the scoring of Ali vs. Frazier I

[Brassangel]

I don't know... Joe Frazier is my all-time favorite fighter, and I still score it 8-6-1 for Ali. I've always felt that Ali won on points, though Frazier proved to be a warrior by bringing it to Ali late in the fight; this after he took the punishment he did.

It could have been such that the end of the fight went so well for Frazier, after taking a beating, that the judges felt Frazier would have eventually knocked Ali out. He did have Ali out on his feet in the 11th, but for points, Ali may have won. Joe Frazier showed more heart, and perhaps more stamina than Ali, that's for sure.

[LondonRingRules]

I don't know...

** That's right. Even Ali finally admitted he lost the fight.

[BoxingFan2]

At least I'm not the only one who thinks that Ali won on points. I don't mind that fight was given to Frazier because of those two big rounds 11 and 15 but if fight was scored like they do now days, who scored more punches and power punches per round to win round Ali would win fight. But if fight was scored with ten points must system then I have it even, because I would score those two rounds 10-8 for Frazier so fight which I scored 8-6-1 for Ali would get score 142-142 with Frazier being champion at that time he could still get close victory. Anyway, fight was much closer than it was scored. I still can't believe that Frazier won both 3rd and 4th rounds on all judges score cards. Watch those rounds again and score it yourself. It means that Frazier had a lead after 4 rounds by all judges and referee but he looked like he was way behind.

[-Antonio-]

I remember thinking Fraizer won clearly.

[BoxingFan2]

You thought that Frazier won clearly because usually those last rounds are better remembered than early rounds and Frazier won rounds 11 and 15 big. They were bigger than any rounds Ali won, but round is still just round if fight is scored on round basis. Another thing is that Ali was rarerly hit before this fight. Frazier continuosly hit Ali with his punches and this was enough to win him some rounds. He probably won rounds 3 and 4 just by hitting Ali with some powerfull hooks something nobody did to Ali before, but Ali hit Frazier at will in those two rounds and definitely controlled them but judges were impressed with Frazier's aggressive style and his power punches and gave rounds to him. If fighters were judged fair those rounds were Ali's. Imagine if you put Ali in Frazier's place and Frazier in Ali's. Imagine if Frazier hit Ali at will during whole round but Ali hit Frazier few times with his own power punches you would give round to Frazier, something like that happened in 6th and 8th round, and those were Frazier's rounds.

[Frazier's 15th round]

Frazier actually landed more significant punches in round 3 than Ali did. Plus they were much harder. Frazier showed very good defense in round 3. I agree about round 4 though. That was Ali's best round, even better than the 9th. I don't know what the judges saw.

Rounds 1, 2, 4, 5, 9, 14 to Ali.
Rounds 3, 6-8, 10-14, and 15 to Frazier.

144-139 Frazier.

Boxingfan2, you need to quit whining about the "bad scoring". The 3rd round was Frazier's. As was the 10th.

[The Noose]

You thought that Frazier won clearly because usually those last rounds are better remembered than early rounds and Frazier won rounds 11 and 15 big. They were bigger than any rounds Ali won, but round is still just round if fight is scored on round basis. Another thing is that Ali was rarerly hit before this fight. Frazier continuosly hit Ali with his punches and this was enough to win him some rounds. He probably won rounds 3 and 4 just by hitting Ali with some powerfull hooks something nobody did to Ali before, but Ali hit Frazier at will in those two rounds and definitely controlled them but judges were impressed with Frazier's aggressive style and his power punches and gave rounds to him. If fighters were judged fair those rounds were Ali's. Imagine if you put Ali in Frazier's place and Frazier in Ali's. Imagine if Frazier hit Ali at will during whole round but Ali hit Frazier few times with his own power punches you would give round to Frazier, something like that happened in 6th and 8th round, and those were Frazier's rounds.

Fighters are scored on not just the amount of punches landed, but also the quality or power in the punches, and how cleanly they landed. Also points are awarded for aggresion, and defence.

The fact that Ali was being caught very cleanly with huge left hooks throughout the fight and was being pushed back onto the ropes by Fraziers attackes. Plus he had to tie Frazier up alot of the time. All of this adds up to rounds being awarded to Frazier.

I dont believe for a second the judges were in any way unfair or biased, and look at the end of the fight. Ali knew he was beaten. Frazier knew he had won.

It was a close fight, and it is possible to score it for either fighter. But most people had it for Frazier. They scored it after each round fairly.
I had Frazier winning by a clear margin.

[Frazier's 15th round]

Fighters are scored on not just the amount of punches landed, but also the quality or power in the punches, and how cleanly they landed. Also points are awarded for aggresion, and defence.

The fact that Ali was being caught very cleanly with huge left hooks throughout the fight and was being pushed back onto the ropes by Fraziers attackes. Plus he had to tie Frazier up alot of the time. All of this adds up to rounds being awarded to Frazier.

I dont believe for a second the judges were in any way unfair or biased, and look at the end of the fight. Ali knew he was beaten. Frazier knew he had won.

It was a close fight, and it is possible to score it for either fighter. But most people had it for Frazier. They scored it after each round fairly.
I had Frazier winning by a clear margin.

Good post. Frazier showed sensational defense throughout the fight. Tons of Ali punches only grazed him. Just look at the 3rd round, which Boxingfan2 brought up as a "clear Ali round". Ali misses a lot and lands grazing punches. He also ties up Frazier a lot. Frazier pushes the fight, and nearly takes Ali's head off twice with two big hooks. He also lands some good body shots.

There is actually more of a case of the second fight being a robbery. I thought it was a draw. I think these same people who scored the first fight for Ali probably will say Ali took an easy decision the second time. And as far as biased judges, what do they have to say about the Manila judges? 8-4-2, 8-4-2, and 8-3-3 were the scorecards for fight 3.

[hemichromis]

what was the score for the second fight? i know ali officially won but personally i had frazier slightly ahead

[LondonRingRules]

And as far as biased judges, what do they have to say about the Manila judges? 8-4-2, 8-4-2, and 8-3-3 were the scorecards for fight 3.

** Which is ridiculous since Ali was ready to quit a couple of times in the fight and collapsed after the fight. Frazier got the better of Ali in 1 and 3 and never received as much credit as he should because of George Foreman and a short career due to congenital health problems which were exacerbated by his boxing career.