is calzage an all time great if he beats rjj and retires undefeated???

[slicksouthpaw16]

Actually Jones did take over down the stretch but that was easily his toughest defense. And I believe it was Harding's bicep/arm that was torn, not his ankle lol.

Harding was a pretty good fighter in his prime. Making the LHW limit completely ****** him dry though. He was never into training. Nevertheless, the version that fought Tarver was excellent. In the rematch, he lost 42lbs in six weeks. Just silly. And he was still dominating until Tarver caught him coming in.

Yeah, Harding was a very good fighter. Its just a shame how he had to come in when the division was hot and filled with talent. He blew his shot at Tarver the second time though. He had the fight won but was caught with a counter left hand and was pretty much through. Tarver never let up and knocked him down 3 times and stopped him. Harding had the potential to do some good things, but he just didn't have that consistantcy to keep going and the hunger to drive him.

[hishaam15]

Most Americans know **** about Calzaghe so I wouldn't really expect any or many to agree he is ATG.

LOL im British. Calzaghe aint an ATG. Roy is.
I dont see any way calzaghe CAn become an ATG now, you cant compare him to RJJ,SRL,SRR,FMJ and Ali. his undefeated record is overrated.

[slicksouthpaw16]

Yeah but u cant knock out EVERY opponent. even a Prime Roy. if Harding's ankle didnt break roy would have won an easy UD.

Please elaborate. Harding was giving Jones all he could handle and made him fought very cautious. Many people never paid attention but Jones struggled with every good name southpaw that he has faced becuase most of them were counter punching and could take advantage of the defensive flaws that he has.

[Chunk..]

Well if you watch him fight you know he's not "too good."

He is undefeated, but Ricardo Lopez went 47-0 before losing, JCC was like 56-0 (maybe even more, I can't remember), Larry Holmes was 48-0 before losing, undefeated doesn't mean very much to me personally. Its an impressive streak, anyone who can stay focused like that for so many fights has to be given some credit.

My question to Calzaghe fans is, Floyd Mayweather retired right now, undefeated with a list of former champions and pound for pound guys on his resume, would you view him, at 39-0, better or worse than Joe, whose resume (even to his biggest supporters) pales in comparison, at 45-0?

Undefeated ain't everything.

[IMDAZED]

When it's vacated I guess it passes to the next unified champ. In this case, Virgil Hill. Roy fought for titles vacated by Dariusz, he never lost them.

I don't get it...

so Roy fought for vacated titles...then what did Virgil Hill do? Fight for vacated titles, right? LOL.

But let me break this down simple and clear for you.

After defeating Hill, Michalchewski was given THREE MONTHS to fight his mandatory. He refused and was stripped.

You following? Ok.

Now why would Michalchewski do that? Knowing that beating a simple mandatory allows him to hold THREE belts and Jones ONE?

Why?

Well you can start with Klaus Peter-Kohl, Michalchewski's promoter, who had a stranglehold on the German(?)-based WBO title. A hold that allowed them to choose whoever they felt like choosing for Dariusz to fight. The WBO asked for THEIR mandatory to be filled in 90 days as well. So guess which belt Dariusz decided to defend?

Second, the mandatory challenger was Lou Del Valle. No big deal right? Except, Del Valle was last seen outboxing Hill in Hill's home state of North Dakota. Even knocking Hill down. Yet lost a close decision (surprise, surprise).

So who do you choose if you're Dariusz? The dangerous Del Valle who arguably should have held the titles Hill held? Or NICKY PIPER, another nobody Kohl had lined up as a mandatory?

Jones went on to FIGHT Del Valle...EIGHTY-THREE days after he fought Hill. And intererestingly enough, Del Valle dropped him too!

Yet somehow...Dariusz is the lineal champ. Ok...

[Kris Silver]

Joe Calzaghe is broadly accepted as the SMW and LHW #1 in the world.

In polls on skill sets of speed, power, tactics, heart, footwork Roy came out better than Joe overall. I voted something like 3-1 or something in Roys favour, as did most.

So how is Roy anywhere near the shot fighter that's made out?

Joe is a damn quick puncher, like very quick. Roy is still faster. Yet ppl complain Roy's lost his speed. He's not lost his speed or shot, he's just not AS good as once immensely was.

I'm trying to be objective based on more than a couple of excuses of focuses, and am not doing it to big up a Joe win, don't be so predictable. I'm just not on the Roy is shot bandwagon and like to judge based on merit as I see it. Whilst I do give merit to Roys weight issues effecting him, I maintain there very exaggerated, he's fighting a different style that's working now, and although hasn't faced absolutely top level fighters, has never looked liked losing really.

I just criticise Roy more for his losses to Tarver x 2 and Johnson, over 2 and a half years, based on more than just weight, which is something many others don't and like to be a little more simplistic and dismissive about. I also compliment him more than most for his recent wins because as I said, I'm not on the Roy's shot bandwagon and I think he's showing some class in adapting, which he's never had to do much over time, whilst others have.

[ElGranLuchador]

calzaghe defeated racism he is the goat

[Drunk Punch]

LOL im British. Calzaghe aint an ATG. Roy is.
I dont see any way calzaghe CAn become an ATG now, you cant compare him to RJJ,SRL,SRR,FMJ and Ali. his undefeated record is overrated.

Just stating my opinion that most Americans know **** about Calzaghe. He only appeared on their radar after Lacy.

I totally agree about RJJ, a true legend. Calzaghe would get my vote for beating Eubank and then (as a relatively old man) clearing out the SMW division.

[IMDAZED]

Just stating my opinion that most Americans know **** about Calzaghe. He only appeared on their radar after Lacy.

I totally agree about RJJ, a true legend. Calzaghe would get my vote for beating Eubank and then (as a relatively old man) clearing out the SMW division.

Unfortunately, some of us Americans know PLENTY about Calzaghe. Before and after the overrated win over the overrated Lacy. What do you say to them?

[Cletus Funk]

Virgill Hill fought for vacant titles??

All that spiel and you couldn't even get your opening "fact" right........

I don't get it...

so Roy fought for vacated titles...then what did Virgil Hill do? Fight for vacated titles, right? LOL.

But let me break this down simple and clear for you.

After defeating Hill, Michalchewski was given THREE MONTHS to fight his mandatory. He refused and was stripped.

You following? Ok.

Now why would Michalchewski do that? Knowing that beating a simple mandatory allows him to hold THREE belts and Jones ONE?

Why?

Well you can start with Klaus Peter-Kohl, Michalchewski's promoter, who had a stranglehold on the German(?)-based WBO title. A hold that allowed them to choose whoever they felt like choosing for Dariusz to fight. The WBO asked for THEIR mandatory to be filled in 90 days as well. So guess which belt Dariusz decided to defend?

Second, the mandatory challenger was Lou Del Valle. No big deal right? Except, Del Valle was last seen outboxing Hill in Hill's home state of North Dakota. Even knocking Hill down. Yet lost a close decision (surprise, surprise).

So who do you choose if you're Dariusz? The dangerous Del Valle who arguably should have held the titles Hill held? Or NICKY PIPER, another nobody Kohl had lined up as a mandatory?

Jones went on to FIGHT Del Valle...EIGHTY-THREE days after he fought Hill. And intererestingly enough, Del Valle dropped him too!

Yet somehow...Dariusz is the lineal champ. Ok...