Kelly Pavlik said that Joe Calzaghe is a fraud

[RichCCFC]

I meant Pavlik.

Arthur Abraham. Unifications over rule mandatories so that fight could happen now.

[Live Dog]

Arthur Abraham. Unifications over rule mandatories so that fight could happen now.

Abraham has to make it happen, not Kelly. He is the one with the mandatory.

[MELLY-MEL...]

horse ****. pavlik does not run out the mouth like that!!!!!!!!!!:gay:

[Dirk Diggler UK]

Yeah I like Pavlik as a person, doubt he said this. My comments were directed at the thread writer

[Sir_Joe]

Kelly Pavlik is a fraud. He's fighting a Welterweight in his next fight, that explains it all.

[Steel Town USA]

Courtesy of two wins over Jermain Taylor?

Yes. While I did give B-Hop the edge in the first fight, it was VERY close, and Taylor clearly won the second IMO. These two victories were over a 3-years-younger version of the grandpa who Calzaghe just barely squeaked by. And Winky was a top 10 p4p and that fight was razor thin -- a draw cannot be argued.

So again, yes, I feel that Pavlik's two wins over Taylor are better than anything Joe has accomplished. That said, I see a Pavlik-Calzaghe fight as a 50/50 proposition.

[abadger]

Yes. While I did give B-Hop the edge in the first fight, it was VERY close, and Taylor clearly won the second IMO. These two victories were over a 3-years-younger version of the grandpa who Calzaghe just barely squeaked by. And Winky was a top 10 p4p and that fight was razor thin -- a draw cannot be argued.

So again, yes, I feel that Pavlik's two wins over Taylor are better than anything Joe has accomplished. That said, I see a Pavlik-Calzaghe fight as a 50/50 proposition.

Welcome to my sig

[Steel Town USA]

Calzaghe's sparring partner, who Enzo said would win, got blizted and it was obvious after that the Calzaghe camp wanted no part of the prime Kelly Pavlik.

The scary part is, I don't think Kelly has quite reached his prime. I think that will come in the next 1-2 years and he will be a 5,000 pound gorilla.

[Steel Town USA]

Welcome to my sig

Thanks, I'm honored!

Seriously though, who did Joe beat that was a tougher challenge than Taylor? Certainly not Hopkins, and don't even try to say Lacy. Mikkel Kessler is the only viable candidate here, and that's a close one.

OK, so maybe I was being slightly hyperbolic, but it served to make my point. At 26 years old, Pavlik has twice bested a man who is arguably as good as, or better than, anyone Calzaghe has faced -- and Joe is ten years Kelly's senior.

[abadger]

Thanks, I'm honored!

Seriously though, who did Joe beat that was a tougher challenge than Taylor? Certainly not Hopkins, and don't even try to say Lacy. Mikkel Kessler is the only viable candidate here, and that's a close one.

OK, so maybe I was being slightly hyperbolic, but it served to make my point. At 26 years old, Pavlik has twice bested a man who is arguably as good as, or better than, anyone Calzaghe has faced -- and Joe is ten years Kelly's senior.

Taylor is not as good as Kessler, nor is he as good as Hopkins, his victories over him at MW notwithstanding. Also Robin Reid, Byron Mitchell, Richie Woodhall, Charles Brewer, not to mention Chris Eubank would all have given Taylor a tough fight had he fought them when Calzaghe did.

Taylor gets a lot of credit for his wins over B-Hop, but really he won those fights by default because Hopkins could no longer find a MWs workrate. Taylor didn't do anything special and has been less than stellar since, drawing with an old Winky and losing to Pavlik.

Before you just dismiss my comparison of some of Calzaghe's opponents to Taylor, think about this. How will Jermain Taylor be regarded in eight years? He held a title, but he lost it. Its not clear which elite opponents he can beat. Pavlik? No. Kessler? Probably not. Abraham? Doubtful. He willl soon be fighting Jeff Lacy!

See what I'm saying. All the guys I listed were regarded as good fighters in their day, but losses to Calzaghe and then a few more further down the line mean they aren't so well thought of now. It is very likely that history will come to regard jermain Taylor in this light. It's all very well being able to beat Hopkins, but what if you can't beat anyone else?