Insider Notebook: Oscar's Weight Shocks, Pacquiao-Hatton

[MOREBASS]

Benny, you're absolutely right, it does vary from person to person.


Some people have great success and no problems with it, and others will suffer from the effects of a high fat diet.


I think it might have been implemented in Oscar's diet because it is a sure shot way to keep weight in check.

But for high intensity training in intervals, it might not be the best choice.

[Benny Leonard]

Since you're complaining and making excuses. Would it have been fair if Pacquiao agreed to fight Oscar at 154 in order to make this fight?? You're ridiculous.
Pacquiao went up 3 weightclasses (only had 1 fight at LW) and Oscar went down just one. That itself was ridiculously unfair..........and of course IT ISN'T anymore coz Pac won convincingly.

Yes, it would have been fair to fight at 154 where Oscar was healthy. Did you see Floyd complaining about the weight or even the gloves that he had to use despite having brittle hands and breaking his hand the last time he used them?

Pac also weighed in at 147 come fight time in his 135 pound division fight. Pac also has trouble making the weight at 135 according to Freddie Roach. Pac is also now in the 140 pound division. Pac also is the same weight as Floyd come fight night.

What is unfair is to not fight a healthy fighter when you can. I thought this way when Freddie negotiated the Morales rematches. True, it is both Oscar and Morales's fault for taking the fight, but what kind of guy that knows his history of the sport and knows the likely possibilities would do this to a fighter even if it is the fighter's "want." "Want," in the case of Oscar since Morales's "want" was to fight in the higher weight-class.

A more honorable man would at least warn the other fighter on what could happen and what history says. And, an even more honorable man could just say, "I'm not going to take this fight because I don't want to fight a dead man; I don't want to steal my victory."

Although, I guess this is WAR and not Sport...or are they one in the same? Maybe. Why give your advantages away; right?

I guess it depends on the person. This wasn't a fight Pac had to take.

[S A M U R A I]

You do realize that 24/7 is a promotional show before the bout, right?

YES!

But the difference is... Oscar really believed what he was saying was true.

That's not merely promotional hype, Oscar really believed he could beat lil' Pac. And by KO, no less! An attempt at an easy payday and Pac's #1 spot. Cheap move.



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[Benny Leonard]

Benny, you're absolutely right, it does vary from person to person.


Some people have great success and no problems with it, and others will suffer from the effects of a high fat diet.


I think it might have been implemented in Oscar's diet because it is a sure shot way to keep weight in check.

But for high intensity training in intervals, it might not be the best choice.

I'm guessing based on Oscar's heritage and where he lives, he lives on a diet high on carbs, protein and fats.

I once heard that Audrey Hepburn couldn't gain weight because of her child-hood. She was basically a starved child so her body was conditioned to stay thin.

[Benny Leonard]

YES!

But the difference is... Oscar really believed what he was saying was true.

That's not merely promotional hype, Oscar really believed he could beat lil' Pac. And by KO, no less! An attempt at an easy payday and Pac's #1 spot. Cheap move.

Yes, and Ali really believed he was going to beat Holmes. And Holyfield really believes he will unify the titles.

I'm not sure Oscar understood the possible negative effects the diet and training could have by the end period. During, he may have been fine but his body may have hit a plateau and then crashed.


You also have to remember on the other side; Freddie also took the fight because he said "Oscar can't pull the trigger," and went with history that fighters aren't the same when they come back down in weight. The big difference between Oscar and Freddie is that Freddie's logic of thinking was based on seeing first-hand where Oscar was based on training Oscar. It's Freddie's job to be objective and see what is going on so he can possibly correct it. And, the second of course is Freddie knew his history about what weight does to a fighter...especially at that age.

Oscar's logic was about Greed and Desperation.

[LastQuark]

Do you guys really believe that Oscar's nutritionists don't know anything about carbohydrates? Come on.

Oscar spars 12 rounds in 24/7. He doesn't look dehydrated at all!

Watch Oscar throw crisp shots at the 8th round. They just don't hit the mark! Oscar is not even breathing heavily after the 8th while he sat on his stool. He looks more confused than dehydrated.

Oscar gave it all at the 5th round by illegally holding Pacs head and giving him 3 big left hooks out of frustration NOT dehydration!

F*** about unfairness in Oscars going to 147. Of couse, he is not going to take the fight if he thinks he cannot meet it. In fact, Schaefer bragged about Oscar already being there right after contract were signed! He's been there over a month. He's been at 150 for much longer than that. This is not dehydration. Before this fight, all talks was anyone moving up in weight usually hit the ceiling. They are referring to Pac. Now, no one talks about him moving 3 freaking divisions in 1 year because he won.

Also, f*** about Morales going down in weight. They agreed to meet in the middle! In Oscar's case, it is not even in the middle! Pac went up 3 divisions! No wonder 85% of experts thought it will be and easy win for Hoya.

[Benny Leonard]

Do you guys really believe that Oscar's nutritionists don't know anything about carbohydrates? Come on.

Oscar spars 12 rounds in 24/7. He doesn't look dehydrated at all!

Watch Oscar throw crisp shots at the 8th round. They just don't hit the mark! Oscar is not even breathing heavily after the 8th while he sat on his stool. He looks more confused than dehydrated.

Oscar gave it all at the 5th round by illegally holding Pacs head and giving him 3 big left hooks out of frustration NOT dehydration!

F*** about unfairness in Oscars going to 147. Of couse, he is not going to take the fight if he thinks he cannot meet it. In fact, Schaefer bragged about Oscar already being there right after contract were signed! He's been there over a month. He's been at 150 for much longer than that. This is not dehydration. Before this fight, all talks was anyone moving up in weight usually hit the ceiling. They are referring to Pac. Now, no one talks about him moving 3 freaking divisions in 1 year because he won.

Also, f*** about Morales going down in weight. They agreed to meet in the middle! In Oscar's case, it is not even in the middle! Pac went up 3 divisions! No wonder 85% of experts thought it will be and easy win for Hoya.

I wonder if his nutritionist has trained boxers. You might be able to get away with this with some "normal" person who doesn't have to put his body and mind through such conditions, but with a boxer; it's a different ball game.

Even with a "normal" person; there is nothing "normal" about the human body. It's a whacky, confusing, WTF is that type of machine. It's why Doctors say we "Practice" Medicine.

In the end, this "nutrionist" failed big time. Even Freddie talked about it.

Greed and Desperation got in the way of Oscar thinking about the fighters Freddie mentioned that tried to do this as well and failed big time. Three of them weren't even that long ago: Chrisy Byrd, Tarver and Jones Jr.
Maybe Oscar does live in fantasy land.


This isn't a Ford Pinto we are are talking about; we are talking about a Ferrari.

[PeterinMI]

More and more it seems as though DLH lost weight the wrong way, Rob Garcia is in charge of that stuff and it seems like he did a bad job, it was interesting to hear Chris Byrd say he suffered from the same thing as well when he moved down to 175, gaining only a few pounds from the weigh in to the time of the fight

Good to hear Guerrero's wife is doing better.

Agreed. What Pac did was amazing but why does it offend his rabid fans to hear that DLH was off. No question that was not the fighter of even the PBF match.

[gopi11]

You do realize that 24/7 is a promotional show before the bout, right?

What is promoting? Promoting is a tool to get an audience to spend $55 for a fight.
What did Freddie Roach say? Just curious

Like I said before, we shouldn't always take the word of a fighter that is promoting a fight...he wants to get paid. Holyfield still promotes himself as being in the best shape of his life. Ali was bragging about being still great when he was about to fight Larry Holmes.

The fight was already over when Nacho and Angelo Dundee had their article released about what went wrong, and they are in unison that nothing's wrong with Oscar AND his conditioning regimen. Are they still promoting when they said Oscar was in great shape before the fight because they were still hyping up the fight and hoping for a bonus from the boss man himself? I will take the word of these 2 gentlemen against anybody else here in this forum who's giving Oscar a ton of excuses...

[Pullcounter]

dlh underestimated pac. end of thread.