello, Decision, Close
                      Mammoth, Russell, KO, Late
                      Mammoth, Davis, KO, Mid
                      Last edited by Mammoth; 03-01-2025, 12:39 PM.

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