Why doesn't Sven Ottke get as much Credit as Joe C. ?

[hammerhiem]

I think joe would beat sven. Sven wasn't offensive enough to handle Joe's output. But I don't think it would be the beating Joe's fans think it would be.

I meant the question of who Kassslaaar has beaten that makes him great.

AND that if Joe's fought Sven, Joe's fans would hype the **** out of sven and make him seem great. Instead they hate on the guy.

If the fight had been in Germany, Ottke would have won.

[S.G.]

I meant the question of who Kassslaaar has beaten that makes him great.

oh okay

well, i don't think it is a great win per say

but i stand by the opinion that it's a good win, and would be nice on anyone's resume

Kessler may not be proven on the world stage to the extent that maybe he is capable of, or maybe to be considered a great name to have beaten, but he's a very dangerous fighter nevertheless, and the fight was a genuine unification bout between two world class operators

i mean, the guy had genuine titles and had some respectable defenses under his belt. By that point people had accepted Joe was a top fighter, and a good amount still predicted Kessler would get the win

AND that if Joe's fought Sven, Joe's fans would hype the **** out of sven and make him seem great. Instead they hate on the guy.

for the record i don't hate Ottke, i'm pretty much indifferent to the guy

[bsrizpac]

oh okay

well, i don't think it is a great win per say

but i stand by the opinion that it's a good win, and would be nice on anyone's resume

Kessler may not be proven on the world stage to the extent that maybe he is capable of, or maybe to be considered a great name to have beaten, but he's a very dangerous fighter nevertheless, and the fight was a genuine unification bout between two world class operators

i mean, the guy had genuine titles and had some respectable defenses under his belt. By that point people had accepted Joe was a top fighter, and a good amount still predicted Kessler would get the win


for the record i don't hate Ottke, i'm pretty much indifferent to the guy

Predicting Kessler would win is not an insult to Joe. you guys seems to forget how ****ty his SMW run was up to that point AND the fact that he was just not well known. Kessler is good and dangerous. that's about it. His titles are good but they don't mean anything in that division. Do you also give Judah the same kind of credit for being the unified champ at 147 at some point? Doubtful

For the record I don't blame Sven for some of his questionable wins just like I don't blame Joe for his stoppage over Manfredo. I DO blame Joe's fans for not at least laughing about it and admitting that maybe just maybe, people who didn't want to come to Joe's backyard to fight him (Taylor) were not "ducking him". According to Hammerheim that kind of **** happens all the time.....


I respect that you are indifferent to Sven. But you have to admit that most Joe fans on here are NOT respectful and before all these new joe fans showed up I remember a lot of Sven bashing by the Joe brigade for no reason other than to make an excuse for why Joe never ended up fighting him.

[toysale]

Kessler can't get proven on world stage, he's avoided like the plague!

[S.G.]

Predicting Kessler would win is not an insult to Joe. you guys seems to forget how ****ty his SMW run was up to that point AND the fact that he was just not well known. Kessler is good and dangerous. that's about it. His titles are good but they don't mean anything in that division. Do you also give Judah the same kind of credit for being the unified champ at 147 at some point? Doubtful

i didn't mean that; i meant that he must have been highly regarded to be considered to have such a good chance at beating Calzaghe

both Kessler and Calzgahe's SMW runs were under par considering their talent, but i don't think they are "****ty" in the grand scheme of things. some solid wins and they built a skeleton for a resume. They just lack flesh; which i believe Calzaghe did a fair job of adding with the little run towards the end

For the record I don't blame Sven for some of his questionable wins just like I don't blame Joe for his stoppage over Manfredo. I DO blame Joe's fans for not at least laughing about it and admitting that maybe just maybe, people who didn't want to come to Joe's backyard to fight him (Taylor) were not "ducking him". According to Hammerheim that kind of **** happens all the time.....

Joe and his camp should have taken more initiative and forced the big fights to come off sooner, for sure. The onus is on the person who needs the fight most. However i think some of the blame can be shared with a couple other people,

I respect that you are indifferent to Sven. But you have to admit that most Joe fans on here are NOT respectful and before all these new joe fans showed up I remember a lot of Sven bashing by the Joe brigade for no reason other than to make an excuse for why Joe never ended up fighting him.

most people are not very respectful towards Sven... I think for British boxing fans the Reid robbery is a large part of it, a lot of people are still salty about that

[bsrizpac]

i didn't mean that; i meant that he must have been highly regarded to be considered to have such a good chance at beating Calzaghe

both Kessler and Calzgahe's SMW runs were under par considering their talent, but i don't think they are "****ty" in the grand scheme of things. some solid wins and they built a skeleton for a resume. They just lack flesh; which i believe Calzaghe did a fair job of adding with the little run towards the end


Joe and his camp should have taken more initiative and forced the big fights to come off sooner, for sure. He onus is on the person who needs the fight most. However i think some of the blame can be shared with a couple other people,


most people are not very respectful towards Sven... I think for British boxing fans the Reid robbery is a large part of it, a lot of people are still salty about that

Very good objective post. Excellent.

I think the word ****ty was in there btw because it's supermiddleweight, which has never been a deep or great division in my mind and the minds of a lot of others.

I can understand why Brits don't like Sven. but I'm just pointing out that it's a little silly for JOE's fans to think like that considering his SMW run.

The interesting question is this: Joe added to his run at the end of his career in my mind and most others. Made him known and a better star. But did he really do anything or was it just the limelight of being in America? This raises that interesting question again about America's perception of a fighter and not giving them enough credit before they come over here...

[Thunder Lips]

Thanks to Briszpac the Great Calzaghe will never be forgotten, perhaps even years from now several threads bearing his name will continue to pop up on the first page everytime I venture to these forums.

Joe Calzaghe, you will live on and on in our memories thanks to this dedicated poster. UNDEFEATED!!!

[bsrizpac]

thanks to briszpac the great calzaghe will never be forgotten, perhaps even years from now several threads bearing his name will continue to pop up on the first page everytime i venture to these forums.

Joe calzaghe, you will live on and on in our memories thanks to this dedicated poster. Undefeated!!!

sven ottke undefeated

[Thunder Lips]

UNDEFEATED!!!

[bsrizpac]

UNDEFEATED!!!

hahaha, your first post was funny btw.

Man Rourke has deformed his ****ing face. Doesn't even look the same.