Jermain Taylor: "I Want To Make an Impact at 168"

[Hitman932]

I think Joe feels he has secured his legacy.

If he desired his legacy to be the greatest Welsh fighter of all time then he may have accomplished that.

As far as historical respect, I don't see how he will demand very much 10-15 years down the road.

As i said before, he is a great fighter with a mediocre resume. I like to watch him fight, but I won't pay 1 cent to see him end his career with a circus sideshow fight with a predetermined outcome.

[Dirk Diggler UK]

If he desired his legacy to be the greatest Welsh fighter of all time then he may have accomplished that.

As far as historical respect, I don't see how he will demand very much 10-15 years down the road.

As i said before, he is a great fighter with a mediocre resume. I like to watch him fight, but I won't pay 1 cent to see him end his career with a circus sideshow fight with a predetermined outcome.

Refer to my last post. I think he stopped caring about gaining recognition from people on forums a while ago. Like he said.......you cant please everyone.

And everyone has a different opinion which is all your post it.

[WisePugilist]

He's taking a tune-up against the guy who put Joe Calzaghe on the map.

A tune-up.

Funny you should mention Joe Calzaghe in your criticism of Taylor; isn't he fighting a 40 year old guy who Tarver and Johnson thrashed years ago, who also has no belt, and trying to sell it as a superfight?

At least Taylor isn't pulling the wool over anyone's eyes.

How can you moan about Joe Calzaghe in this instance? Who has Taylor beaten? Hopkins- OK an excellent fighter twice. But thats it. Sometimes a lesser fighter has the beating of a greater fighter because of their style. Calzaghe is a bona fide undefeated champion who has beaten those who dare fight him. Taylor is an overrated fighter who was beaten by Pavlik who albeit a good fighter is no Mikkel Kessler (who is as good a brawler as Pavlik but twice as good a boxer) whom Joe Calzaghe schooled. Changed his game plan in the last 6 rounds. The sign of a true champion.

[WisePugilist]

He's taking a tune-up against the guy who put Joe Calzaghe on the map.

A tune-up.

Funny you should mention Joe Calzaghe in your criticism of Taylor; isn't he fighting a 40 year old guy who Tarver and Johnson thrashed years ago, who also has no belt, and trying to sell it as a superfight?

At least Taylor isn't pulling the wool over anyone's eyes.

How can you moan about Joe Calzaghe in this instance? Who has Taylor beaten? Hopkins- OK an excellent fighter twice. But thats it. Sometimes a lesser fighter has the beating of a greater fighter because of their style. Calzaghe is a bona fide undefeated champion who has beaten those who dare fight him. Taylor is an overrated fighter who was beaten by Pavlik who albeit a good fighter is no Mikkel Kessler (who is as good a brawler as Pavlik but twice as good a boxer) whom Joe Calzaghe schooled. Changed his game plan in the last 6 rounds. The sign of a true champion.

I forgot to mention that Calzaghe has beaten Hopkins- Taylor's only legitimate victory

[GreatestIam]

Truth is Jermaine Taylor has to prove himself after his two losses to Pavlik, and thats fact, what where saying is hear-say and thats it! IMO Jermaine is still a top fighter but lost 2 fights to a great fighter in Pavlik who will go on to prove he is so! In the mean-while Jermaine has to beat Lacy and go from there.. And thats practical, we all know he'll fight the best fighter out there, and well come on people Jeff Lacy was God before Joe and not so after! Point is Taylor is defitely a great fighter but has to get W;s from here on out to prove so until he finds is known advisary Kelly/1

[WisePugilist]

What's funny is that you were the first to bring up Joe Calzaghe rather unprovoked and unneccesarily. I was merely responding to what you said.......which was just plain ignorant.



I have read your thoughts and I responded to them and offered valid reasons for Calzaghe's change of mind. You didnt respond to a single on of them. Instead making some smart arse wise crack. Most likely because you didnt have a response.



Oh it doesnt? Yes........you said it mate, its a business. Jermain Taylor said publically in the press that he couldnt make 160, that he was gonna retire at 30 and only wanted to fight the best at the 168lb division.

Instead he fights...........Cory Spinks and Kassim Ouma (a couple of jr middles at best). Yet he's not a weasel but Calzaghe is for saying he'd like to fight Pavlik but then changing his mind to fight Roy Jones - who is at least in his division and capable of giving him a hard fight.

When I say Im not here to defend Calzaghe, its on this topic. I dont think he's a "weasel", nor do i think Taylor is one so I dont feel I have to defend him on that rather lame point. Im just pointing out your double standard.



Yes I wouldnt mind see Calzaghe vs Pavlik. Still hopeful it could happen. Like Ive told you countless times, Taylor has been beaten twice on the spin. I dont think he's in such a lofty position as Calzaghe to be turning down fights for world titles.

As far as risk/reward goes. I think Jones is the riskier fight. Styles make fights and Pavlik is made for Calzaghe. I dont think thats an outrageous view to take up.





I dont fault Taylor. I actually couldnt give two ****s about his career choices. Im just pointing out that Calzaghe has not been the only boxer in history to publically say one thing then do another. Di Bella, whilst negotiating with Warren for the Calzaghe fight had some derogatory things to say about Lacy. Now they're fighting him.

Taylor mislead the public by saying he was retiring soon and was only looking to fight the best at 168. Something he clearly did not do and still isnt even close to doing.

Totally agree with you Dirk lad. This guy talks utter ****e with no facts to back up his points. He uses the 'lets make up bull****' approach. It's usually irrelevent and its defo a bunch of toss. I still haven't read ONE valid fact based points made by him. He never has a vaild resonse. Agree with alot of what you say btw.

[WisePugilist]

Is it really that difficult for people to understand that boxing is about making money? I never criticise fighters for taking matchups that earn higher pay days. If he could have got more money against Pavlik he would have fought him. He can't, so he didn't. It is an occupation.

This guy has it spot on. Especially when you consider that Calzaghe doesn't have as much money as other top level fighters. Most of this is still being held by that criminal Frank Warren- why would any other business man/woman take a lesser contract over a higher one? It wouls make no sense.

[Hitman932]

This guy has it spot on. Especially when you consider that Calzaghe doesn't have as much money as other top level fighters. Most of this is still being held by that criminal Frank Warren- why would any other business man/woman take a lesser contract over a higher one? It wouls make no sense.

Why doesent he just come out and say he knows RJJ is past it and it's only for money? (Say it again since he already did once)

The video of him trashing RJJ and propping up Pavlik only makes him look like a dunce.

As DStew said Taylor was very upfront about not fighting Froch because of the terrible risk/reward involved, plus the fact that the fight makes more money when Froch is champ after beating Pascal.

Why cant Joe be as up front about the real reasons he is fighting RJJ. You should be just as upset as I because he is playing us both for suckers.

I really don't get you guys, obviously Joe could do nothing that would make you critical of him.

The parallel here would be if after Joe beats RJJ he offers Pavlik a fight and Pavlik turns it down to stay at 160 to fight Winky Wright because he is a "living legend and household name in the US"

I would have a fit and tear Kelly apart, something you guys aren't willing to do to Joe Calzaghe no matter what he does. He could be fighting a Lacy rematch instead of Jones and you would justify it.

[dstew]

What's funny is that you were the first to bring up Joe Calzaghe rather unprovoked and unneccesarily. I was merely responding to what you said.......which was just plain ignorant.

Wrong again, Dirk. KrisSilver brought up Calzaghe and I responded to him, at which time you jumped in with an over-the-top defense of Calzaghe as though I were comparing him and Taylor, which I was not. But we've already been over that.

I have read your thoughts and I responded to them and offered valid reasons for Calzaghe's change of mind. You didnt respond to a single on of them. Instead making some smart arse wise crack. Most likely because you didnt have a response.

What you are still FAILING TO UNDERSTAND is that I don't have a huge issue with Calzaghe changing his mind. It's his conduct and comments surrounding his decisions that make him a weasel in my eyes.

However, if you want answers to your "valid reasons" that I allegedly ignored, point me to which reasons you are talking about and I will point you to my responses, or respond if I haven't already done so.

Oh it doesnt? Yes........you said it mate, its a business. Jermain Taylor said publically in the press that he couldnt make 160, that he was gonna retire at 30 and only wanted to fight the best at the 168lb division.

Instead he fights...........Cory Spinks and Kassim Ouma (a couple of jr middles at best). Yet he's not a weasel but Calzaghe is for saying he'd like to fight Pavlik but then changing his mind to fight Roy Jones - who is at least in his division and capable of giving him a hard fight.

Man I don't know what reality you are operating in but I can't even see it from my own. Because in my reality, Taylor never slammed Spinks or Ouma before setting fights with them, saying they would be disappointments as opponents. Nor did he ever come back and say that Calzaghe was a **** fighter after commenting that he would like to fight him next. Also, in my reality, Jermain is currently IN THE 168 DIVISION, where hopefully he is poised to take on the best it has to offer.

And almost all fighters fight long after they've said they intend to hang 'em up, that is not a crime or even a surprise. I will NEVER criticize a fighter who still has quite a bit left in the tank for deciding to continue on with his career. That is a positive change of mind, unlike taking fights against guys you have previously accused of being "disappointments" when you are in the unique position to fight almost whoever you want.

When I say Im not here to defend Calzaghe, its on this topic. I dont think he's a "weasel", nor do i think Taylor is one so I dont feel I have to defend him on that rather lame point. Im just pointing out your double standard.

If Taylor said Lacy was a **** fighter and he'd prefer a fight with Froch, and then turned around and took a fight with Lacy and called Froch a young nobody who shouldn't share the ring with him, I would call him out on it in a heartbeat. But he didn't do that, did he? Instead his management came out and said Froch was the riskier fight but couldn't offer the money that Lacy would, but that a future fight with Froch was very possible, even petitioning the WBC to make Taylor/Lacy a mandatory for the Froch/Pascal winner. That is some serious ****ing honesty right there. Now, if Taylor has the opportunity to fight Froch for his next fight but takes a lesser opponent, I will definitely express my disappointment in his decision and call him on it.

What you are failing to understand about me and probably the reason you've underestimated me in this discussion, is that I'm not a biased nuthugger like so many fans on this forum.

Like Ive told you countless times, Taylor has been beaten twice on the spin. I dont think he's in such a lofty position as Calzaghe to be turning down fights for world titles.

And like I've told you countless times, with a win over Lacy, Taylor can get more offers for title fights worth more money. That sounds like a decently "lofty" position to me. Meanwhile Calzaghe is in such a lofty position that he can name a fight with some of the best in three divisions, but chooses an aging, past-his-prime legend and tries to sell it as another "legend-killing" fight to build his legacy. Beeyullsheeaaht.

As far as risk/reward goes. I think Jones is the riskier fight. Styles make fights and Pavlik is made for Calzaghe. I dont think thats an outrageous view to take up.

If that's truly your view, I respect it but disagree with you.

I dont fault Taylor. I actually couldnt give two ****s about his career choices. Im just pointing out that Calzaghe has not been the only boxer in history to publically say one thing then do another. Di Bella, whilst negotiating with Warren for the Calzaghe fight had some derogatory things to say about Lacy. Now they're fighting him.

Taylor OTOH has always been extremely complimentary of his friend Lacy, even going so far as to say that Lacy was much better than he demonstrated after the Calzaghe loss.

If the fighter's not talking, I'll listen to the manager. But if the fighter's talking, I'll listen to him. If Taylor believes Lacy is a decent fighter, that's his call. He may be wrong, but it's his opinion.

Taylor mislead the public by saying he was retiring soon and was only looking to fight the best at 168. Something he clearly did not do and still isnt even close to doing.

Again, BFD. Read what I posted a few paragraphs ago. Nobody's going to blame the guy for staying in the game, while people have every right to blame a guy for selling them garbage (which, to be fair, Taylor's team did when they paired him against Ouma and Spinks).

[dstew]

How can you moan about Joe Calzaghe in this instance? Who has Taylor beaten? Hopkins- OK an excellent fighter twice. But thats it. Sometimes a lesser fighter has the beating of a greater fighter because of their style. Calzaghe is a bona fide undefeated champion who has beaten those who dare fight him. Taylor is an overrated fighter who was beaten by Pavlik who albeit a good fighter is no Mikkel Kessler (who is as good a brawler as Pavlik but twice as good a boxer) whom Joe Calzaghe schooled. Changed his game plan in the last 6 rounds. The sign of a true champion.

Your attacks on Taylor cannot change the facts surrounding Calzaghe's next "superfight".

I'm not going over this again. Catch up with the rest of the thread before you say I am posting ****e. Especially when you are claiming that Taylor is no Kessler, and Kessler is twice the boxer Pavlik is, of which you have absolutely zero proof. That is your own opinion, which might as well be "****e" itself as far as I'm concerned.