How good is Floyd Mayweather's resume as a ATG?

[IronDanHamza]

To expand upon the Judah fight, it's another example of the US bias I regularly complain about here. The institutions that run boxing had decided Judah and Mayweather were the two best welterweights, so even after one of them lost we were supposed to pretend they hadn't. Mayweather did at least fight Baldomir, but it was a dreadful performance. I distinctly recall Manny Steward saying "no, no, no" when Lampley mentioned Floyd comparing himself to Ray Robinson.

The HOF has little more credibility to me than the Oscars. Award ceremonies are another example of arbitrary authority. Is it really a coincidence 'best actor' always go to someone who performed in a Hollywood blockbuster? I don't need people to validate what I consider art. It's part of the reason I bristle at those who insist I "don't understand the sweet science" for not being high on Mayweather. I know what I'm looking at.

Another point Mayweather falls down on is activity. His (cynical in my view) "retirements" and spells of inactivity quite obviously contributed to his ability to remain undefeated. Whether they like it or not, Mayweather and Pacquiao will always be indelibly linked so let's compare them. Pacquiao had 72 fights, that's 44% more fights. He fought JMM four times. Coupled with his riskier style, it's no surprise he had more losses.

After their 2015 fight, Mayweather had two more professional fights, one of which was a glorified exhibition with a former MMA fighter. Pacquiao had seven more, the penultimate being a win over Keith Thurman.

Mayweather and Judah still fought because they’d verbally agreed to fight prior to his loss to what was meant to be a tune up, that’s the only reason.

They didn’t have to fight as it was not a verbal agreement and not in writing but it had been building up for a while and despite the bad loss it was still a big fight at the time so they (Floyd) honoured it.

[daggum]

Mayweather and Judah still fought because they’d verbally agreed to fight prior to his loss to what was meant to be a tune up, that’s the only reason.

They didn’t have to fight as it was not a verbal agreement and not in writing but it had been building up for a while and despite the bad loss it was still a big fight at the time so they (Floyd) honoured it.

thats laughable spin. fight never should have happened after zab lost to a bum, but floyd knew it was a way of not fighting margarito so he was happy to do it. the marg fight had been building up too since marg had been #1 for years at that point, the marg fight was still a big fight(mexican fanbase that floyd always coveted) the problem was marg was just too dangerous and we know floyd turned down more money to fight lesser guys like sharmba and zab because his own promoter said so. its not always about the money for "money mayweather" oh well thats the resume he wanted and he got it. not sure why we have to pretend its great when its not or make excuses for stupid fights that shouldnt have even happened but in 20 years i bet people will be saying how canelo vs munguia and charlo were good fights

[IronDanHamza]

thats laughable spin. fight never should have happened after zab lost to a bum, but floyd knew it was a way of not fighting margarito so he was happy to do it. the marg fight had been building up too since marg had been #1 for years at that point, the marg fight was still a big fight(mexican fanbase that floyd always coveted) the problem was marg was just too dangerous and we know floyd turned down more money to fight lesser guys like sharmba and zab because his own promoter said so. its not always about the money for "money mayweather" oh well thats the resume he wanted and he got it. not sure why we have to pretend its great when its not or make excuses for stupid fights that shouldnt have even happened but in 20 years i bet people will be saying how canelo vs munguia and charlo were good fights

Its not spin, it’s what happened. Thats why they fought. I’d have rather he fought Margarito instead.

But hold on, Zab Judah was #3 at that time when Mayweather fought him so I’m assuming that’s a great win for Floyd in your eyes anyway right?

[djtmal]

Mayweather and Judah still fought because they’d verbally agreed to fight prior to his loss to what was meant to be a tune up, that’s the only reason.

They didn’t have to fight as it was not a verbal agreement and not in writing but it had been building up for a while and despite the bad loss it was still a big fight at the time so they (Floyd) honoured it.

Too bad Nayweather didn't show that type of integrity when he backed out of fights with Margarito Wright and Pacquaio.

What was their standing in the rankings at the time Nayweather backed out of those fights.

[billeau2]

To expand upon the Judah fight, it's another example of the US bias I regularly complain about here. The institutions that run boxing had decided Judah and Mayweather were the two best welterweights, so even after one of them lost we were supposed to pretend they hadn't. Mayweather did at least fight Baldomir, but it was a dreadful performance. I distinctly recall Manny Steward saying "no, no, no" when Lampley mentioned Floyd comparing himself to Ray Robinson.

The HOF has little more credibility to me than the Oscars. Award ceremonies are another example of arbitrary authority. Is it really a coincidence 'best actor' always go to someone who performed in a Hollywood blockbuster? I don't need people to validate what I consider art. It's part of the reason I bristle at those who insist I "don't understand the sweet science" for not being high on Mayweather. I know what I'm looking at.

Another point Mayweather falls down on is activity. His (cynical in my view) "retirements" and spells of inactivity quite obviously contributed to his ability to remain undefeated. Whether they like it or not, Mayweather and Pacquiao will always be indelibly linked so let's compare them. Pacquiao had 72 fights, that's 44% more fights. He fought JMM four times. Coupled with his riskier style, it's no surprise he had more losses.

After their 2015 fight, Mayweather had two more professional fights, one of which was a glorified exhibition with a former MMA fighter. Pacquiao had seven more, the penultimate being a win over Keith Thurman.

Great points. Judah had indeed been exposed as they say. Lol don't even get me started on the Boxing HOF... I strictly deal with ATG as a measure that equivocates what the HOF should be. Gatti is in the HOF... So is Rocky lol. Mayweather chose the easy way. More so than Pacman for sure.

[-Kev-]

The obvious flaw with the Zab Judah win was that Zab was coming off a loss to a rather unheralded fighter. Zab was another example of an American "name" who got recycled way beyond his merit.



Didn't beat Margarito, that fight could have happened in 2006.

Antonio Margarito doesn’t matter in the history books. His career will always be tainted. He was beaten easily by Molsey, Pacquiao and Cotto after he no longer had plaster in his gloves.

Anyone who still mentions that cheating pos, while knowing he was loading his gloves, isn’t a real fan of the sport of boxing. You have to have at least a little bit of integrity even in your critique of a fighter you may not like. Some fairness.

[Legends456]

He is a great example of what Breadman talks about when he says a fighter is “Greater” vs a fighter is “Better”.

ill show you:

Floyd is Greater, but Crawford is Better.

[QueensburyRules]

Antonio Margarito doesn’t matter in the history books. His career will always be tainted. He was beaten easily by Molsey, Pacquiao and Cotto after he no longer had plaster in his gloves.

Anyone who still mentions that cheating pos, while knowing he was loading his gloves, isn’t a real fan of the sport of boxing. You have to have at least a little bit of integrity even in your critique of a fighter you may not like. Some fairness.

- - Now Kevvy, there you go again. Marg always wore Commish approved gloves and wraps, you could look it up. Appears the subtle criminal nature of boxing overseers is beyond your understanding.

[chaos]

About Mayweather vs Marquez, I don't really give Floyd much credit for bloating up a lightweight two divisions which will be impeding his performance and still somehow Floyd was coming overweight. Most argue that because Marquez was P4P fighter and Mayweather was unactive for two years it should, but Floyd's is the top of athlete who always maintained himself in tip top condition and rarely needed to engage in a fight at Welterweight in the first place. I think something similar with Canelo vs Charlo and Spence vs Garcia.

For Mayweather vs Canelo, a 23 year old athlete, I don't think dropping two pounds would had affected Canelo much unless there was a rehydration clause. It might affect Canelo to a degree but not enough for him to had lost one sidedly in the fight. Might affect Floyd's win, but they both meet at the same middle point with Mayweather moving up.

Wasn't two years, he fought a blown up Hatton first instead of the actual 147 champs of the time, and making Canelo drop to 152 when he was struggling to make 154 does make a big difference, otherwise he wouldn't have made him do it. The fact that he was willing to payout Marquez to avoid dropping two pounds shows what a difference each pound makes when you're already cutting down, and it shows the "middle point" with Canelo was a comfortable weight for Froid.

[Feroz]

Wasn't two years, he fought a blown up Hatton first instead of the actual 147 champs of the time, and making Canelo drop to 152 when he was struggling to make 154 does make a big difference, otherwise he wouldn't have made him do it. The fact that he was willing to payout Marquez to avoid dropping two pounds shows what a difference each pound makes when you're already cutting down, and it shows the "middle point" with Canelo was a comfortable weight for Froid.

Mayweather fought Hatton in 2007 and Marquez in 2009, pretty close if not 2 years.

Another interesting fact I didn't notice is that JMM had fought at lightweight for a year (two fights) before fighting Mayweather in two divisions above, as the catchweight was changed in the last minute after coming overweight.

He was basically acclimating to fighting above super featherweight.

Because Marquez had never before fought above 135 lbs and had fought at 130 lbs as recently as March 2008, while Mayweather had campaigned at 147 lbs since 2005, the fight was scheduled to take place at a catchweight of 144 lbs to account for the size disparity between the two fighters. The fight was originally scheduled for July 18, 2009 at the MGM Grand arena but was postponed due to a rib injury sustained by Mayweather. The bout was rescheduled for September 19, 2009.

During the official weigh in for their 144 lb bout, Marquez weighed in at 142 lbs and Mayweather weighed in at 146 lbs thereby incurring a financial penalty ($300,000 for each pound over 144 lbs) as he was 2 pounds over the catchweight. It was later revealed that the contract was changed a few days prior to the weigh in so that Mayweather would be allowed to weigh up to the welterweight limit of 147 lbs while avoiding paying an additional fine to the Nevada State Athletic Commission, in addition to the fine he agreed to pay to Marquez.

I think Floyd intentionally did not make weight to have a substantial advantage over Juan Manuel considering he was inactive and beating a P4P fighter would immediately would elevate his standing in the media at the moment. Canelo at 23 was dedicated enough to cut down extra weight for one time and likely didn't impair his performance as much considering his quite young age. It might to a degree affect his performance (like reflexes and durability) thus Mayweather can't get full credit, but I am not sure if it make that big of difference that it let him win.