the most fundamental boxer in this era

[askoe]

Chris Byrd

[Cuauhtémoc1520]

Absolutely incorrect. If I as a trainer were to tell any boxer to watch a pro, it would be Bernard Hopkins.

Awkward? He keeps his stance almost all the time. In fact he's the only boxer I can name as a pro who keeps his ****ing right hand glued to his chin when he jabs.

Oscar? He's been known to use a swing jab and lead with left hooks. Yeah that's not a good idea to emulate.

You missunderstood, I never said Hopkins was bad in his form, he does some things great. My point is that he also gives very awkward angles and does some things that is very hard to teach and fundamentally sound.

Watch old Oscar, he is text book in his delivery of his punches. Especially the left hook, it's a thing of beauty. It's like watching a great formed shooter hit the jump shot.

Bernard is very good though and has great defense, I just think his level is a 10 and when you are trying to teach young kids to box, I wouldn't start them there.

[mellow_mood]

floyd mayweather, whitaker & calderon

[bsrizpac]

You missunderstood, I never said Hopkins was bad in his form, he does some things great. My point is that he also gives very awkward angles and does some things that is very hard to teach and fundamentally sound.

Watch old Oscar, he is text book in his delivery of his punches. Especially the left hook, it's a thing of beauty. It's like watching a great formed shooter hit the jump shot.

Bernard is very good though and has great defense, I just think his level is a 10 and when you are trying to teach young kids to box, I wouldn't start them there.

I wouldn't want anyone trying Oscars pathetic imitation of the shoulder roll or have them watch him and try to throw body shots the way he does. It's really bad form.

He also wades in a lot, not the best footwork to be imitating.

But I do agree, his left hook has always been amazing.




You aren't going to see a pro at that level keeps his hands closer to correct than this....

[cortdawg25]

i THINK HOPKINS, TRINIDAD HAS VERY GOOD BASIC FUNDAMENTALS. EARLY FLOYD WAS FUNDAMENTALLY SOUND TOO. NOW HE MORE ****Y AND TAKE MORE RISK. BUT I THINK HOPKINS IS 1 OF THE MOST FUNDAMENTALLY SOUND. LENNOX LEWIS WASN'T BAD EITHER, BUT HE DID DROP HIS HANDS AT TIMES.

[bsrizpac]

i THINK HOPKINS, TRINIDAD HAS VERY GOOD BASIC FUNDAMENTALS. EARLY FLOYD WAS FUNDAMENTALLY SOUND TOO. NOW HE MORE ****Y AND TAKE MORE RISK. BUT I THINK HOPKINS IS 1 OF THE MOST FUNDAMENTALLY SOUND. LENNOX LEWIS WASN'T BAD EITHER, BUT HE DID DROP HIS HANDS AT TIMES.

All pros drop their hands way too much.

But, again the guys you listed are good examples.

Lennox had an awesome jab.

So does Wlad.

Anyone can learn from watching them.

One thing i can say is that people should study footwork more:

Hopkins
RJJR

[Pugilistic™]

Bernard Hopkins.

Although he doesn't use his jab when he does it is a good jab.

[Dynamite Kid]

Vernon Forrest Boxing 101

[Eric Holder]

If someone was wanting to learn how to fight properly, then watching Lopez would be the best way to go in my opinion. He was one of the most complete, fundamentally perfect boxers I've ever seen. Yes, that includes Hopkins, Mayweather, Toney, etc etc etc etc.

The 'Philly Shell' is not an orthodox fighting style. It is what you would most definitely call an unorthodox style of boxing. People are getting confused with 'The best boxer vs the best fundamental boxer'.

Textbook is textbook. It is what you teach a young, new kid coming in to learn how to box well. Throwing lead left hooks and hardly any jabs is about as far from textbook as you can get. If you think Mayweather is textbook then you have not learned what textbook boxing is.

Pot-shotting is not textbook. If a trainer tells you to pot-shot as a textbook fighter, you should leave him real quick. Having a lead right as your main weapon is not textbook. If you're a brilliant textbook boxer you're best weapon is your jab, no questions. You might have a great, powerful punch of some type but your most important weapon is the jab and it is what you use most.

Also, guys like Mayweather, Hopkins etc do not throw textbook combinations. They do of course, but they are not their signature moves and the ones they use to most effect. Mayweather knocking out N'Dou with three lead rights? About as far from fundamentally sound as you could ask for.

Mayweather, Hopkins, Toney, etc have all learned the fundamental, textbook style of fighting but have gone beyond it. If you're thinking they are fundamental you should not be teaching boxing. You will get your poor students KO'd real quick.

I agree....

[Eric Holder]

the first names that came to mind where

Winky Wright
Juan Manuel Marquez
Ricardo Lopez


and even though he does like to brawl a lot Miguel Cotto can be pretty fundamentaly sound(elbows in, chin down, text book punches, hands up)