Comments Thread For: Fury 'Not Bothered' by Loss of IBF Title for Rematch With Usyk

[kafkod]

It doesn't matter how he lost the belt the fact remains that he's no longer the undisputed heavyweight champion. It was his choice not to honour his mandatory obligation and relinquish his undisputed status, you can't eat your cake and have it. If AJ didn't honour his mandatory obligation towards him and dropped the belt he wouldn't have been able to fight for the undisputed championship in the first place. Your sentiments or perception do not count in the record books nor has anything to do with the rules of the sport.

And whether he has beaten both guys in the past is totally irrelevant because past results are no guarantee of future results. Sometimes it's all about timing, he fought AJ when he was mentally weak and lacked confidence, it's not an excuse but a well known fact in the boxing community. And that is the main reason why AJ is eager to face him again now. Though I am not saying AJ is going beat him if they fight again but he does have a better chance now to beat him than when they fought in the past.

Usyk is the last undisputed heavyweight champion but he's no longer the undisputed heavyweight champion. That's my point and what the record books say.

He's the man. The lineal champion. The best in the division. The best in the world.

You can call him lots of things... but not the undisputed champion.

He had a mandatory that he isn't facing... and such orders are, well, mandatory. They're mandated. So he's not the IBF champion anymore. That's exactly how it works.

In a boxing context, an undisputed champion is a fighter who holds all the recognised championship belts in his division. According to that definition, Usyk is obviously no longer the undisputed HW champ.

But realistically speaking, Usyk has recently decisively defeated both guys who will be fighting for the IBF title in September. So I think we can safely assume that whoever wins that fight will not be disputing the fact that Usyk is still THE world HW champion. And they won't need to, because they will be fighting the winner of the Usyk/Fury rematch next and all 4 belts will be unified again.

Wtf? you can't write the word "disputing" at this forum without messing around changing text colours, because it contains the name of a certain dastardly Russian politician. Will whoever runs this site now please stop this PC bull****, because it's not even funny any more.

[kafkod]

Undistuted is nice. Play ball with all the hucksters. Noting permanent about it. Usyk lasted a month.
The media made a big deal about it, but thay aren't Boxing guys.
.
Hardened boxing people know that at heavyweight, the linial title is tight. All that matters.

Somebody better mention that to Usyk and his promoter. Because when Krassyuk was asked what the lineal title meant to Usyk, he laughed and said, "Nothing. We don't know what what that means."

[kafkod]

I don’t have any issue. The IBF isn’t wrong in any way.

I just think they have devalued their belt because their rules will end up putting the belt on 2 guys Usyk beat clearly.

Besides, Usyk is seen as the champ regardless.

Another way of looking at it is that the IBF have enhanced their reputation as the only sanctioning organisation that follows its own rules.

[The Big Dunn]

Another way of looking at it is that the IBF have enhanced their reputation as the only sanctioning organisation that follows its own rules.

Fair point, especially since they did this with Usyk and Canelo, 2 prominent fighters.

Still feels like most fans think they have devalued their belt in the each case because the IBF belts in each class will be on undeserving boxers.

[billeau2]

Fair point, especially since they did this with Usyk and Canelo, 2 prominent fighters.

Still feels like most fans think they have devalued their belt in the each case because the IBF belts in each class will be on undeserving boxers.

Alphabet soup will always dilute...

[billeau2]

Nah...Usyk is still the undisputed champion until someone beats him. It really is that simple.

Your getting into an area here where fans are unaware of how special the lineal is... I always site Classical Japanese Martial Art Lineages as another example of the same principle: Instead of some large Burocratic system, where no one is accountable, where a minority decides "who is worthy to defend against", the power of the lineal resides with fans.

The simplicity of a system can be down right elegant: Despite the ways of Japanese institutions... To be a classical Koryu art you simply have to have an unbroken lineage, with a head person, from before the restoration. It is that simple! The lineal has the same simple elegance... Fans determine it and while people go nuts when there is a breach... Why? It always gets re-resolved... It never is a big deal.

[billeau2]

He's the man. The lineal champion. The best in the division. The best in the world.

You can call him lots of things... but not the undisputed champion.

He had a mandatory that he isn't facing... and such orders are, well, mandatory. They're mandated. So he's not the IBF champion anymore. That's exactly how it works.

Technically you are correct, but this is a great example of why we need the lineal to assert itself. These alphabet soups can always ruin a champions reign with their demands and no fans have sanctioned them beyond simply accepting their authority. You will get ignorant folk like who say things like "whoopee they are consistant, they follow their own rules! how nice of them!" Who gave them any authority?! When was it determined we need more agencies in boxing to muck up a champion's reign? what do they do for for the sport? that one, or two of them cannot accomplish?



We give our power away to these authorities... We choose to buy crap made in China... we eat shiat, we let bullies tell us what words to use, where do we draw the line? It is not right! Pollywog is correct... The lineal speaks loud and clear: Usyk has beaten the best!

[kafkod]

Fair point, especially since they did this with Usyk and Canelo, 2 prominent fighters.

Still feels like most fans think they have devalued their belt in the each case because the IBF belts in each class will be on undeserving boxers.

Crawford too. You have to give them credit for being consistent. In the case of the IBF HW belt, stripping Usyk doesn't really matter, in the wider picture, because all 4 belts will be unified again when the Dubois/AJ and Usyk/Fury rematch winners fight each other early next year.

[The Big Dunn]

Crawford too. You have to give them credit for being consistent. In the case of the IBF HW belt, stripping Usyk doesn't really matter, in the wider picture, because all 4 belts will be unified again when the Dubois/AJ and Usyk/Fury rematch winners fight each other early next year.

True but I don’t want to see Usyk v either of them again should he win. He should be able to fight someone new.

It’s only good if Fury and AJ win, and even then to call it a unification bout feels wrong.

[kafkod]

He's the man. The lineal champion. The best in the division. The best in the world.

Your getting into an area here where fans are unaware of how special the lineal is... I always site Classical Japanese Martial Art Lineages as another example of the same principle: Instead of some large Burocratic system, where no one is accountable, where a minority decides "who is worthy to defend against", the power of the lineal resides with fans.

The simplicity of a system can be down right elegant: Despite the ways of Japanese institutions... To be a classical Koryu art you simply have to have an unbroken lineage, with a head person, from before the restoration. It is that simple! The lineal has the same simple elegance... Fans determine it and while people go nuts when there is a breach... Why? It always gets re-resolved... It never is a big deal.

Classical Japanese Martial Arts are one thing. Pro boxing is a different animal altogether.

In boxing, lineal championship status only matters when somebody is looking for either a reason to not fight somebody else or a justification for shafting them in negotiations.

Usyk's promoter said that the lineal title means nothing to Usyk because he doesn't know what it is. When you have the integrity and willingness to fight all comers of an Oleksandr Usyk, you don't need to know anything about imaginary lineal titles.

I predict that, while there is enough money available to persuade the top HWs to fight each other, the lineal HW title will fade out of the picture and it won't come back until the money runs out and the ducking and jiving starts again.